Semi final - Manchester United vs AC Milan

shazlx wrote:

Rez wrote:

shazlx wrote:

Rez wrote:We have no defenders, Kaka versus Fletcher/Brown/Oshea doesnt bare thinking about, the only consolation is that Gilardino will be playing and not Ronaldo. If only we had Vidic, Ferdinand, Evra, Neville and Saha.

Milan should progress now, hopefuly next season we can get to the final as we probably wont lose half our first team in the last 6 weeks of the season.

On his day, he can still be an effective target man for Kaka.

He hasnt had his day since he left Parma, he is still yet to score in the CL. Saying that he will score a hat trick past the hapless Brown/Oshea and make me eat my words. I guess if Smith can score in a big CL game anything is possible.

If Ferdinand and Vidic were playing, I would guarantee that Gilardino wouldnt score.

I didn't say anything about scoring (he's a $h!t finisher). I said he can be a good target man and there will be good to receive the ball and create space for Kaka and others.

Oh sorry, he is a decent target man, but not in the Viduka, Drogba mould. I think even super weak Brown could handle him physically. Imagine if Milan had a Drogba type player, we would get murdered. His movement isnt as good as super pipo, but I think his passing and all round game is better. I will agree with you that his finishing is poor.

I am worried about the game, after watching Brown/Oshea against Boro, I am convinced Milan will score. Our distribution or lack of, from the back will keep us on the back foot. We need Fletcher and Smith to produce there legendary big game performances (Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Roma) to have a chance.

bluenine wrote:You can't guarantee anything, dude, you are being very harsh on Gila. True, he was better for Parma, but he has scored 29 goals for Milan in 62 games, and thats not a bad return at all. He has the talent, but he is not the lone striker material IMO...

But if he starts as the lone striker for Milan, he is more likely to score than anyone else.

Rez wrote:

shazlx wrote:

Rez wrote:We have no defenders, Kaka versus Fletcher/Brown/Oshea doesnt bare thinking about, the only consolation is that Gilardino will be playing and not Ronaldo. If only we had Vidic, Ferdinand, Evra, Neville and Saha.

Milan should progress now, hopefuly next season we can get to the final as we probably wont lose half our first team in the last 6 weeks of the season.

On his day, he can still be an effective target man for Kaka.

He hasnt had his day since he left Parma, he is still yet to score in the CL. Saying that he will score a hat trick past the hapless Brown/Oshea and make me eat my words. I guess if Smith can score in a big CL game anything is possible.

If Ferdinand and Vidic were playing, I would guarantee that Gilardino wouldnt score.

Congratulations on winning the league, it still feels weird watching Inter consistently win, I am just to used to watching them promise the world and stumble on the final hurdle. I hope it continues, as Inter our my fave Italian team.

I think Kaka is more likely to score or Inzaghi if he comes on (he always scores against us). I am perhaps being slihtly harsh on Gila, but I have been so dissapointed watching him regress from his Parma days. With all the great players around him, he should be doing so much better than he is. I am startin to wonder whether, he peaked at Parma.

You looking forward to the united v Milan game, I think the Italians will gatecrash the all English final.

TBH, I never really believed in Gila, even at Parma... I thought he was good, but not as good as he was made out to be. I still think Milan should ve gone for Iaquinta instead. Gila is more like Pippo, while Iaquinta is more like Vieri (tho not as good).

Looking forward to the game too - it will be exciting, so much better than the same ol Chelsea vs Pool thing (yaaaawn). ManU like to attack and will try to speeden up the game, while Milan also like to attack, but will probably try to lower the pace a little and try to dictate in the midfield. Its a contest, would have been more fun if Rio, Vidic, Saha, and Ronaldo were playing

yeah, hope Inter can continue in this path... next season will be critical!

Rez wrote:

bluenine wrote:You can't guarantee anything, dude, you are being very harsh on Gila. True, he was better for Parma, but he has scored 29 goals for Milan in 62 games, and thats not a bad return at all. He has the talent, but he is not the lone striker material IMO...

But if he starts as the lone striker for Milan, he is more likely to score than anyone else.

Rez wrote:

shazlx wrote:

Rez wrote:We have no defenders, Kaka versus Fletcher/Brown/Oshea doesnt bare thinking about, the only consolation is that Gilardino will be playing and not Ronaldo. If only we had Vidic, Ferdinand, Evra, Neville and Saha.

Milan should progress now, hopefuly next season we can get to the final as we probably wont lose half our first team in the last 6 weeks of the season.

On his day, he can still be an effective target man for Kaka.

He hasnt had his day since he left Parma, he is still yet to score in the CL. Saying that he will score a hat trick past the hapless Brown/Oshea and make me eat my words. I guess if Smith can score in a big CL game anything is possible.

If Ferdinand and Vidic were playing, I would guarantee that Gilardino wouldnt score.

Congratulations on winning the league, it still feels weird watching Inter consistently win, I am just to used to watching them promise the world and stumble on the final hurdle. I hope it continues, as Inter our my fave Italian team.

I think Kaka is more likely to score or Inzaghi if he comes on (he always scores against us). I am perhaps being slihtly harsh on Gila, but I have been so dissapointed watching him regress from his Parma days. With all the great players around him, he should be doing so much better than he is. I am startin to wonder whether, he peaked at Parma.

You looking forward to the united v Milan game, I think the Italians will gatecrash the all English final.

@ Rez, Gila does have one CL goal

Milan are fav as our 9 players are out with injuries.

Is this the best game of the season?

Man U's pace and legs v. the experience and cunning of Milan.

Milan is missing a real quality striker upfront and hopefully the latest defensive injuries to MANU tilt the scale a little.

I still beleive that Milan will need a couple of young legs like Gourcuff and Gila even though they may not make tactical sense just to match the movement of ManU.

Man Utd have just 13 senior players fit and two of those are keepers!

If Milan don't go through then they'll have missed a massive chance - 13 senior players is disastrous for utd - basically they can't make and serious substitutions and as it is, their defence has NO first team regulars.

If Milan don't take advantage they're idiots

Milan rested most of their players at the weekend only seedorf and gattuso played from the start, pirlo etc getting a run out near the end.

I put this 70:30 in Milan's favour.

Quite hoenstly if they can;t beat this Utd side then they don't have a hope in hell of beating Chelsea (who I think will beat Liverpool) in the final and in all honesty wouldn't deserve to be there

bluenine wrote:TBH, I never really believed in Gila, even at Parma... I thought he was good, but not as good as he was made out to be. I still think Milan should ve gone for Iaquinta instead. Gila is more like Pippo, while Iaquinta is more like Vieri (tho not as good).

Looking forward to the game too - it will be exciting, so much better than the same ol Chelsea vs Pool thing (yaaaawn). ManU like to attack and will try to speeden up the game, while Milan also like to attack, but will probably try to lower the pace a little and try to dictate in the midfield. Its a contest, would have been more fun if Rio, Vidic, Saha, and Ronaldo were playing

Not so sure about the Ronaldo bit. I cant believe in our biggest CL game in 5 years we are going to have to rely on Oshea, Brown, Fletcher and Smith. Seriously I cant believe this injury crisis, we finally get to the CL SF and this happens. It was going to be hard with our first team, but with this team its nigh on impossible.

Are AC Milan the luckiest team in the world, get reinstated in the CL, then get the easiest group in the CL, then draw Celtic, then Bayern (who probably wont even qualify for the CL) and now play a injury ravaged united team.

Likely team.....


------------------ Van Der Sar
-------- O'Shea ---- Brown ---- Heinze
------------- Fletcher ---- Carrick
------ Ronaldo ----- Scholes ------ Giggs
--------------- Rooney --- Smith


However Fletcher will have to cover the right hand side.

The only other option is if Evra is fit, then we could play him at left back and use a flat back 4, with Fletcher dropping out.

I ve been sayin this all along, Milan have the luck of the devil in europe this season!!!

To top it all, they have just found form, right in time for the big CL games and the crunch Serie A games!!

I think ManU are also paying a bit for a weaker squad depth. For a top team, they need another quality striker and a quality DM to have a complete squad. but no one could have planned for the injuries in defence (and thats one area where you actually have squad depth!). Just like Inter, we have 3 quality DMs, and all 3 were injured for the valencia game!! Sometimes in a KO competition, luck plays a big role.

Rez wrote:

bluenine wrote:TBH, I never really believed in Gila, even at Parma... I thought he was good, but not as good as he was made out to be. I still think Milan should ve gone for Iaquinta instead. Gila is more like Pippo, while Iaquinta is more like Vieri (tho not as good).

Looking forward to the game too - it will be exciting, so much better than the same ol Chelsea vs Pool thing (yaaaawn). ManU like to attack and will try to speeden up the game, while Milan also like to attack, but will probably try to lower the pace a little and try to dictate in the midfield. Its a contest, would have been more fun if Rio, Vidic, Saha, and Ronaldo were playing

Not so sure about the Ronaldo bit. I cant believe in our biggest CL game in 5 years we are going to have to rely on Oshea, Brown, Fletcher and Smith. Seriously I cant beieve this injury crisis, we finally get to the CL SF and this happens. It was going to be hard with our first team, but with this team its nigh on impossible.

Are AC Milan the luckiest team in the world, get reinstated in the CL, then get the easiest group in the CL, then draw Celtic, then Bayern (who probably wont even qualify for the CL) and now play a injury ravaged united team.

You can't pull off a 3 man defence with Brown in the centre

You better play 4 at back, or Milan will fry you guys...

Parks lives wrote:Likely team.....


------------------ Van Der Sar
-------- O'Shea ---- Brown ---- Heinze
------------- Fletcher ---- Carrick
------ Ronaldo ----- Scholes ------ Giggs
--------------- Rooney --- Smith


However Fletcher will have to cover the right hand side.

The only other option is if Evra is fit, then we could play him at left back and use a flat back 4, with Fletcher dropping out.

The only other option is to play a flat back 4 with Fletcher right back.

You are going overboard, as usual. ManU will have some players fit for the second leg, and just have to hold on for a close result at home.

(in hindsight) ManU were lucky to play the first leg at home. Injuries or no injuries, Milan will be cautious at OT and that will work in your favour. Even if Milan win by an odd goal, ManU will have players back to play their game at San Siro - not easy, but against this Milan its possible.

I would say its 55-45 in Milan's favour.

Tweedle wrote:I put this 70:30 in Milan's favour.

Quite hoenstly if they can;t beat this Utd side then they don't have a hope in hell of beating Chelsea (who I think will beat Liverpool) in the final and in all honesty wouldn't deserve to be there

Rio is out for the second leg and so is Vidic

Evra and Neville may return .. Neville could even play at Everton before the game at the San Siro.

But if Milan come out of the first game with a score draw (very much likely), it will be very difficult to progress for us.

We may just have to attack at Old Trafford and outscore Milan, maybe 2-1, 3-1 or 3-2.

Then hope we have a defence back for the second leg.

bluenine wrote:I ve been sayin this all along, Milan have the luck of the devil in europe this season!!!

To top it all, they have just found form, right in time for the big CL games and the crunch Serie A games!!

I think ManU are also paying a bit for a weaker squad depth. For a top team, they need another quality striker and a quality DM to have a complete squad. but no one could have planned for the injuries in defence (and thats one area where you actually have squad depth!). Just like Inter, we have 3 quality DMs, and all 3 were injured for the valencia game!! Sometimes in a KO competition, luck plays a big role.

Rez wrote:

bluenine wrote:TBH, I never really believed in Gila, even at Parma... I thought he was good, but not as good as he was made out to be. I still think Milan should ve gone for Iaquinta instead. Gila is more like Pippo, while Iaquinta is more like Vieri (tho not as good).

Looking forward to the game too - it will be exciting, so much better than the same ol Chelsea vs Pool thing (yaaaawn). ManU like to attack and will try to speeden up the game, while Milan also like to attack, but will probably try to lower the pace a little and try to dictate in the midfield. Its a contest, would have been more fun if Rio, Vidic, Saha, and Ronaldo were playing

Not so sure about the Ronaldo bit. I cant believe in our biggest CL game in 5 years we are going to have to rely on Oshea, Brown, Fletcher and Smith. Seriously I cant beieve this injury crisis, we finally get to the CL SF and this happens. It was going to be hard with our first team, but with this team its nigh on impossible.

Are AC Milan the luckiest team in the world, get reinstated in the CL, then get the easiest group in the CL, then draw Celtic, then Bayern (who probably wont even qualify for the CL) and now play a injury ravaged united team.

The squad depth is weak in midfield, but its strange that the position we have the least cover has been relatively injury free. We have 6 defenders out, no team in Europe have the squad depth to cope with 6 injured defenders.

bluenine wrote:You are going overboard, as usual. ManU will have some players fit for the second leg, and just have to hold on for a close result at home.

(in hindsight) ManU were lucky to play the first leg at home. Injuries or no injuries, Milan will be cautious at OT and that will work in your favour. Even if Milan win by an odd goal, ManU will have players back to play their game at San Siro - not easy, but against this Milan its possible.

I would say its 55-45 in Milan's favour.

Tweedle wrote:I put this 70:30 in Milan's favour.

Quite hoenstly if they can;t beat this Utd side then they don't have a hope in hell of beating Chelsea (who I think will beat Liverpool) in the final and in all honesty wouldn't deserve to be there

If Milan had their whole first choice defence out, plus two other back up defenders and no Gilardino, I would put the tie 70-30 in uniteds favour. I think we may get Neville back, but Vidic, Ferdinand and Saha wont be back. Our defence is shocking at the momemt and Kaka will have a feild day. Ronaldo and Rooney will have to play the game of their lives to give us a chance.

I'm not blowing it out of all propoertion - the simple fact is they have their entire back four out.

Milan may be cautious though as you say, largely because they'll have seen what happens if you afford Utd space in the final third.

btw, I'm not supporting utd for this - I'm pretty much neutral.

Milan I don't dislike and also i kind of want to see a foreign team in the final - I'd split 50:50.

Seriously though, Milan have a massive advantage over utd here - if the roles were reversed I'd give Utd the huge advantage too.

Its 70:30, no 2 ways about it

bluenine wrote:You are going overboard, as usual. ManU will have some players fit for the second leg, and just have to hold on for a close result at home.

(in hindsight) ManU were lucky to play the first leg at home. Injuries or no injuries, Milan will be cautious at OT and that will work in your favour. Even if Milan win by an odd goal, ManU will have players back to play their game at San Siro - not easy, but against this Milan its possible.

I would say its 55-45 in Milan's favour.

Tweedle wrote:I put this 70:30 in Milan's favour.

Quite hoenstly if they can;t beat this Utd side then they don't have a hope in hell of beating Chelsea (who I think will beat Liverpool) in the final and in all honesty wouldn't deserve to be there

Batman's tactics for the Milan game, what do you think?

--------------- Van Der Sar ---------------

----- O'Shea ---- Brown ----- Heinze ----

--------- Fletcher ------- Scholes ---------
-------------------Carrick -------------------

Ronaldo -------- Giggs -------- Rooney

------------------- Smith -------------------


Milan will play 4-5-1, so Brown and O'Shea plus Heinze (if needed) should be able to handle Gilardino or Inzaghi, both strikers are not the quickest.

Kaka is the main dangerman, i would have Fletcher man mark him because Kaka has good acceleration and Fletcher is quicker than Scholes and Carrick in my opinion.

Scholes will play the deep-lying playmaker.

Carrick in a more advance role like in the Rome game, Carrick's job will be to out muscle Pirlo with his physical advantage.

Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney and Smith with free roles. Must not let the Milan full backs get forward.

I would also tell Giggs/Rooney/Smith to keep an eye on Seedorf.

Madness. sheer lunacy.

Jankulovski and Oddo would eat Milan alive if they played 3 at the back.

If you manmark kaka then that just allows the two fullbacks to bomb on even more.

I'd even argue that Oddo and Jankul are more dangermen for utd than Kaka

bluenine wrote:You are going overboard, as usual. ManU will have some players fit for the second leg, and just have to hold on for a close result at home.

(in hindsight) ManU were lucky to play the first leg at home. Injuries or no injuries, Milan will be cautious at OT and that will work in your favour. Even if Milan win by an odd goal, ManU will have players back to play their game at San Siro - not easy, but against this Milan its possible.

I would say its 55-45 in Milan's favour.

Tweedle wrote:I put this 70:30 in Milan's favour.

Quite hoenstly if they can;t beat this Utd side then they don't have a hope in hell of beating Chelsea (who I think will beat Liverpool) in the final and in all honesty wouldn't deserve to be there

Man Utd players missing tomarrow:

-------------- GK ---------------

Neville - Rio - Vidic - Silvestre

Park --- CM -- CM - Richardson

--------- ST ---- Saha ----------

Evra?

Tweedle wrote:Madness. sheer lunacy.

Jankulovski and Oddo would eat Milan alive if they played 3 at the back.

If you manmark kaka then that just allows the two fullbacks to bomb on even more.

I'd even argue that Oddo and Jankul are more dangermen for utd than Kaka

Kaka is Milans top goal scorer in the CL with 7 goals.

Two from Ronaldo, Giggs, Rooney or Smith could track back the full backs.

Easier said that done.

You need a flat back four V Milan or they'll rape you.

Its not like you've played 3 at the back recently either. the semi finals of the CL is not where you suddenly decide to experiment with new formations.

Changing from 4-4-2 to 4-3-3 is a far easier shift that from a back four to a back three

To be honest we should only play a back 3 if we have the personell to do it.

Rio instead of O'Shea and it may work.

Batman wrote:Batman's tactics for the Milan game, what do you think?

--------------- Van Der Sar ---------------

----- O'Shea ---- Brown ----- Heinze ----

--------- Fletcher ------- Scholes ---------
-------------------Carrick -------------------

Ronaldo -------- Giggs -------- Rooney

------------------- Smith -------------------


Milan will play 4-5-1, so Brown and O'Shea plus Heinze (if needed) should be able to handle Gilardino or Inzaghi, both strikers are not the quickest.

Kaka is the main dangerman, i would have Fletcher man mark him because Kaka has good acceleration and Fletcher is quicker than Scholes and Carrick in my opinion.

Scholes will play the deep-lying playmaker.

Carrick in a more advance role like in the Rome game, Carrick's job will be to out muscle Pirlo with his physical advantage.

Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney and Smith with free roles. Must not let the Milan full backs get forward.

I would also tell Giggs/Rooney/Smith to keep an eye on Seedorf.

Mate that team is horrible. Stick to 4-4-2 and tell Brown/Heinze to push up on Kaka, now is not the time to experiment with formations. Rooney and Ronaldo have to stay on the touchlines, to stretch Milans narrow midfield and to create space for Giggs, Scholes and Smith has to run around like a dog on heat to make sure Pirlo doesnt have the time and space to start attacks from deep. Overall I dont fancy our chances, watching Brown, Heinze, Oshea defend in the last 3 games confirmed this.

SAF will play a back 4 tomarrow:

Fletcher - O'Shea - Brown - Heinze

But during the match, Fletcher will get forward more than Heinze IMO, so the back 4 will become 3:

O'Shea - Brown - Heinze

I think Milan are more dangerour on the right than the left. SAF will tell Rooney to track back Oddo.

Our aim tomarrow has to be to get a 2-0 lead to take to the San Siro.

Batman wrote:SAF will play a back 4 tomarrow:

Fletcher - O'Shea - Brown - Heinze

But during the match, Fletcher will get forward more than Heinze IMO, so the back 4 will become 3:

O'Shea - Brown - Heinze

I think Milan are more dangerour on the right than the left. SAF will tell Rooney to track back Oddo.

Our aim tomarrow has to be to get a 2-0 lead to take to the San Siro.

Well, if Milan scores you can always blame VdS!

I beg to differ... Milan are more dangerous on the left, Janku is a big danger man!! And Seedorf tends to play in front of him. Oddo on the right is not too bad either. But left is deadlier, they do score a lot of goals from that side.

Batman wrote:SAF will play a back 4 tomarrow:

Fletcher - O'Shea - Brown - Heinze

But during the match, Fletcher will get forward more than Heinze IMO, so the back 4 will become 3:

O'Shea - Brown - Heinze

I think Milan are more dangerour on the right than the left. SAF will tell Rooney to track back Oddo.

Our aim tomarrow has to be to get a 2-0 lead to take to the San Siro.