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    Italy v England: Cristiano Ronaldo v Zlatan Ibrahimovic

    Super Progress
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    Post by Super Progress Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:29 pm

    Italy v England: Cristiano Ronaldo v Zlatan Ibrahimovic - Who Is The Best?
    Two footballers celebrated and despised in equal measure will face off next week on the grand stage of the Champions League - will the best man win?

    Everybody expected UEFA to wave their magic wand and pit Manchester United against Real Madrid in the second round of the Champions League. The battle of Cristiano Ronaldo, the battle of the biggest clubs in the world, Sir Alex Ferguson against 'the Mob', and so on. It actually came as a surprise when the Spanish superpower were instead drawn against United's rivals Liverpool, leaving the reigning champions to face off against Inter in a tie with almost as many provocative permutations and potential for high drama before, during and after the tie. The football might be good, too - but I wouldn't bet on it.

    Jose Mourinho, aided and abetted by Roman Abramovich, made the Premier League so fiercely competitive that almost all top-of-the-table clashes became fast-paced but slow-moving wars of attrition. Such a pragmatic approach is bound to translate well to a game like this, with his Inter side lacking in bonafide match-winners but nevertheless a colossal unit, up against a United outfit that has primed itself on constantly applying measured pressure and biding time before making that inevitable breakthrough.

    While United have more flair to their front line, there is nevertheless a degree of reliance from both clubs on their star players to provide the magic that makes the difference every week. The game has already been billed not just as Sir Alex against the 'Special One', but also Cristiano Ronaldo against Zlatan Ibrahimovic.

    It has the makings of a heavyweight title fight in itself. In the Blue corner, there is the tactical and indomitable Evander Holyfield of the piece up against the Red corner's relentless and destructive Mike Tyson, only perhaps slightly less insane.

    The X-factor in this instance will be Jose Mourinho, doing his best Don King impersonation to try and see his special one over the line before the games even begin. It was the Portuguese coach who asserted to begin with, soon after the draw, that Ibra was superior to World Player of the Year Ronaldo, while Sir Alex has long lauded his No. 7 as the world's best player and even gone as far as to mention him in the same breath as Pele and Diego Maradona.

    Jose and Sir Alex are rightly considered the two best managers in the world - certainly at club level - but it is their head-to-head record that will serve to boost Ibra's confidence. During Jose's time in charge of Chelsea, Fergie may have landed the last punch with his 2007 Premier League triumph, but there can be no doubting who won the fight on points.

    However, with the teams pitted against each other, it is clear that the Red corner has more cause for confidence. Both sides top their respective leagues and are reigning champions, but United have been more convincing and prolific, not to mention their previous highs in Europe contrasted by the Nerazzuri's string of premature exits.

    The delicate balance could end up being tipped one way or the other by the players themselves over the course of the two legs. Both are supposedly big-game flops, but Ronaldo's track-record inspires more confidence than Ibra's, if for no other reason than last season's Champions League final. Yes, he did miss a penalty, but so have the likes of Roberto Baggio for Italy, Steven Gerrard for England and Andriy Shevchenko for AC Milan in years gone by - what does that make them?

    The two of them would struggle to differ more in style of play, but are certainly comparable in terms of their cult status, polarising of public opinion and attitude towards the game itself. Despite being three years Zlatan's junior, Cristiano has always applied himself in such a way as to consistently produce results. For all his posturing, Ronaldo has in many ways been a model professional and an advocate of the dictum that practice really can make perfect.

    Ibra, meanwhile, still seems to play on his own terms. Not even Fabio Capello quite managed to wrap his head around the mercurial Swede's weird and wonderful ways - he didn't quite hit top gear. But now, he's playing for Mourinho. We saw it with Chelsea and we are now seeing it with Inter: misfits such as Adriano and Ibrahimovic high-fiving their boss after every goal, his racing down the touchline to celebrate the late winners - the Jose effect.

    Nevertheless, it will be Ronaldo who saunters down to the ring next week with the Premier League and Champions League on each shoulder, wearing the Club World Cup as a crown and with the FIFA World Player of the Year and Ballon d'Or round his waist. He is the man: everything he has done, he has done to better effect than Ibrahimovic - but the time is right for change.

    Ronaldo's downfall has already been scripted; it is prematurely being claimed that the 24-year-old's time at the top is coming to an end, for no other reason than his 'failure' to replicate what was a freak 42-goal season. Having said that, there is a wind of change sweeping over world football and Ibra could yet rally against Ronaldo and emerge the unlikely victor, finally realising his potential and beginning a new era of his own as the King of the Continent. Unlikely, maybe - but they don't call him 'Ibracadabra' for no reason, and even neutrals out there might be hoping that for once, this magician doesn't flatter to deceive.

    Sulmaan Ahmad, Goal.com
    With Mourinho and Ferguson on the benches this will no doubt be a thigh defensive affair which will likely need a touch of genius. Ibra is in the hands of Vidic+Ferdinand while Ronaldo is going to taken care off by Chivu and perhaps Muntari.From those matchupes Ronaldo should do better, especially since Ibra is the main danger in terms of creativity in Inters team while Man Utd have Rooney+Scholes/Carrick to do that.
    Both have rarely if ever impressed in big games but they could provide goalscoring.

    Again Ronaldo is the most likely to succed since Inters defence will prob consist of Cordoba+Samuel which isn't that tall compard to Vidic+Ferdinand. So while neither will prob play that well Ronaldo will prob have more of an influence on the game of the two. What do you guys think?
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    Post by Pras_tama Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:33 pm

    I'm totally 100% agree with you
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    Post by Machiavel Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:36 pm

    Don’t expect anything from Ronaldo, If SAF goes pragmatic – Ronaldo will not be effective. Zlatan has more of a chance of doing something.
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    Post by DS Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:37 pm

    Not as simple as that, Inter can deploy several of their players to nullify his threat, like you said Muntari etc etc.

    Same with us, Fletch perhaps as Hargreaves is injured and we dont have any other specialist DM.

    It will depend on how teams will lineup, what will be the strategy etc etc.
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    Post by Super Progress Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:47 pm

    I would argue that Ibras biggest quality is to create for others. As such he will be operating in the room between defence and midfield which is rarely an easy thing. He will be able to roam around more then Ronaldo since Ronaldo nowadays plays more on the wings then he did last year.
    Of course one can't simply see it on a individual bases because if Ibra is to create then he would need others to do the running and if Ronaldo is going to score goals,his big quality, he will need the assistence.

    By cutting of Ibra Man Utd will have pretty much taken care of the creativity. Inter will need to cut the service to Ronaldo. I think that will be the harder job.
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    Post by Kimbo Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:49 pm

    I fully expect Ibra to do his usual CL disappearing act.
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    Post by Jaime Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:50 pm

    Is it the same guy who keeps writing all of these EPL v Serie A articles for goal.com?

    Crazy
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    Post by DS Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:51 pm

    Probably because all have the same type of flavour.
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    Post by Pras_tama Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:51 pm

    Super Madrid wrote:I would argue that Ibras biggest quality is to create for others. As such he will be operating in the room between defence and midfield which is rarely an easy thing. He will be able to roam around more then Ronaldo since Ronaldo nowadays plays more on the wings then he did last year.
    Of course one can't simply see it on a individual bases because if Ibra is to create then he would need others to do the running and if Ronaldo is going to score goals,his big quality, he will need the assistence.

    By cutting of Ibra Man Utd will have pretty much taken care of the creativity. Inter will need to cut the service to Ronaldo. I think that will be the harder job.


    Again, I agree with you
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    Post by Calidad Fri Feb 20, 2009 5:25 pm

    If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
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    Post by bluenine Fri Feb 20, 2009 6:51 pm

    Super Madrid wrote:With Mourinho and Ferguson on the benches this will no doubt be a thigh defensive affair which will likely need a touch of genius. Ibra is in the hands of Vidic+Ferdinand while Ronaldo is going to taken care off by Chivu and perhaps Muntari.From those matchupes Ronaldo should do better, especially since Ibra is the main danger in terms of creativity in Inters team while Man Utd have Rooney+Scholes/Carrick to do that.
    Both have rarely if ever impressed in big games but they could provide goalscoring.

    Again Ronaldo is the most likely to succed since Inters defence will prob consist of Cordoba+Samuel which isn't that tall compard to Vidic+Ferdinand. So while neither will prob play that well Ronaldo will prob have more of an influence on the game of the two. What do you guys think?

    I thought I wrote a post here, but it must have not uploaded.

    What I wanted to say, SM, is that its not just Ibra... IMO the key danger man is Adriano. He is rediscovering his form, and he can be much more lethal in big games than Ibra. And in the first leg, its Ibra+Adriano vs Rio+Evans...

    As for the article, Mr Sulman Ahmad obviously does not watch much Serie A but from his article it looks like he doesn't read much about it... "Mou made Ibra hit top gear", thats just laughable. Ibra hit top gear under Mancini, and now is only continuing on that form under Mou.
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    Post by bluenine Fri Feb 20, 2009 6:53 pm

    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.

    Thats not a big IF.... Adriano usually works for the team. But there is a IF involved which is whether Adriano continues to improve on his form - I will give you that much.
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    Post by Super Progress Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:16 pm

    bluenine wrote:
    Super Madrid wrote:With Mourinho and Ferguson on the benches this will no doubt be a thigh defensive affair which will likely need a touch of genius. Ibra is in the hands of Vidic+Ferdinand while Ronaldo is going to taken care off by Chivu and perhaps Muntari.From those matchupes Ronaldo should do better, especially since Ibra is the main danger in terms of creativity in Inters team while Man Utd have Rooney+Scholes/Carrick to do that.
    Both have rarely if ever impressed in big games but they could provide goalscoring.

    Again Ronaldo is the most likely to succed since Inters defence will prob consist of Cordoba+Samuel which isn't that tall compard to Vidic+Ferdinand. So while neither will prob play that well Ronaldo will prob have more of an influence on the game of the two. What do you guys think?

    I thought I wrote a post here, but it must have not uploaded.

    What I wanted to say, SM, is that its not just Ibra... IMO the key danger man is Adriano. He is rediscovering his form, and he can be much more lethal in big games than Ibra. And in the first leg, its Ibra+Adriano vs Rio+Evans...

    As for the article, Mr Sulman Ahmad obviously does not watch much Serie A but from his article it looks like he doesn't read much about it... "Mou made Ibra hit top gear", thats just laughable. Ibra hit top gear under Mancini, and now is only continuing on that form under Mou.
    So basically what you are saying is that football doesn't just center around the individual match ups of stars from both teams. Shocked
    Yeah I know these comparisons are useless if you look purely from a individuel basis because despite what it is made to be some times football is more then ever a collective sport.

    Allthough it is more interesting to set the stars up against each other but you entirely correct that it isn't just Ibrahimovic. For example last year Ibra was working with the useless Cruz(at least in that game). Adriano could help out alot but I don't think he is as close to his form as you suggest. He isn't really explosive but there was some small sparks at times. In retroperspective Adriano could have really needed those games where he was banned.
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    Post by Pierre Littbarski Fri Feb 20, 2009 8:57 pm

    Inter are a team that create from the front (like Capello's Juve) - could cause United lots of problems.

    They knock it into Ibra and let him make something happen when he is far from goal and has 8 team mates between him and his GK rather than get a CM to create - he is nearer goal and may only have a couple of players between him and GK if he gets dispossesed.

    Inter's midfield may outwork United's - Muntari is essential.
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    Post by EM Seleção e Selecção Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:05 pm

    Sedecim wrote:Don’t expect anything from Ronaldo, If SAF goes pragmatic – Ronaldo will not be effective. Zlatan has more of a chance of doing something.
    Is this game live? or just available on youtube?
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    Post by EM Seleção e Selecção Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:06 pm

    Kimbo wrote:I fully expect Ibra to do his usual CL disappearing act.
    <Ale> <Ale> <Ale> <Ale>
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    Post by EM Seleção e Selecção Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:07 pm

    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.
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    Post by Pierre Littbarski Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:09 pm

    We've all heard of the biter being bit but I can see the rapist being raped in the San Siro Twisted Evil
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    Post by EM Seleção e Selecção Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:11 pm

    Pierre Littbarski wrote:We've all heard of the biter being bit but I can see the rapist being raped in the San Siro Twisted Evil
    Who?
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    Post by Pierre Littbarski Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:17 pm

    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Pierre Littbarski wrote:We've all heard of the biter being bit but I can see the rapist being raped in the San Siro Twisted Evil
    Who?

    Italy v England: Cristiano Ronaldo v Zlatan Ibrahimovic SNN2209X_408478a
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    Post by EM Seleção e Selecção Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:21 pm

    Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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    Post by bluenine Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:45 pm

    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.

    EMP, I wrote the same thing, but I guess our reasons are completely different... I don't think its coz Ibra will not perform, but its coz of Ibra that Adriano will do well... even if Ibra does not create too many chances, just his presence will create space for Adriano to exploit. And hopefully vice versa....
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    Post by EM Seleção e Selecção Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:55 pm

    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.

    EMP, I wrote the same thing, but I guess our reasons are completely different... I don't think its coz Ibra will not perform, but its coz of Ibra that Adriano will do well... even if Ibra does not create too many chances, just his presence will create space for Adriano to exploit. And hopefully vice versa....
    Blue I really want Zlatan to show up(Since 2003 I been telling my friends this guy will become number in the world one day but seriously how can he when he never ever turns up in the big games? especially the ones which are televised). Adriano looked sharp I really think he will trouble The Manchester United big time in the first leg.
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    Post by bluenine Sat Feb 21, 2009 3:57 am

    EMPortuguese wrote:
    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.

    EMP, I wrote the same thing, but I guess our reasons are completely different... I don't think its coz Ibra will not perform, but its coz of Ibra that Adriano will do well... even if Ibra does not create too many chances, just his presence will create space for Adriano to exploit. And hopefully vice versa....
    Blue I really want Zlatan to show up(Since 2003 I been telling my friends this guy will become number in the world one day but seriously how can he when he never ever turns up in the big games? especially the ones which are televised). Adriano looked sharp I really think he will trouble The Manchester United big time in the first leg.

    Maybe this is his time.... Wink

    But the partnership between Ibra and Adriano (if the latter continues to perform) will help both of them... coz either of them has the capability/threat to take two defenders with him everytime he moves to attack.... so the other will find space.
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    Post by bluenine Sat Feb 21, 2009 3:57 am

    EMPortuguese wrote:
    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.

    EMP, I wrote the same thing, but I guess our reasons are completely different... I don't think its coz Ibra will not perform, but its coz of Ibra that Adriano will do well... even if Ibra does not create too many chances, just his presence will create space for Adriano to exploit. And hopefully vice versa....
    Blue I really want Zlatan to show up(Since 2003 I been telling my friends this guy will become number in the world one day but seriously how can he when he never ever turns up in the big games? especially the ones which are televised). Adriano looked sharp I really think he will trouble The Manchester United big time in the first leg.

    Maybe this is his time.... Wink

    But the partnership between Ibra and Adriano (if the latter continues to perform) will help both of them... coz either of them has the capability/threat to take two defenders with him everytime he moves to attack.... so the other will find space.
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    Post by Pras_tama Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:21 am

    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.

    EMP, I wrote the same thing, but I guess our reasons are completely different... I don't think its coz Ibra will not perform, but its coz of Ibra that Adriano will do well... even if Ibra does not create too many chances, just his presence will create space for Adriano to exploit. And hopefully vice versa....
    Blue I really want Zlatan to show up(Since 2003 I been telling my friends this guy will become number in the world one day but seriously how can he when he never ever turns up in the big games? especially the ones which are televised). Adriano looked sharp I really think he will trouble The Manchester United big time in the first leg.

    Maybe this is his time.... Wink

    But the partnership between Ibra and Adriano (if the latter continues to perform) will help both of them... coz either of them has the capability/threat to take two defenders with him everytime he moves to attack.... so the other will find space.


    This is Europe not Serie A, it won't be that easy
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    Post by bluenine Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:30 am

    Pras Gallagher wrote:
    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    bluenine wrote:
    EMPortuguese wrote:
    Calidad wrote:If Adriano works for the side, he could create the space needed for Ibra to work his magic. That is a big if though.
    Adriano will be a much bigger threat than Zlatan.

    EMP, I wrote the same thing, but I guess our reasons are completely different... I don't think its coz Ibra will not perform, but its coz of Ibra that Adriano will do well... even if Ibra does not create too many chances, just his presence will create space for Adriano to exploit. And hopefully vice versa....
    Blue I really want Zlatan to show up(Since 2003 I been telling my friends this guy will become number in the world one day but seriously how can he when he never ever turns up in the big games? especially the ones which are televised). Adriano looked sharp I really think he will trouble The Manchester United big time in the first leg.

    Maybe this is his time.... Wink

    But the partnership between Ibra and Adriano (if the latter continues to perform) will help both of them... coz either of them has the capability/threat to take two defenders with him everytime he moves to attack.... so the other will find space.


    This is Europe not Serie A, it won't be that easy

    Its the other way round. In Serie A, the defences are more tactically are than in europe. Pras, as a Milan fan you should know this by now!
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    Post by Pras_tama Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:37 am

    Yeah, but Ibra-Adri European perfomances aren't as good as their in Serie A. blue, earlier after the draw you seem to bit doubt about Inter chance against ManU but now after (you think) Adri gets his confident back, Inter chance is increasing? or you still put your money on ManU?
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    Post by bluenine Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:20 pm

    Pras Gallagher wrote:Yeah, but Ibra-Adri European perfomances aren't as good as their in Serie A. blue, earlier after the draw you seem to bit doubt about Inter chance against ManU but now after (you think) Adri gets his confident back, Inter chance is increasing? or you still put your money on ManU?

    I still think ManU are slight favourites for this one, just coz they play the second leg at home. But thats just a small advantage.

    Yes, my confidence in Inter has grown a bit with Adriano's confidence... ManU's defence can easily neutralise just Ibra alone if he gets isolated upfront like most of our games.... but together, these two can cause any defence problems...
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    Post by Pras_tama Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:26 pm

    When Juve were relegated, I wished that Ibra went to either ManU or Milan because both had lost RvN and Sheva at the same time but it never happened Sad

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