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I say yes.
+10
lih88
Kimbo
bluenine
Antarion
debaser
Kroos
L r dd
Ricardo Jol
Glenarch of the Glen
Calidad
14 posters
Argentina - Will they or won't they?
Poll
Will they make WC 2010?
- [ 13 ]
[52%]
- [ 5 ]
- [20%]
- [ 7 ]
- [28%]
Total Votes: 25
Calidad- Number of posts : 7996
Age : 37
Supports : Hibernian FC
Registration date : 2006-08-25
I say yes.
Glenarch of the Glen- Number of posts : 30157
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Registration date : 2006-08-06
if they don't finish in the qualification places they'll be in a play-off against Costa Rica or Honduras
so, er
Yes?
so, er
Yes?
Ricardo Jol- Number of posts : 12766
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yes... How the hell can they not..? the playoffs are a farce too... South American qualies are sooooooooo tad easy!
Calidad- Number of posts : 7996
Age : 37
Supports : Hibernian FC
Registration date : 2006-08-25
I don't think they are easy, and I'd hazard a guess that the European nations would struggle if they were placed in the South American qualifiers. It is a lengthy and gruelling campaign played in a multitude of different environments all invariably with hostile atmospheres.
I already think it's a shame that a nation like Uruguay will not be in the WC with players like Suarez, Forlan, Gargano, Rodriguez, Cavani, will not be at the WC. Columbia for all their problems have some talented players too who will be missing out.
I already think it's a shame that a nation like Uruguay will not be in the WC with players like Suarez, Forlan, Gargano, Rodriguez, Cavani, will not be at the WC. Columbia for all their problems have some talented players too who will be missing out.
L r dd- Number of posts : 12451
Age : 37
Registration date : 2008-12-22
What a load of bollocks it's the top 5 teams out of 10 and Peru don't seem to want to ever try and qualify so 5 from 9 isnt easy?
I'm sure good european teams and players will be missing out too so what.
Argentina probably will qualify but i hope not. People need a reality check on their overated asses. And to Glenn they could finish 6th and miss out that way
. Here's hoping Peru pull off the biggest upset and leave them needing victory in Uruguay.
I'm sure good european teams and players will be missing out too so what.
Argentina probably will qualify but i hope not. People need a reality check on their overated asses. And to Glenn they could finish 6th and miss out that way
. Here's hoping Peru pull off the biggest upset and leave them needing victory in Uruguay.
Kroos- Number of posts : 9049
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i dont care, they are no danger for us
debaser- Number of posts : 22064
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Calidad wrote:I don't think they are easy, and I'd hazard a guess that the European nations would struggle if they were placed in the South American qualifiers. It is a lengthy and gruelling campaign played in a multitude of different environments all invariably with hostile atmospheres.
I already think it's a shame that a nation like Uruguay will not be in the WC with players like Suarez, Forlan, Gargano, Rodriguez, Cavani, will not be at the WC. Columbia for all their problems have some talented players too who will be missing out.
Surely difficult away games = easy home games. It can't be hostile for both teams can it?!
It is a long campaign & lots of travel, esp for those based in Europe. But 50% qualify, which is far better than anywhere else.
Glenarch of the Glen- Number of posts : 30157
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you more or less only have to win your home games to qualify. Put Portugal in that group they would already be through, in Europe they're struggling to make the play-offs.
Plenty of great teams and players miss out on big tournaments, better men than Forlan and co have and will miss out.
Plenty of great teams and players miss out on big tournaments, better men than Forlan and co have and will miss out.
Antarion- Number of posts : 3382
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If they dont qualify, there will be no world champion next year.
No european team has won a WC outside of europe, no confed cup winner has won the WC thereafter, that leaves Argentina to the big 4 theory.
theories
No european team has won a WC outside of europe, no confed cup winner has won the WC thereafter, that leaves Argentina to the big 4 theory.
theories
Ricardo Jol- Number of posts : 12766
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Antarion wrote:If they dont qualify, there will be no world champion next year.
No european team has won a WC outside of europe, no confed cup winner has won the WC thereafter, that leaves Argentina to the big 4 theory.
theories
conclusion: England can win it this time!
bluenine- Number of posts : 22998
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I really hope Argentina qualify - the world cup will be poorer without them in it. For me, there are 4-5 nations that must be there to add the significance/atmosphere at the World Cup. The usual suspect are Brasil, Italy, Germany and Argentina. Plus the team of the moment, which this time happens to be Spain.
The WC will lose some of its shine if any of these 5 nations don't make it. They define the WC for me.
The WC will lose some of its shine if any of these 5 nations don't make it. They define the WC for me.
Calidad- Number of posts : 7996
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Registration date : 2006-08-25
Jay Glenno wrote:you more or less only have to win your home games to qualify. Put Portugal in that group they would already be through, in Europe they're struggling to make the play-offs.
Plenty of great teams and players miss out on big tournaments, better men than Forlan and co have and will miss out.
It was only a friendly, but when Portugal went over to play Brazil they got hammered like 6-1 or something.
Obviously I can't back it up with fact, but I just think the European nations would get a big shock in WC qualifiers in South America if they thought they were in for an easy ride. WC2002, Brazil were in a similar situation to Argentina now, just about qualified and the rest is history for that WC.
Like I say, South America doesn't have it's San Marinos, Luembourgs et al, even 'weaker' nations like Venezuela and Boliva are now fairly tough opponents.
Kimbo- Number of posts : 38171
Registration date : 2006-08-06
If they don't qualify then they aren't good enough and we won't miss them. I said the same when England failed to qualify for the euro's. So basically, i don't give a shit.
L r dd- Number of posts : 12451
Age : 37
Registration date : 2008-12-22
bluenine wrote:I really hope Argentina qualify - the world cup will be poorer without them in it. For me, there are 4-5 nations that must be there to add the significance/atmosphere at the World Cup. The usual suspect are Brasil, Italy, Germany and Argentina. Plus the team of the moment, which this time happens to be Spain.
The WC will lose some of its shine if any of these 5 nations don't make it. They define the WC for me.
Yeah but not for a lot of people.
I only share your sentiment with Germany and Brazil.
Ricardo Jol- Number of posts : 12766
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Calidad wrote:Jay Glenno wrote:you more or less only have to win your home games to qualify. Put Portugal in that group they would already be through, in Europe they're struggling to make the play-offs.
Plenty of great teams and players miss out on big tournaments, better men than Forlan and co have and will miss out.
It was only a friendly, but when Portugal went over to play Brazil they got hammered like 6-1 or something.
Obviously I can't back it up with fact, but I just think the European nations would get a big shock in WC qualifiers in South America if they thought they were in for an easy ride. WC2002, Brazil were in a similar situation to Argentina now, just about qualified and the rest is history for that WC.
Like I say, South America doesn't have it's San Marinos, Luembourgs et al, even 'weaker' nations like Venezuela and Boliva are now fairly tough opponents.
But weaker nations are irrelevant. when you have two or three strong nations in your group you can be fucked! In South America you don't have that element in it!
Germany for instance can lose against Russia so they have to play play-offs to let say France or Portugal. There is a possibility they lose the play-offs so they are not present at the WC while they had a superb qualifying campaign... (well almost superb then...)
Calidad- Number of posts : 7996
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Registration date : 2006-08-25
Ricardo Wetzel wrote:Calidad wrote:Jay Glenno wrote:you more or less only have to win your home games to qualify. Put Portugal in that group they would already be through, in Europe they're struggling to make the play-offs.
Plenty of great teams and players miss out on big tournaments, better men than Forlan and co have and will miss out.
It was only a friendly, but when Portugal went over to play Brazil they got hammered like 6-1 or something.
Obviously I can't back it up with fact, but I just think the European nations would get a big shock in WC qualifiers in South America if they thought they were in for an easy ride. WC2002, Brazil were in a similar situation to Argentina now, just about qualified and the rest is history for that WC.
Like I say, South America doesn't have it's San Marinos, Luembourgs et al, even 'weaker' nations like Venezuela and Boliva are now fairly tough opponents.
But weaker nations are irrelevant. when you have two or three strong nations in your group you can be fucked! In South America you don't have that element in it!
Germany for instance can lose against Russia so they have to play play-offs to let say France or Portugal. There is a possibility they lose the play-offs so they are not present at the WC while they had a superb qualifying campaign... (well almost superb then...)
But generally the stronger nations in Europe all expect to qualify in first place their groups. Portugal will be missing out because they've fucked up, not because Denmark/Sweden/Hungary are particularly that strong. Russia are decent, but were overhyped by the English press after beating England (much like Croatia) - i.e Germany are stronger. Netherlands walked their qualification group.
The only groups which were ever going to prove difficult for the top nations (even in good form) were Serbia for France, who for me are actually a very good side, and Bosnia/Belgium/Turkey in Spain's group, but currently Spain have a 100% record.
The playoff system can obviosuly be difficult, but it's generally a result of the top nations underperforming, rather than the overall difficulty of their qualification groups. And even then which genuine top nations look like they're actually going to be in the qualifiers? Only France and maybe Portugal, the others look to have pretty much already secured a first spot berth.
Antarion- Number of posts : 3382
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Its still a fact that if we lose in russia, we lost one game total and still have to face play offs, which can be mental. Whereas in SA you can qualify with 6 losses.
I agree that there are no rubbish teams in SA, especially away matches are tough, but it still doesnt feel that hard for a good nation to make it with 50% of the teams qualifying.
If you are in a group like portugal, england or spain this year and only one team qualifies...thats ugly.
I agree that there are no rubbish teams in SA, especially away matches are tough, but it still doesnt feel that hard for a good nation to make it with 50% of the teams qualifying.
If you are in a group like portugal, england or spain this year and only one team qualifies...thats ugly.
Calidad- Number of posts : 7996
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Antarion wrote:Its still a fact that if we lose in russia, we lost one game total and still have to face play offs, which can be mental. Whereas in SA you can qualify with 6 losses.
I agree that there are no rubbish teams in SA, especially away matches are tough, but it still doesnt feel that hard for a good nation to make it with 50% of the teams qualifying.
If you are in a group like portugal, england or spain this year and only one team qualifies...thats ugly.
It also means Russia haven't been dropping points to anyone else in the group, so it clearly isn't all that competitive. All the nations in South America take points off each other.
I do understand the criticism of the 50% qualification, but I think it's just a recognisation of the quality of the sides that compete.
bluenine- Number of posts : 22998
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Calidad wrote:Antarion wrote:Its still a fact that if we lose in russia, we lost one game total and still have to face play offs, which can be mental. Whereas in SA you can qualify with 6 losses.
I agree that there are no rubbish teams in SA, especially away matches are tough, but it still doesnt feel that hard for a good nation to make it with 50% of the teams qualifying.
If you are in a group like portugal, england or spain this year and only one team qualifies...thats ugly.
It also means Russia haven't been dropping points to anyone else in the group, so it clearly isn't all that competitive. All the nations in South America take points off each other.
I do understand the criticism of the 50% qualification, but I think it's just a recognisation of the quality of the sides that compete.
Why do EPL get 4 sides qualifying for CL, while some national leagues only get 1 or 2?? Its an extension of similar logic... I don't see anything wrong with it. Its not perfect, but its a good system. If anything, I think its UEFA who have their qualifying format wrong.... they should have a pre-qualifier, and get only the top 20-25 nations playing in their main qualifiers... then you will also have 40-50% of the teams qualifying, the level of competition will be much higher, etc.
lih88- Number of posts : 23
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With Maradona - never
SuperMario- Number of posts : 16866
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Hope they will, but on the other hand would love those marketeers to have a Messi & Ronaldo less WC.
Ricardo Jol- Number of posts : 12766
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You can say the same thing what you said about portugal for argentina.Calidad wrote:Ricardo Wetzel wrote:Calidad wrote:Jay Glenno wrote:you more or less only have to win your home games to qualify. Put Portugal in that group they would already be through, in Europe they're struggling to make the play-offs.
Plenty of great teams and players miss out on big tournaments, better men than Forlan and co have and will miss out.
It was only a friendly, but when Portugal went over to play Brazil they got hammered like 6-1 or something.
Obviously I can't back it up with fact, but I just think the European nations would get a big shock in WC qualifiers in South America if they thought they were in for an easy ride. WC2002, Brazil were in a similar situation to Argentina now, just about qualified and the rest is history for that WC.
Like I say, South America doesn't have it's San Marinos, Luembourgs et al, even 'weaker' nations like Venezuela and Boliva are now fairly tough opponents.
But weaker nations are irrelevant. when you have two or three strong nations in your group you can be fucked! In South America you don't have that element in it!
Germany for instance can lose against Russia so they have to play play-offs to let say France or Portugal. There is a possibility they lose the play-offs so they are not present at the WC while they had a superb qualifying campaign... (well almost superb then...)
But generally the stronger nations in Europe all expect to qualify in first place their groups. Portugal will be missing out because they've fucked up, not because Denmark/Sweden/Hungary are particularly that strong. Russia are decent, but were overhyped by the English press after beating England (much like Croatia) - i.e Germany are stronger. Netherlands walked their qualification group.
The only groups which were ever going to prove difficult for the top nations (even in good form) were Serbia for France, who for me are actually a very good side, and Bosnia/Belgium/Turkey in Spain's group, but currently Spain have a 100% record.
The playoff system can obviosuly be difficult, but it's generally a result of the top nations underperforming, rather than the overall difficulty of their qualification groups. And even then which genuine top nations look like they're actually going to be in the qualifiers? Only France and maybe Portugal, the others look to have pretty much already secured a first spot berth.
Argentina fucked their campaign not because the other nations are that strong and still they'll qualify. While portugal is still vey insecure.
Also, 6 a 7 out of 8 european nations always play a qf of the wc .
Belgium and turkey both once reached the sf of wc so they are small countries.
Its unique that many european countries now won all their games. Only twice france, czechia and west-germnay did that in the past.
lampiao007- Number of posts : 1164
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Portugal fucked up, because we have a clueless manager. You can apply the same to Argentina. A team that draws at home with Albania and only manages a 2-1 win against the same team away on the 93rd minute of a game, because of ridiculous decisions on players placement (Pepe as DM, Guga, and a few more) deserves not to go anywhere.
Even if we trash Hungary and Malta, we may not make it
Even if we trash Hungary and Malta, we may not make it
Khadrim- Number of posts : 1719
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In defence of Maradona, He has lost to two altitude games ( and Ecuador's Goalkeeper should've been sent off), away to Paraguay and Brazil.
The reason Argentina are in trouble are the results under Basile. Drawing to Peru, and at home to Paraguay, Ecuador, as well as losing away to Colombia.
I agree he isn't a good manager but in the way he panics during the game and constantly makes changes. He should get Roy Hodgson as an advisor (never makes subs) . I am not convinced by the argument of he picks poor players is enough of a flaw. Every team has players that supporters cannot understand the inclusion of. Otherwise I just think he has been unlucky.
The reason Argentina are in trouble are the results under Basile. Drawing to Peru, and at home to Paraguay, Ecuador, as well as losing away to Colombia.
I agree he isn't a good manager but in the way he panics during the game and constantly makes changes. He should get Roy Hodgson as an advisor (never makes subs) . I am not convinced by the argument of he picks poor players is enough of a flaw. Every team has players that supporters cannot understand the inclusion of. Otherwise I just think he has been unlucky.
Axeslammer- Number of posts : 19690
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lampiao007 wrote:Portugal fucked up, because we have a clueless manager. You can apply the same to Argentina.
That means France and Holland must be *really* talented
They have even worse managers than Argentina & Portugal do
Khadrim- Number of posts : 1719
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Axeslammer wrote:lampiao007 wrote:Portugal fucked up, because we have a clueless manager. You can apply the same to Argentina.
That means France and Holland must be *really* talented
They have even worse managers than Argentina & Portugal do
I think France are lucky that Romania are also having a shocking time. Othrewise it would be much more of a stuggle
bluenine- Number of posts : 22998
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Argentina vs Uruguay is going to be an amazing game!!! I hope Equador lose, coz I want both of these sides to go through to the WC!!
Here are Argentina's possibilities for the final round of World Cup qualifying:
-If Argentina win, they will qualify for the World Cup
-If Argentina draw and Ecuador don't win by five goals, Argentina will qualify for the World Cup
-If Argentina draw and Ecuador win 5-0, Argentina enter the playoff
-If Argentina lose and Ecuador don't win, Argentina enter the playoff
-If Argentina lose and Ecuador win, Argentina will be eliminated from the World Cup.
L r dd- Number of posts : 12451
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After the luck last night. It's only fair Ecuador and Uruguay progress.
Antarion- Number of posts : 3382
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Can't see Ecuador winning in Chile unless Chile do an England.
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