France 1998-2000 vs Spain 2008-2010

kas wrote:

Fenomeno wrote:

In the last WC France’s ageing (and that’s and understatement) midfield easily kept up with Spain's passers.

Bitch-slapped and humiliated..

So a 4-3-3 formation for Spain vs. 4-5-1 for France...clear outnumbering in midfield so obviously one side would dominate the other in that area.


Then you factor in Raul starting, who fucks up everything and makes it as if Spain were playing with 10 men, so it's no surprise Spain lost
(that too after a dive from Henry for the 2-1)

Dive? It was a foul and Henry exaggerated the impact. Its not like Iniesta in this WC final.

I agree though that the French team had a genius in Zidane that can make the difference, but overall I don't think it would be that big a gap. Because IIRC the rest of the French midfield was a bit more "facking runners" than the Spain team. To put it another way, in terms of midfield creativity France had one 10/10 player but then a bunch of 6 out of 10 players. Spain have all 8 out of 10 players. So the average evens out.

6/10? Fuck off. 8/10 Who? Alonso? Busquets? Silva? Navas? Please.

This is a general comment btw. Please don't pick on it and reply with lots of laugh icons saying things like "Vieira had more creativity in one toe than Xabi Alonso in his whole body"

If its general why make it. And Vieira has more creativity in his left foot than Busquets and Alonso combined.

Well I made the point because as far as I can remember, I think it's true. As the sum of its parts, Spain's midfield is less about defensive play and physical attributes than the France midfield was.

But then I went back and added that disclaimer because I realised I would get exactly the sort of outraged, mocking reply that you've posted. And you're too pro-France, I'm too pro-Spain (Barça), and my memory of the France team from 10 years ago is too hazy...to have any kind of proper further discussion on the matter.

Thanks for admitting the haziness of 'memories'. Distorted along the way (a full decade to boot), that it naturally disservices any arrived conclusion of a rather speculative scenario. So we'll live in our cocooned little worlds.

Big 4 Billy Bollocks™ wrote:France 2000 > Spain 2008 > Spain 2010 > France 1998....

At first I agree with this, but was France2000 really the best team in 2000? I was at the final in 2000 and thought Italy was better in the final. But overall the final should have been Holland-Portugal. Portugal was really good in 2000, the best I have seen from them and the only Portugal team one could have sympathy for. Euro2000 was the last really good international tournament though, I think we all agree with that.

Think the result in 2006 sums it up who was better.

The game has moved on the defensive systems of the past are floored. Spain's approach in midfield destroys defensive and offensive team styles the power is in the middle it is the hub of building and maybe outlasting team systems. Zidane would of looked worst than Messi....... Henry would not of got any service and if he did cover would of been close.

I thought Brazil 70 was great same with France in 1998 to 2000. Spain is better and has the ability to strengthen and improve in the coming years it is a better balanced playing system than defensive or attacking systems of past winners.

Super fast agile ball handlers in the in the middle beat powerful defensive ball winners.... This is why I like CM players first and foremost as they learn to play the middle better than any other kind of midfielder such as DM AM RM LM.

Brian2468 wrote:The game has moved on the defensive systems of the past are floored. Spain's approach in midfield destroys defensive and offensive team styles the power is in the middle it is the hub of building and maybe outlasting team systems. Zidane would of looked worst than Messi....... Henry would not of got any service and if he did cover would of been close.

I thought Brazil 70 was great same with France in 1998 to 2000. Spain is better and has the ability to strengthen and improve in the coming years it is a better balanced playing system than defensive or attacking systems of past winners.

Super fast agile ball handlers in the in the middle beat powerful defensive ball winners.... This is why I like CM players first and foremost as they learn to play the middle better than any other kind of midfielder such as DM AM RM LM.

Games are often won and lost in midfield. This is nothing groundbreaking Brian.

Zidane and Messi are nothing like eachother in playing style, so don't see how you came to that conculsion. Henry was pretty average in international tournaments for France anyway.

Super fast agile ball handlers don't always beat powerful defensive ball winners. We've seen Barca struggle against Chelsea and Inter in recent seasons. Spain used to have plenty of agile ball handlers before 2008 yet they always underachieved. Argentina post 1990 have underachieived despite having a huge amount of talented ball handlers in midfield.

France's midfield was more balanced for me, and they played in an era of stronger international sides.

BoBo Vieri 32 wrote:

Brian2468 wrote:The game has moved on the defensive systems of the past are floored. Spain's approach in midfield destroys defensive and offensive team styles the power is in the middle it is the hub of building and maybe outlasting team systems. Zidane would of looked worst than Messi....... Henry would not of got any service and if he did cover would of been close.

I thought Brazil 70 was great same with France in 1998 to 2000. Spain is better and has the ability to strengthen and improve in the coming years it is a better balanced playing system than defensive or attacking systems of past winners.

Super fast agile ball handlers in the in the middle beat powerful defensive ball winners.... This is why I like CM players first and foremost as they learn to play the middle better than any other kind of midfielder such as DM AM RM LM.

Games are often won and lost in midfield. This is nothing groundbreaking Brian.

Zidane and Messi are nothing like eachother in playing style, so don't see how you came to that conculsion. Henry was pretty average in international tournaments for France anyway.

Super fast agile ball handlers don't always beat powerful defensive ball winners. We've seen Barca struggle against Chelsea and Inter in recent seasons. Spain used to have plenty of agile ball handlers before 2008 yet they always underachieved. Argentina post 1990 have underachieived despite having a huge amount of talented ball handlers in midfield.

France's midfield was more balanced for me, and they played in an era of stronger international sides.

Fair enough time will answer the question just how good Spain and there Tiki Taka play I see them going on longer and better than France that in itself will justify their ball playing system for you the none believers.

Argentina have always been able to play similar but never have taken it to the level of Spain has it goes right through the squad now that they have proven to themselves it can soothe the opposition and place a firm hand on the outcome of games.

Was not comparing Zidane to Messi, pointing out great players are tamed with there team style.

I will not compare the opposition national teams of 10 years ago it does not compute different era different times... Just like cars, planes, or computers they do a better job today and so do our players even if they do not look as great as the past winners.


What is scary..... Germany Brazil Italy are now way behind the eight ball and have to try and catch up............there DOOMED!!!!!!

I was saying before the world cup how this Spanish reminded me of the old good French team.

I think the French team 2000 was better than 1998. In 1998, most of the French players were still playing in France. In 2000, Trezeguet, Henry, Pires, Wiltord were at their top.

Didier Deschamps was certainly the most important player there was, more important than Zidane. He was the captain and a key player.

Thuram, Dessailly, Blanc and Lizarazu were also amazing for both their clubs and the national team.

Spain 2010 is quite different and it's difficutl to compare two different areas. One thing for sure, is that Spain 2010 has as many talents as France 2002.