CL:The joke.

Ricardo Jol wrote:Waddle was great He is one of my favourite English players just like John Barnes. It is beyond me why people hated him in England!

Italy 1990 ?

Diamond Lights ?

Tweedle wrote:

Kimbo wrote:

Yes but we're badly run Tweedle, we've been through this already and i've proved that the financial gap is widening - it's not the same as it was 5 years ago aswell, 5 years ago we were on par with Liverpool financially, but not any more and that's down to Pools CL money. It's not just transfer fees either, it's wages, scouting networks etc(we only have 1 full time scout), you have more money to spend in these areas. IF a club did close the gap(unlikely) then Arsenal could easily go out and have a spending spree to solidify there position in the top 4.

Of course CL money has a part to play but the top 4 have only remained the top 4 largely because of the incompetance of any other club to mount a serious challenge.

Spurs look as though they may well do soon - as they have the technical background now and have made investments in young players as well as proven class.

In contrast Newcastle have bought poorly year on year now for about 4 seasons -you can't just expect one of the top 4 to hand you a CL spot on a plate - you have to get there through buying the right players and playing winning football, neither of which the toon seem capable of managing. Jesus christ! year on year people comment on how poor the Newcastle defence is but what ever gets done about it? sweet FA...

But Spurs don't have the infrastructure to compete regularly, they have a small stadium and won't have the money to pay top wages until that changes. Newcastle are the only club that COULD have broken that top 4, but because we're badly ran we've probably missed the boat. As i've said many times before over the past couple of years a massive financial gap has opened up between us and the BIGBOYS. The top 4 are getting unbelievably rich though the CL.

Rai Krol wrote:

Italy 1990 ?

Diamond Lights ?

Semis! That was an unexpected and superb result for a country that usually is knocked out in the quarters...

Puro wrote:Yo Arnaud, I know what you mean. The EPL is basically 4 very good teams which happen to be among the richest clubs in the world. Their stranglehold in the league will only get better as the other teams have little to no chance of cracking the top four in the near future or worse ever. Sounds pretty much like a monarchy, the "haves" and the "haves not" doesn't it. They need a "revolution" of sorts for a change. Do they have the balls?

History says NO emphatically, so it'll be a French guy of course to do the revolution to help the "have nots" in the EPL.

La Liga, Serie A also have very good clubs at the top, but those leagues have strength in depth as well. Ligue 1, Bundesliga, Superliga, Eredivisie aren't too shabby either. Imagine if they had half the money the big 4 from the EPL enjoy.

UEFA had to give the top leagues 4 places each in the competition for they were gonna start their own league otherwise. We shall see how Platini carries his revolution. If there's a place in NEED of a revolution it is England. It's ALWAYS the same teams.

Excellent post Puro mate.You said exactely what i wanted to say but with a better vocabulary.i'm glad to see the posters with "sence" are in my side and i'm glad to see the "rest" still think i'm in the wrong even if what i say is logical! Why can't we all be united to say the CL is sh!t nowadays ?

Ricardo Jol wrote:Waddle was great He is one of my favourite English players just like John Barnes. It is beyond me why people hated him in England!

He's not hated. He's just under rated.

A recent TV programme asked people to vote on our best ever England XI and he wasn't even considered.

I think the only wingers they mentioned were Barnes, Beckham, Matthews and Finney. (this was during Beckham's overhype period).

Ricardo Jol wrote:Waddle was great He is one of my favourite English players just like John Barnes. It is beyond me why people hated him in England!

That's the thing i'd like to understand too! Waddle was magic and surely their best player ever.According to Wikipedia it's because the english fans know nothing about football taht they don't rate him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Waddle

"Waddle was seen as a strong contender for the 1991 European Footballer of the Year. However the tactics of Red Star Belgrade in the 1991 European Cup Final, whose stated tactic was to play for penalties, caused Waddle to have a deeply ineffectual game. Red Star Belgrade went on to win the final and Jean Pierre Papin won European Footballer of the Year. Chris Waddle's performances in the 90-91 season were phenomenal, and probably the most complete season of a British player abroad since John Charles in the 1950s and Kevin Keegan in the 1970s. Because of English disinterest in Continental European football, having just come out of the Heysel ban, and a particular ignorance of French League Football, Waddle's time at Marseille is often overlooked."

Kimbo wrote:
But Spurs don't have the infrastructure to compete regularly, they have a small stadium and won't have the money to pay top wages until that changes. Newcastle are the only club that COULD have broken that top 4, but because we're badly ran we've probably missed the boat. As i've said many times before over the past couple of years a massive financial gap has opened up between us and the BIGBOYS. The top 4 are getting unbelievably rich though the CL.

- Arsenal had a 38,000 seater stadium until last season

- bolton have a 28,000 seater and look where they are

- if Newcastle were ran as well as Bolton are, you'd be in the top 4

He's under rated Arnaud but he is not one of our best ever players.

Thats between the likes of Charlton, Moore, Mathews and Greaves.

Parks lives wrote:

Ricardo Jol wrote:Waddle was great He is one of my favourite English players just like John Barnes. It is beyond me why people hated him in England!

He's not hated. He's just under rated.

A recent TV programme asked people to vote on our best ever England XI and he wasn't even considered.

I think the only wingers they mentioned were Barnes, Beckham, Matthews and Finney. (this was during Beckham's overhype period).

Park mate.He was funny,intellignet and even a good singer (remember his song with Boli ? that's what you can call team spirit!lol They were praising each other in this song and it was in the french top 10 at the time!)

https://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/waddle%20boli/video/x15ahy_chris-waddle-et-basile-boli-chanten

Waddle

Waddle the best ever? Beardsley? Charlton? Moore? Shearer? Keegan?

At the moment I think the gap is bridgeable, although it might not be for much longer if the same teams continue to dominate. With three of the top teams owned by rich individuals you would imagine that they will be on a higher financial footing (as well as being rich and powerful clubs in their own right) than the rest of the league. Arsenal are in the weakest position of the CL sides currently, but onces the benefits of the new stadium start to come in to effect then we also should have greater resources and should be able to spend larger sums on players.

The presence of rich owners lower down the division may help to bridge the gap should someone be inclined to spend big in an effort at reaching the CL spots though.

Also, Waddle is a decent bloke. He always drank in the bar at my hall of residence in my first year at university. He always seemed a bit disappointed when the young women there didn't have a clue who he is!

Kimbo wrote:Waddle the best ever? Beardsley? Charlton? Moore? Shearer? Keegan?

Kimbo mate Waddle is a geordie...The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:

Kimbo wrote:Waddle the best ever? Beardsley? Charlton? Moore? Shearer? Keegan?

Kimbo mate Waddle is a geordie...The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

He was never better than Gascoigne IMO.

you seem to be overhyping him purely because he played in France

Tweedle wrote:

Kimbo wrote:
But Spurs don't have the infrastructure to compete regularly, they have a small stadium and won't have the money to pay top wages until that changes. Newcastle are the only club that COULD have broken that top 4, but because we're badly ran we've probably missed the boat. As i've said many times before over the past couple of years a massive financial gap has opened up between us and the BIGBOYS. The top 4 are getting unbelievably rich though the CL.

- Arsenal had a 38,000 seater stadium until last season

- bolton have a 28,000 seater and look where they are

- if Newcastle were ran as well as Bolton are, you'd be in the top 4

No ones saying that we're not poorly ran.

Here's some facts.

- A few years ago Newcastle were equal with Liverpool financially

- Over the past fews years Liverpool and the rest of the top 4 have gotten richer and richer and richer

- The rest of the league have pretty much stood still in this area

- In the future the top 4 will have a ridiculous amount of spending power, the rest will not have anywhere near as much(unless, as i've said, there's some BIG changes at Newcastle, which is unlikely)


How can you argue with any of that?

@Puro

Newcastle have the 11th most expensive squad in the world, West ham have the 18th most expensive squad in the world. In between there are clubs like Spurs in the the top 20 of expensive squads. Spurs and Newcastle are good sides and they can break into the top 4 if they spend wisely, in fact Spurs almost did. newcastles squad cost £10m less than Arsenals, but still havent won anything, so you cant blame the CL for there inadequacies.

Why should clubs like united, Liverpool and Arseanal who have spent a 100 years creating their wealth and reputation, so why shouldnt they benefit from it.

You are the kind of person who doesnt like to admit that the prem is a strong/strongest league so its easier to say there are 4 good teams and the rest are rubbish. This clearly isnt the cast, a team like boro who are mid table got to the Uefa cup final so it cant be that bad.

Againwhat makes you think that with more teams from weaker leagues and less teams from bigger leagues will do. The weaker teams will be swatted away when they play a good side. ITV definately will not want to show a small team that no ones ever heard of on prime time tv.

The CL format is more competitive than it has ever been, FACT No team has retained the CL, in the old format teams won it 3 seasons running!!!

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

Bobby Charlton was born in Newcastle.

Tweedle wrote:

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:

Kimbo wrote:Waddle the best ever? Beardsley? Charlton? Moore? Shearer? Keegan?

Kimbo mate Waddle is a geordie...The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

He was never better than Gascoigne IMO.

you seem to be overhyping him purely because he played in France

Err..He was EPL player of the year 1994 with Sheffield Wed...he was 34 yo.

His best period was in France...That's why he is highly rated there.In fact he is cult!

Sheffield gunner wrote:At the moment I think the gap is bridgeable, although it might not be for much longer if the same teams continue to dominate. With three of the top teams owned by rich individuals you would imagine that they will be on a higher financial footing (as well as being rich and powerful clubs in their own right) than the rest of the league. Arsenal are in the weakest position of the CL sides currently, but onces the benefits of the new stadium start to come in to effect then we also should have greater resources and should be able to spend larger sums on players.

The presence of rich owners lower down the division may help to bridge the gap should someone be inclined to spend big in an effort at reaching the CL spots though.

Also, Waddle is a decent bloke. He always drank in the bar at my hall of residence in my first year at university. He always seemed a bit disappointed when the young women there didn't have a clue who he is!

we are in a worse position since the Glazers took over. We have spent less money than Spurs since they came, we cant afford to buy £30m players anymore. The Carrick signing was financed by the £12m we got from Chelsea.

Puro wrote:Yo Arnaud, I know what you mean. The EPL is basically 4 very good teams which happen to be among the richest clubs in the world. Their stranglehold in the league will only get better as the other teams have little to no chance of cracking the top four in the near future or worse ever. Sounds pretty much like a monarchy, the "haves" and the "haves not" doesn't it. They need a "revolution" of sorts for a change. Do they have the balls?

History says NO emphatically, so it'll be a French guy of course to do the revolution to help the "have nots" in the EPL.

La Liga, Serie A also have very good clubs at the top, but those leagues have strength in depth as well. Ligue 1, Bundesliga, Superliga, Eredivisie aren't too shabby either. Imagine if they had half the money the big 4 from the EPL enjoy.

UEFA had to give the top leagues 4 places each in the competition for they were gonna start their own league otherwise. We shall see how Platini carries his revolution. If there's a place in NEED of a revolution it is England. It's ALWAYS the same teams.

you mean like milan, inter, juve, roma or barca, real, valencia

or bayern, psv, lyon etc, so different

For your information (since you seem to lack quite a lot) the difference between the top clubs and the rest in Italy and Spain is far bigger than in the EPL due to their individual domestic TV deals (which for the sake of others on the forum is worth more money than the CL).

Kimbo wrote:
Here's some facts.

- A few years ago Newcastle were equal with Liverpool financially

- Over the past fews years Liverpool and the rest of the top 4 have gotten richer and richer and richer

- The rest of the league have pretty much stood still in this area

- In the future the top 4 will have a ridiculous amount of spending power, the rest will not have anywhere near as much(unless, as i've said, there's some BIG changes at Newcastle, which is unlikely)


How can you argue with any of that?

I'm not arguing with it - its no fault of the CL format though, its more to do with the general incompetance of the other clubs in the EPL - teams like Leeds, yoursleves and Spurs (until jol took charge)

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:

Kimbo wrote:Waddle the best ever? Beardsley? Charlton? Moore? Shearer? Keegan?

Kimbo mate Waddle is a geordie...The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

Bobby and Jack Charlton, Jackie Milburn, Alan Shearer, Peter Beardsley, and Paul Gascoigne. - All players from Newcastle(the Charltons are from Ashington which is just down the road)

I would only rate him above Jack Charlton out of those.

Chris Waddle emerged at the same time that Beardsley did, he was always in Pedro's shadow.

and 10 m we sold Ruud for.

Parks lives wrote:

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

Bobby Charlton was born in Newcastle.

Waddle >>>>>>>>>>>>Charlton and co.1966 was a joke.A contreversial WC.

England 1990 was a very bright team and surely your best ever.Waddle was the jewell with Gascoigne.But imo Waddle was the daddy.I love Waddle.

Football need more players like him.Nowadays they're big headed and not funny at all

Tweedle wrote:

Kimbo wrote:
Here's some facts.

- A few years ago Newcastle were equal with Liverpool financially

- Over the past fews years Liverpool and the rest of the top 4 have gotten richer and richer and richer

- The rest of the league have pretty much stood still in this area

- In the future the top 4 will have a ridiculous amount of spending power, the rest will not have anywhere near as much(unless, as i've said, there's some BIG changes at Newcastle, which is unlikely)


How can you argue with any of that?

I'm not arguing with it - its no fault of the CL format though, its more to do with the general incompetance of the other clubs in the EPL - teams like Leeds, yoursleves and Spurs (until jol took charge)

Who's denying that? In fact that is a point i've made myself. All i'm doing is pointing out how montomous and shit our league is going to because in the future.

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:

Parks lives wrote:

Arnaud is beautiful wrote:The best english player ever is from newcaslte.True story

Bobby Charlton was born in Newcastle.

Waddle >>>>>>>>>>>>Charlton and co.1966 was a joke.A contreversial WC.

England 1990 was a very bright team and surely your best ever.Waddle was the jewell with Gascoigne.But imo Waddle was the daddy.I love Waddle.

Football need more players like him.Nowadays they're big headed and not funny at all

Even if the WC in 1966 was controversial, Charlton has done enough in his time with United and in the 1970 WC to be ahead of Waddle. Bloody hell Arnaud.

That 1990 team was ace but other players had a big impact too, Beardsley and Lineker for example.

Rez, I know Man Utd are in a worse position, which is why I tried to qualify the statement somewhat by saying that the CL sides are rich and powerful in their own right. The Glazers have not benefitted Man Utd financially, but as a club Man Utd are still the biggest club in the country and have a big advantage over most teams in attracting players, paying wages, and can still make expensive signings every now and then that only Chelsea can currently rival (and beat).

Rez wrote:@Puro



Newcastle have the 11th most expensive squad in the world, West ham have the 18th most expensive squad in the world. In between there are clubs like Spurs in the the top 20 of expensive squads. Spurs and Newcastle are good sides and they can break into the top 4 if they spend wisely, in fact Spurs almost did. newcastles squad cost £10m less than Arsenals, but still havent won anything, so you cant blame the CL for there inadequacies.



Why should clubs like united, Liverpool and Arseanal who have spent a 100 years creating their wealth and reputation, so why shouldnt they benefit from it.



You are the kind of person who doesnt like to admit that the prem is a strong/strongest league so its easier to say there are 4 good teams and the rest are rubbish. This clearly isnt the cast, a team like boro who are mid table got to the Uefa cup final so it cant be that bad.



Againwhat makes you think that with more teams from weaker leagues and less teams from bigger leagues will do. The weaker teams will be swatted away when they play a good side. ITV definately will not want to show a small team that no ones ever heard of on prime time tv.



The CL format is more competitive than it has ever been, FACT No team has retained the CL, in the old format teams won it 3 seasons running!!!

Rez, I'll put the EPL in La Liga and Serie A territory when their teams win CL and UEFA Cup in the same year just like La Liga and Serie A have done in the past with lots less money in their clubs. Until then it's just FOUR very good teams. Perhaps Tottenham can change that this season.

Bit old Arnaud, but you might find this interesting

http://europeanboard.ephpbb.com/European-Board-c2/The-International-Board-f6/5-best-English-players-of-all-time-t366.htm?highlight=english

Puro wrote:
Rez, I'll put the EPL in La Liga and Serie A territory when their teams win CL and UEFA Cup in the same year just like La Liga and Serie A have done in the past with lots less money in their clubs. Until then it's just FOUR very good teams. Perhaps Tottenham can change that this season.

So what you're saying is 'shit, I don't know what to say now so I'll pull upon a statistic from the past which as no relevance at all to the discussion'

Puro wrote:

Rez wrote:@Puro



Newcastle have the 11th most expensive squad in the world, West ham have the 18th most expensive squad in the world. In between there are clubs like Spurs in the the top 20 of expensive squads. Spurs and Newcastle are good sides and they can break into the top 4 if they spend wisely, in fact Spurs almost did. newcastles squad cost £10m less than Arsenals, but still havent won anything, so you cant blame the CL for there inadequacies.



Why should clubs like united, Liverpool and Arseanal who have spent a 100 years creating their wealth and reputation, so why shouldnt they benefit from it.



You are the kind of person who doesnt like to admit that the prem is a strong/strongest league so its easier to say there are 4 good teams and the rest are rubbish. This clearly isnt the cast, a team like boro who are mid table got to the Uefa cup final so it cant be that bad.



Againwhat makes you think that with more teams from weaker leagues and less teams from bigger leagues will do. The weaker teams will be swatted away when they play a good side. ITV definately will not want to show a small team that no ones ever heard of on prime time tv.



The CL format is more competitive than it has ever been, FACT No team has retained the CL, in the old format teams won it 3 seasons running!!!

Rez, I'll put the EPL in La Liga and Serie A territory when their teams win CL and UEFA Cup in the same year just like La Liga and Serie A have done in the past with lots less money in their clubs. Until then it's just FOUR very good teams. Perhaps Tottenham can change that this season.

No one wants to win the Uefa cup, in the old format were the 3rd and 4th place teams play in the Uefa cup teams like Arsenal and Liverpool would easily win it. Last season two English sides played in both finals, we lost both but e got there. This season there is a 75% chance that there will be an Englis club in the final (thats 3 seasons running) and possibly two in the final. Seri A isnt hat it used to be and the prem is currently the strongest league in the world. As much as it pains you, but its the truth and with the new tv deals and rich owners its likely to remain that way for a while.