Moyes, Rodgers, Mourinho, Pellegrini

Couple of interesting pieces in the Times today - Fink Tank saying managers can't be assessed over 10 months performance and rarely make a difference anyway; Matthew Syed saying it just shows that Ferguson was a genius.

Moyes: so, on a personal level, I think he's a tool. That self-congratulatory video at the end of the 2004-05 season still pisses me off.

On a football level, I think he's a bit worse than the Everton years suggest and a lot better than this year suggests.

Man U will spend in the summer and shift a load of players on, and they'll be comfortably back in the CL places next season.

Rodgers: has clearly energised the squad and has Liverpool playing open attacking football for the first time since Roy Evans. Experience suggests that league performance will regress to the mean and will be challenging for 4th place next season. His record of signings is patchy at best so a summer spending spree may not help that much.

Mourinho: now that Fergie has gone, possibly the worst loser in football? But as the saying goes, show me a good loser and I'll show you a loser. Unattractive, pragmatic and anti-football but given money to spend in the summer Chelsea will be challenging for the title

Pellegrini: has suffered from halos and horns this season, being acclaimed and damned at different times.

Can't see past Man City and Chelsea for the league next year. The interesting battle will be Liverpool, Arsenal, ManU, Everton and Spurs for 3rd and 4th.

A final point on Ferguson and Moyes. For all that he's acknowledged as a man-manager of players, Fergie seems to have struggled with backroom staff. While his record of trophies is better, he's totally failed to build a succession in the way that Shankly/Paisley/Fagan managed.

Fergie left a shite squad, true, but it was a squad that won the league and Moyes spend 100m himself in it.

I think one can assess a manager over 10 months, I think its just wrong to give people, in a business where you get hired to get fired, 6 year contracts.

Next year could be great if Utd get the right manager, they need to sign van Gaal before the WC though, cause Holland will fail so hard that people will raise questions.

I think it's entirely premature to write Liverpool off already. We have a lot of money ( maybe not as much as City and Chelsea of course, but we're healthy) and we have Champions League football to offer now. The chance to play with Luis Suarez is incentive alone for some players.

We hear every season how City and Chelsea are going to sign top quality players. City signed some good players last summer but not enough for me and certainly didn't improve their defence. We heard all summer how Chelsea were going to sign Falcao or Ibrahimovic etc but ended up with Eto'o.

I don't doubt they'll spend but Liverpool will be fighting in this market for top quality players too.

United are going to have an extremely hard task getting back into the top 4 unless Arsenal sack Wenger and completely rebuild. Wenger staying means they have no chance of the title but a large chance of 4th.

Spurs are an utter mess IMO. Too many players who aren't good enough. They need a really good manager and some shrewd signings as well as letting players go to be a force.

Everton will lose Lukaku and Delefeou. They are two big players to lose and with no real budget or possible CL to offer I can't see how they're going to compete when those above them will all strengthen.

I see Liverpool getting stronger. They had problems and still do at times at the back but unlike other sides when they show cracks in there back line the team rally's better than others. 1/ because of their attacking football and 2/ as important is there fans. It gives them an excellent mixture for real long term success.

Luis wrote:I think it's entirely premature to write Liverpool off already. We have a lot of money ( maybe not as much as City and  Chelsea of course, but we're healthy) and we have Champions League football to offer now. The chance to play with Luis Suarez is incentive alone for some players.

We hear every season how City and Chelsea are going to sign top quality players. City signed some good players last summer but not enough for me and certainly didn't improve their defence. We heard all summer how Chelsea were going to sign Falcao or Ibrahimovic etc but ended up with Eto'o.

I don't doubt they'll spend but Liverpool will be fighting in this market for top quality players too.

United are going to have an extremely hard task getting back into the top 4 unless Arsenal sack Wenger and completely rebuild. Wenger staying means they have no chance of the title but a large chance of 4th.

Spurs are an utter mess IMO. Too many players who aren't good enough. They need a really good manager and some shrewd signings as well as letting players go to be a force.

Everton will lose Lukaku and Delefeou. They are two big players to lose and with no real budget or possible CL to offer I can't see how they're going to compete when those above them will all strengthen.

I don't disagree with your Liverpool comments, but literally each and every time you open your mouth about Spurs I cringe.

"An utter mess" that is probably going to finish 5th or 6th this season, despite having a buffoon as manager. Which, if you recall, is higher than where Rodgers and Liverpool finished last year. What a mess

Too many players who aren't good enough. How about too many players in their first year, still adapting. You'd think you'd never have heard of Jordan Henderson The players clearly aren't the real crux of the problem long term, because without a game plan we still manage to regularly beat every team outside the top 4. Of course we need to trim some of the deadwood, make some better signings ,what team doesn't. But it's more a case of missing a manager who can set them up to play in an effective way.

What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

Kimbo wrote:What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

No, not the new players who have been there for less than 12 months. They deserve time to prove themselves. I'm talking about those who've been there longer and IMO are clearly not good enough. Kyle Naughton, Danny Rose, Aaron Lennon in particular - Lennon has been a long servant of the club, but this season has shown his time is up. I'd throw in Dawson too, although it's tough to say that given he is actually a very decent bloke, just not a very decent defender. Assoue Ekotto should go too. The jury is obviously still out on Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Paulinho, Capoue, but a second season allows for a better judgement to be passed.

Isco Benny wrote:

Kimbo wrote:What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

No, not the new players who have been there for less than 12 months. They deserve time to prove themselves. I'm talking about those who've been there longer and IMO are clearly not good enough. Kyle Naughton, Danny Rose, Aaron Lennon in particular - Lennon has been a long servant of the club, but this season has shown his time is up. I'd throw in Dawson too, although it's tough to say that given he is actually a very decent bloke, just not a very decent defender. Assoue Ekotto should go too. The jury is obviously still out on Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Paulinho, Capoue, but a second season allows for a better judgement to be passed.

The jury is in on Soldado. Sorry mate.

Jaime wrote:

Isco Benny wrote:

Kimbo wrote:What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

No, not the new players who have been there for less than 12 months. They deserve time to prove themselves. I'm talking about those who've been there longer and IMO are clearly not good enough. Kyle Naughton, Danny Rose, Aaron Lennon in particular - Lennon has been a long servant of the club, but this season has shown his time is up. I'd throw in Dawson too, although it's tough to say that given he is actually a very decent bloke, just not a very decent defender. Assoue Ekotto should go too. The jury is obviously still out on Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Paulinho, Capoue, but a second season allows for a better judgement to be passed.

The jury is in on Soldado. Sorry mate.

Give us Bale back then you bastard

Isco Benny wrote:

Jaime wrote:

Isco Benny wrote:

Kimbo wrote:What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

No, not the new players who have been there for less than 12 months. They deserve time to prove themselves. I'm talking about those who've been there longer and IMO are clearly not good enough. Kyle Naughton, Danny Rose, Aaron Lennon in particular - Lennon has been a long servant of the club, but this season has shown his time is up. I'd throw in Dawson too, although it's tough to say that given he is actually a very decent bloke, just not a very decent defender. Assoue Ekotto should go too. The jury is obviously still out on Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Paulinho, Capoue, but a second season allows for a better judgement to be passed.

The jury is in on Soldado. Sorry mate.

Give us Bale back then you bastard

You shoulda gone for Negredo I kept saying that last summer!

Jaime wrote:

Isco Benny wrote:

Jaime wrote:

Isco Benny wrote:

Kimbo wrote:What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

No, not the new players who have been there for less than 12 months. They deserve time to prove themselves. I'm talking about those who've been there longer and IMO are clearly not good enough. Kyle Naughton, Danny Rose, Aaron Lennon in particular - Lennon has been a long servant of the club, but this season has shown his time is up. I'd throw in Dawson too, although it's tough to say that given he is actually a very decent bloke, just not a very decent defender. Assoue Ekotto should go too. The jury is obviously still out on Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Paulinho, Capoue, but a second season allows for a better judgement to be passed.

The jury is in on Soldado. Sorry mate.

Give us Bale back then you bastard

You shoulda gone for Negredo I kept saying that last summer!

City wanted Negredo. Ergo we had no chance.

To be fair, Negredo has stopped scoring completely since January. Maybe he's the Spanish Papisse Cisse?

Luis wrote:

Everton will lose Lukaku and Delefeou. They are two big players to lose and with no real budget or possible CL to offer I can't see how they're going to compete when those above them will all strengthen.

I don't doubt it will happen one day, but it's funny to read your posts year after year about how Everton will get significantly weaker during next campaign. And everytime we somehow are still doing reasonably well...

Jaime wrote:

Isco Benny wrote:

Kimbo wrote:What deadwood are you referring to 0trick? Soldado and Lamela?

No, not the new players who have been there for less than 12 months. They deserve time to prove themselves. I'm talking about those who've been there longer and IMO are clearly not good enough. Kyle Naughton, Danny Rose, Aaron Lennon in particular - Lennon has been a long servant of the club, but this season has shown his time is up. I'd throw in Dawson too, although it's tough to say that given he is actually a very decent bloke, just not a very decent defender. Assoue Ekotto should go too. The jury is obviously still out on Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Paulinho, Capoue, but a second season allows for a better judgement to be passed.

The jury is in on Soldado. Sorry mate.