Manchester United's midfield

Ronaldo ----- Carrick ---Scholes------ Giggs

Is this the best midfield in the league? (I ask this honestly- two traditional wingers, and two tactically astute creative, two footed passing central midfielders. No other side in the Prem has a midfield like it: Chelsea play with no wingers, although they could; Liverpool have Gerrard playing on the right with Sissoko no match for Scholes/Carrick passing creative ability, Arsenal have a similar issue with Gilberto and also do not play with traditional wingers- more suited to europe than the premiership imo),

a trip to Bolton, a team who are notoriously diffuclt to beat at home and physically imposing, which I thought would ask quesitons of Carrick and Scholes apparenlty lacking steel in, United blew them away. A lightweight midfield would not have achieved this against Big Sam's Bolton.

They only look like getting better and better too.

Injuries permitting, and with Rooney hitting form again, is this United's year?

PS - I am not a United fan, so this is an honest post no designed to wind up Liverpool/Chelsea/Arsenal/Bolton fans (or fan, in the case of Bolton )

@ TRWP

It's certainly the best offensively, but we are yet to see somebody really go at their midfield and test it defensively (which I think is a credit to them, shows how well they've played).

PS. Chelsea do often play wingers, but more as a 3 Central Midfielders with 2 wingers just in front

---------DM-------
----CM-----CM----
WG-------------WG

Right now I'd have United's midfield as the best (certainly the most creative), even if it doesn't score the most goals.

Their only problem imo (and this is being very picky here) is that 2 of them are now well into their 30s. They'll need to find top replacements soon, but I have confidence they'll go out and buy 1 or 2 midfielders in January

S4P wrote:@ TRWP

It's certainly the best offensively, but we are yet to see somebody really go at their midfield and test it defensively (which I think is a credit to them, shows how well they've played).

PS. Chelsea do often play wingers, but more as a 3 Central Midfielders with 2 wingers just in front

---------DM-------
----CM-----CM----
WG-------------WG

Right now I'd have United's midfield as the best (certainly the most creative), even if it doesn't score the most goals.

Their only problem imo (and this is being very picky here) is that 2 of them are now well into their 30s. They'll need to find top replacements soon, but I have confidence they'll go out and buy 1 or 2 midfielders in January

No doubt Chelsea have the best midfield squad, and with Robben and SWP and Joe Cole (although strictly speaking not a traditional winger) they have amazing options, but none of these are better per se than Ronaldo and Giggs who have been breathtaking this season.

Defensively, Chelsea are leagues ahead - Maka and Essien are two of the very very best, and I think thets why they will go further in Europe than United, and be able to challenge on both fronts.

But as you say, offensively that is a glorious midfield

The Real White Pele wrote:

S4P wrote:@ TRWP

It's certainly the best offensively, but we are yet to see somebody really go at their midfield and test it defensively (which I think is a credit to them, shows how well they've played).

PS. Chelsea do often play wingers, but more as a 3 Central Midfielders with 2 wingers just in front

---------DM-------
----CM-----CM----
WG-------------WG

Right now I'd have United's midfield as the best (certainly the most creative), even if it doesn't score the most goals.

Their only problem imo (and this is being very picky here) is that 2 of them are now well into their 30s. They'll need to find top replacements soon, but I have confidence they'll go out and buy 1 or 2 midfielders in January

No doubt Chelsea have the best midfield squad, and with Robben and SWP and Joe Cole (although strictly speaking not a traditional winger) they have amazing options, but none of these are better per se than Ronaldo and Giggs who have been breathtaking this season.

Defensively, Chelsea are leagues ahead - Maka and Essien are two of the very very best, and I think thets why they will go further in Europe than United, and be able to challenge on both fronts.

But as you say, offensively that is a glorious midfield

Ah, now I understand what you're saying. Yeah agreed entirely, when Ronaldo and Giggs are on-song, it's extremely difficult to find 2 better wingers

Yep pele, It was seen by everybody as being the weak point, but far from it. When hargreaves is bought it takes it to that perfect level

Your right about the age thing though. When Giggs and Scholes retire, its going to be virtually impossible to replace them I think.

Thats why this is the season they NEED to win something, because this is the strongest team I can remember them having in years, and will take some rebuilding

Well , we are looking at Nani(dont know what is the progress there) as a replacement for Giggs , he very much like Ronado but more mature and a better shot but a weak header.
For Scholes it is going to be very difficult to replace him ,perhaps when we will get Hargreaves Carrick will do the Scholes job or maybe Rossi can be Scholes replacement as the guy got great vision and is one of the best finishers.

BilalShah wrote:Well , we are looking at Nani(dont know what is the progress there) as a replacement for Giggs , he very much like Ronado but more mature and a better shot but a weak header.
For Scholes it is going to be very difficult to replace him ,perhaps when we will get Hargreaves Carrick will do the Scholes job or maybe Rossi can be Scholes replacement as the guy got great vision and is one of the best finishers.

Too expensive

I know it seems stupid after a performance like today's, but Rooney strikes me as a more natural replacement for Scholes than Rossi. Rossi seems alot more willing to run in behind defences, and down the channels.

Yeah Rooney could do the job,Rossi will have to build some muscles to play in the midfield anyway.

someone like Cesc or Xavi would be good replacement for Scholes but its not going to happen.

i think Carrick will create alot of goals for us in the future, like he did today, but i don't think he will score many.

Rooney does not have Scholes' vision. Yes we know he can pick a good pass now and then but these are 10 -15 yard passes through the defense which have little time to react to them as opposed to where Scholes passes from deeper.

I'm happy to try Jones out in Scholes place and see what happens, for example if we win against Copenhagen on Wednesday then he can try Jones against Benfica and Celtic, i'd like to see how he cuts the mustard in an environment that requires more patient build up.

As for Giggs, fuck i'm stumped, who are we going to get that cuts the mustard to one of the best wingers of the last 16 years?

Batman wrote:someone like Cesc or Xavi would be good replacement for Scholes but its not going to happen.

i think Carrick will create alot of goals for us in the future, like he did today, but i don't think he will score many.

Maybe you could try for Iniesta, he is not always first choice at Barcelona and would fit the mould well.

Cesc-Fab wrote:

Batman wrote:someone like Cesc or Xavi would be good replacement for Scholes but its not going to happen.

i think Carrick will create alot of goals for us in the future, like he did today, but i don't think he will score many.

Maybe you could try for Iniesta, he is not always first choice at Barcelona and would fit the mould well.

Only if you give us Cesc back to replace him

kasnani wrote:

Cesc-Fab wrote:

Batman wrote:someone like Cesc or Xavi would be good replacement for Scholes but its not going to happen.

i think Carrick will create alot of goals for us in the future, like he did today, but i don't think he will score many.

Maybe you could try for Iniesta, he is not always first choice at Barcelona and would fit the mould well.

Only if you give us Cesc back to replace him

One day I actually believe that Cesc will return to Barcelona, but that will not be for a few years yet. This will give you time to get the large transfer fee needed together to buy him back.

Not only that but Merida should be ready by then

All the best midweek.

Thanks mate, you too

Someone I see as a Scholes replacement in the premiership is Steven Davis.

I didn't see the game today but Man U have only played that four as a midfield four in a couple of games this season. More often they play with Giggs as one of three forwards in a 4-3-3, as I explain on the 'Rooney vs the greats at 21' thread. Then they've stuck O'shea into a deep central midfield slot to play defensive midfielder, but he's been poor there this season after doing well towards the end of last season. So they've started to go with Fletcher-Carrick-Scholes behind a front three ideally containing either one or both of Ronaldo and Giggs, with Saha and/or Rooney. Now, the forwards also cover the wide areas in midfield, and the midfield three shuffle about a bit with Fletcher sometimes providing an extra man down the right to stretch the game, or Scholes pushing forward behind the main striker (or Carrick, on occasion). As Slavan Bilic said, the formation is dead. There are only spaces, positioning, movement, the ebb and flow of the game. That's what sets apart managers like Benitez, Wenger, Mourinho from managers like Steve McClaren. The former are not obsessed with formations, only with positions and roles and the ability to adapt to different situations. The latter is very much obsessed with formations.

robert wrote:Rooney does not have Scholes' vision. Yes we know he can pick a good pass now and then but these are 10 -15 yard passes through the defense which have little time to react to them as opposed to where Scholes passes from deeper.

Carrick will provide that passing from deep element. Particularly if he gets the right player alongside him.

I'm happy to try Jones out in Scholes place and see what happens, for example if we win against Copenhagen on Wednesday then he can try Jones against Benfica and Celtic, i'd like to see how he cuts the mustard in an environment that requires more patient build up.

Which Jones? Of the two, R impressed me the greater against Crewe, and he's a couple of years younger ain't he?

As for Giggs, fuck i'm stumped, who are we going to get that cuts the mustard to one of the best wingers of the last 16 years?

Ronaldo goes a long way to ensuring you have an extremely talented wide forward, and one can only assume that there are players from Holland or Portugal or some other country that plays with proper wingers that'll be buyable.

I'm ultimately with Obispo on this one - Rooney is the closest thing you've got to a direct Scholes replacement. After all, Scholes's best season was playing as a deep striker with players running in front of him, and Rooney's got from range, has the energy and strength of Scholes. He's not as good technically, maybe never will be, but has one hell of a lot more pace, which could make up for that.

The Real White Pele wrote:

S4P wrote:@ TRWP

It's certainly the best offensively, but we are yet to see somebody really go at their midfield and test it defensively (which I think is a credit to them, shows how well they've played).

PS. Chelsea do often play wingers, but more as a 3 Central Midfielders with 2 wingers just in front

---------DM-------
----CM-----CM----
WG-------------WG

Right now I'd have United's midfield as the best (certainly the most creative), even if it doesn't score the most goals.

Their only problem imo (and this is being very picky here) is that 2 of them are now well into their 30s. They'll need to find top replacements soon, but I have confidence they'll go out and buy 1 or 2 midfielders in January

No doubt Chelsea have the best midfield squad, and with Robben and SWP and Joe Cole (although strictly speaking not a traditional winger) they have amazing options, but none of these are better per se than Ronaldo and Giggs who have been breathtaking this season.

Defensively, Chelsea are leagues ahead - Maka and Essien are two of the very very best, and I think thets why they will go further in Europe than United, and be able to challenge on both fronts.

But as you say, offensively that is a glorious midfield

The only problem will be replacing Giggs

Rooney will drop into midfield and replace Scholes

Rossi Ronaldo and Saha/New striker will play upfront