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    Croatia-England Pre-match, live and post-match comments

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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 11:58 am

    Might as well get this thread up and running now, with 3 days to go.

    Hopefully England can restore some pride after that shocking performance yesterday.

    I think everyone can more or less guess the line up:

    ----------------------Robinson--------------------
    Gary Neville-Ledley King-John Terry-Ash Cole
    -----------------Michael Carrick------------------
    Wright-Phillips-Frank Lampard-Stewart Downing
    ----------Wayne Rooney-Peter Crouch-----------

    I'd like to see Bridge instead of Cole though. Bridge has been awesome so far this season.
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    Post by Tom Sun Oct 08, 2006 11:59 am

    I'd like to see almost the entire squad swapped.
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    Post by L r d Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:00 pm

    Cole was good though. He will drop downing imo, pace on the break is importany away
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    Post by Parks lives Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:01 pm

    I'd like to see Parker instead of Lampard. We really need a dog of war in Croatia so it should be a straight choice between Lampard and Carrick and with Lampard out of scoring touch, there's nothing he can offer that Carrick can't.


    ----------------------Robinson--------------------
    Gary Neville-Ledley King-John Terry-Ash Cole
    --------Michael Carrick----Scott Parker----------
    Wright-Phillips--------------------Stewart Downing
    ----------Wayne Rooney-Peter Crouch-----------
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    Post by Parks lives Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:01 pm

    Ballack wrote:I'd like to see almost the entire squad swapped.

    ok
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    Post by Machiavel Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:01 pm

    Watch out for Luka Modric!
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    Post by Isco Benny Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:04 pm

    Need pace down the wings. SWP might give that -Gerrard cuts in too much, with 2 disciplined wingers it could make up fir Crouch's lack of pace and an underperforming Rooney.

    Even a draw in Croatia is would still leave England in charge. The result last night was disspointing but hardly the end of the World.

    The media are to blame for hyping up the 0-0 as a disaster just as badly as they hype up a win as proof of England World dominance - its not life and death, very early doors yet, as Mclaren has said: England are far from being a great side yet, even a 5-0 victory last night wouldnt have changed that fact. Its in 2 years time when it matters
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:15 pm

    Gerrard critical of ref

    England midfielder Steven Gerrard has revealed his frustration at Markus Merk after speaking to the referee about the booking he picked up against Macedonia.
    The yellow card in the 0-0 draw means Gerrard will miss Wednesday's Euro 2008 qualifier in Croatia and leaves England with a selection dilemma.

    "I was really disappointed with the referee's decision," said Gerrard, 26.

    "I told him I got the ball and he agreed with me but said the momentum took me into the player."

    Liverpool star Gerrard added: "England against Croatia is a great fixture.

    "As a player, you want to be involved in all the big games, so I'm going home really frustrated, not just with not getting three points but also with missing the Croatia game.

    "I will be cheering the boys on from home. Hopefully, they will turn in a good performance and get the result."

    I would not be surprised if he goes to Croatia and wins the game on his own for the country

    Steven Gerrard on Wayne Rooney

    Gerrard came closest to scoring for England but saw his 20-yard piledriver come thumping back off the crossbar.

    "I need a change of luck," he said.

    "I have already hit the woodwork four or five times this season.

    "I hit the shot well but maybe I hit it a little too well. Sometimes, you mis-hit them and they go in."

    England were criticised for a lacklustre display against Macedonia and manager Steve McClaren admitted his team lacked drive.

    Wayne Rooney was substituted after 74 minutes as his struggles to find his goalscoring touch were clearly apparent.

    However, Gerrard backed the Manchester United striker to come good in the tie against Croatia.

    "Wayne can handle all the pressure and he will come through this no problem," said Gerrard.


    Rooney is frustrated after coming off after an ineffective display

    "He was our best player in training all week and he is the best player in the country bar none.

    "I would not be surprised if he goes to Croatia and wins the game on his own for the country. That's how good Wayne is."

    Liverpool forward Peter Crouch also came out in support of Rooney and predicted that their England partnership would soon prosper.

    "I thought myself and Wayne worked well," he said. "I like playing with Wayne.

    "He is a top player. It is the first time in a game we have started together so I would definitely say there is more to come from us.

    "Was Wayne frustrated? He worked hard - as we all did - but you will have to ask Wayne whether he was frustrated.

    "We are just pleased to have him back and, come the next game, he will be firing again. You can't write him off at any stage and he will come good again.

    "It could take one goal to spark him. I don't think there will be a problem. He gives us so much, dropping deep and linking up play, so when he is not scoring he still adds a lot to the game."
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    Post by Tom Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:17 pm

    Oh shut up Steven. DOnt make a pathetic excuse. It was a foul and was a yellow.
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    Post by Parks lives Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:17 pm

    S4P wrote:

    "He was our best player in training all week and he is the best player in the country bar none.


    He knows. Cool
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    Post by What hype? Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:29 pm

    If parker plays in place of Lamps, that means alot will depend on Carrick to get forward and help in attack. Which, so far for England and Utd, i havent seen him do. Or for Spurs to be honest, as his goals record shows.

    I'd rather have an underperforming Lampard who will at least get into the position to score goals.

    And in Parker/King/P Neville, we have the closest player who plays like Hargreaves. And i do think that the times that Lamps and Hargreaves have played together, Lamps has done well to link up with the front two.

    And he also won't have Gerrard coming in field all the time like yesterday. Because it looks like we'll be playing two out and out wingers in Downing and SWP. So, in theory, Lamps will alot more freedom in the middle of the park.
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    Post by Parks lives Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:34 pm

    Lampard just takes up Rooney's space and thats fine when he's playing well and scoring but he's doing neither.

    At least Carrick can dictate the play from a deeper position and with someone like Parker/King/P Neville we have someone to go and win the ball as well.
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    Post by What hype? Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:57 pm

    I just think its a risk to give Carrick that role in a preety vital away game against Croatia.

    And its not just about giving the ball to the forwards, they have to be prepared to take shots, pick up the scraps from the edge of the box and generally link up play and get forward when we're on the attack.

    I havent seen Carrick do this as of yet. He probably can, but i'd rather not risk it against Croatia.
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    Post by Pierre Littbarski Sun Oct 08, 2006 1:19 pm

    Hmmm - a team who can't pass faced with a tough trip to Croatia in front of a hostile crowd.

    What you really need is a target man who is quick enough to get on to the aimless balls forward but also strong enough to shield it once he's there and take some pressure of the team.

    A player who has a proven track record of decent away performances against high-calibre opposition - eg Turkey, Germany, Roma, Barcelona and Chelsea.

    Its a shame we don't have a player like that.

    Oh hang on, we did have one but he was made a scapegoat for Euro '04 and was dropped to appease the tabloid-reading, base majority - despite the fact that he was one of our top 3 players in every away qualifier for that tournament. Rolling Eyes

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    Post by Puro Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:34 pm

    S4P wrote:Might as well get this thread up and running now, with 3 days to go.

    Hopefully England can restore some pride after that shocking performance yesterday.

    I think everyone can more or less guess the line up:

    ----------------------Robinson--------------------
    Gary Neville-Ledley King-John Terry-Ash Cole
    -----------------Michael Carrick------------------
    Wright-Phillips-Frank Lampard-Stewart Downing
    ----------Wayne Rooney-Peter Crouch-----------

    I'd like to see Bridge instead of Cole though. Bridge has been awesome so far this season.

    ----------------------Robinson--------------------
    Gary Neville-Ledley King-John Terry-Bridge
    ---------Michael Carrick---Parker---------------
    Wright-Phillips-----------------Stewart Downing
    ----------Defoe-----Bent/Heskey-----------

    You NEED to play with another DM against Croatia. Croatia's midfielders may still own the game even with Parker playing alongside Carrick.

    Told you all King is the best England central defender. He was told to play on short notice and wins MOTM easily. lol!

    It could get ugly for England at Croatia, but you never know. <Ale>
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    Post by OP9 Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:45 pm

    Well our defesne has been our only bright spot. We need to keep it the same

    So using Carrick to fill Hargreaves void?

    Good Idea maybe...


    Let hope Stevie sees things the same way
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    Post by Brian2468 Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:56 pm

    Puro never told me about King, I new.....Very Happy: Good team you picked concidering the the problems we have are outside the defence.
    Carrick needs some space. Him and Lampard do not work in a 4 man middle he is always looking to go forward to early and leaves Carrick no alternative for a short pass.Rolling Eyes With Parker he may not have what Hargreaves brings to the game but will fit in beside Carrick and create that little extra space required from the playemaker...ok
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    Post by DS Sun Oct 08, 2006 4:12 pm

    ---------------------Robinson--------------------

    ------Neville----------King-----------Terry-------Cole


    -------SWP-------Carrick---------Parker----Downing

    ----------------------Rooney/Lampard----------------

    ------------------------Crouch---------------------

    Thats the role I would play Lampard in or drop him.
    SWP and Downing will provide enough width.
    Carrick and Parker could be a good partnership , a deep lying playmaker and a hard tackler there.
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    Post by Brian2468 Sun Oct 08, 2006 4:23 pm

    Defensive minded team but it is more balanced than yesterdays group.........Sad we do not have any inform player to exchange for Rooney or Lampard...
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    Post by Owen Thomas Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:58 pm

    If only we could play Neville Ferdinand King Cole/Bridge Erm
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:59 pm

    King and Ferdinand are too similar to work well imo.
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    Post by L r d Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:00 pm

    At a guess:

    - - - - - - Robinson
    - - Neville - Terry - King
    SWP - Carrick - Parker - Cole
    - - - - - - - Lampard
    - - - - Rooney - Crouch
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    Post by Parks lives Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:02 pm

    S4P wrote:King and Ferdinand are too similar to work well imo.

    Bit like that Ferdinand and Woodgate partnership that was so great for Leeds.
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    Post by Owen Thomas Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:03 pm

    The thing is, King is one of England's best defenders and Ferdinand is always excellent (defensively) at major tournaments. I don't like how Terry is now undroppable.
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:04 pm

    Parks Lives wrote:
    S4P wrote:King and Ferdinand are too similar to work well imo.

    Bit like that Ferdinand and Woodgate partnership that was so great for Leeds.

    Ferdinand and Woodgate are different types of defenders. I'd pick Rio at the moment over King.
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:05 pm

    Owen Thomas wrote:The thing is, King is one of England's best defenders and Ferdinand is always excellent (defensively) at major tournaments. I don't like how Terry is now undroppable.

    Nobody said Terry is undroppable, but why would you drop him right now? Certainly Rio and Terry has proven an excellent partnership for England (in the same way as it was Campbell-Ferdinand before).
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    Post by Owen Thomas Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:09 pm

    S4P wrote:
    Owen Thomas wrote:The thing is, King is one of England's best defenders and Ferdinand is always excellent (defensively) at major tournaments. I don't like how Terry is now undroppable.

    Nobody said Terry is undroppable, but why would you drop him right now? Certainly Rio and Terry has proven an excellent partnership for England (in the same way as it was Campbell-Ferdinand before).

    Well, don't get me wrong, Terry has done nothing to merit getting dropped - but now that he is captain it won't happen no matter what his form is.

    Overall, I believe King and Ferdinand have more talent but they will never play together now that Terry is captain.

    Edit: Although King CAN play DM I suppose. Erm
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:15 pm

    Owen Thomas wrote:
    S4P wrote:
    Owen Thomas wrote:The thing is, King is one of England's best defenders and Ferdinand is always excellent (defensively) at major tournaments. I don't like how Terry is now undroppable.

    Nobody said Terry is undroppable, but why would you drop him right now? Certainly Rio and Terry has proven an excellent partnership for England (in the same way as it was Campbell-Ferdinand before).

    Well, don't get me wrong, Terry has done nothing to merit getting dropped - but now that he is captain it won't happen no matter what his form is.

    Overall, I believe King and Ferdinand have more talent but they will never play together now that Terry is captain.

    They have more natural talent undoubtedly, but certainly King is not as proven.

    Terry has played every game for an England team who have now conceded 2 goals in 10 or 11 games (1 of those was partly down to him though) but still, no matter what people may say (things such as "Oh, he sliced his clearance so he was shit today") he has rarely put a foot wrong. (That explains why England have conceded so few goals). Rio too, and like Terry he's played exceptionally well at the back, but has also helped the midfield on occassions too. Imo, it is King who must prove he can get in front of these 2.

    If Terry starts to play badly, then he has no god given right to expect to play (despite being captain). However until then, I'm very happy for the Terry-Rio partnership to continue if it means keeping clean sheet after clean sheet. Ale
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    Post by Owen Thomas Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:16 pm

    S4P wrote:
    Owen Thomas wrote:
    S4P wrote:
    Owen Thomas wrote:The thing is, King is one of England's best defenders and Ferdinand is always excellent (defensively) at major tournaments. I don't like how Terry is now undroppable.

    Nobody said Terry is undroppable, but why would you drop him right now? Certainly Rio and Terry has proven an excellent partnership for England (in the same way as it was Campbell-Ferdinand before).

    Well, don't get me wrong, Terry has done nothing to merit getting dropped - but now that he is captain it won't happen no matter what his form is.

    Overall, I believe King and Ferdinand have more talent but they will never play together now that Terry is captain.

    They have more natural talent undoubtedly, but certainly King is not as proven.

    Terry has played every game for an England team who have now conceded 2 goals in 10 or 11 games (1 of those was partly down to him though) but still, no matter what people may say (things such as "Oh, he sliced his clearance so he was shit today") he has rarely put a foot wrong. (That explains why England have conceded so few goals). Rio too, and like Terry he's played exceptionally well at the back, but has also helped the midfield on occassions too. Imo, it is King who must prove he can get in front of these 2.

    If Terry starts to play badly, then he has no god given right to expect to play (despite being captain). However until then, I'm very happy for the Terry-Rio partnership to continue if it means keeping clean sheet after clean sheet. Ale

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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:38 pm

    If you wanted a King-Rio-Terry partnership, I wouldn't mind seeing England go 3 at the back (certainly when the likes of Neville retire). But you could always play it with 2 wing backs:

    ----------------Robinson--------------
    ---------King---Terry---Rio-----------
    Neville-------------------------Bridge
    ---------------Hargreaves-------------
    ---------Gerrard---Joe Cole-----------
    ----------Rooney---Johnson*-----------

    I just went for Johnson because I'd like him to be tried. But you could use Ashton, Bent, Crouch or Defoe quite easily.

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