Premier League Fixtures 21/22/23 September 2013

Pierre Littbarski wrote:

I see Soldado failed again - can anyone give me a recent example of a player who is under 6ft and not especially pacey being a success as an out and out CF in EPL ?

I think a better question would be:  can anyone give me a recent example of a player who is under 6ft and not especially pacey not being a success as an out and out CF in EPL ?

Luis Suarez 
Sergio Aguero
DJ Campbell
Wayne Rooney
Carlos Tevez
Manucho
Gabriel Agbonlahor
Henri Camara
Craig Bellamy
Andy Cole
Peter Crouch
Iago Aspas
Roberto Soldado

Di Canio has been fired

Fuck, why can't they just keep their shit managers like we do? Eventually they will stumble across a good one.

2 wins, 3 draws, 7 defeats. Not a surprise. 

Sods law we have them next. Apparently they already have Andre Villas-Boas lined up to take over.

I wonder how the Sunderland squad will take it.


El Hadji Ba #22 ‏@Elhadjbaaby 1m
LOL

Anyone know what this is all about? Has Ozil died?

http://www.101greatgoals.com/pictures/a-massive-pack-of-arsenal-fans-with-ozil-shirts-have-their-picture-taken-before-the-stoke-game/



Good to see they've taken the signing in their stride. Not weird / borderline mental in the slightest.

Reckon the players will be happy they're rid of him.
Di Canio was excellent for a short term kick up the backside rescue mission appointment,
but should never have been given a long term deal.
The surprise is that they've started so poorly this season,
I thought they'd have a killer start before a total melt down.
But this season has hardly kicked off at all for them.
Players already tired, wored down and confused.

What Short need to do now is give it some time and sit down with people who actually know what they're doing. Sir Alex (the experienced giant), Levy (the only one to have build a club into the top of the Premier League without throwing money at it), Everton and Wigan chairmen (who's had success/stability with limited/similiar resources), Huw Jenkins at Swansea (building an identity and having faith in it, appointing managers that can build on the work of his predecessor).
Get some tips about how he should build up the club and what direction he should lead the club.
Sunderland are in desperate need of an identity, a common idea the whole club can work towards.

If Short doesn't do the necessary planning this time around, he'll just continue the carousel of stop starting, new man in, out in a year, total change of the squad - which is expensive.
Need to find a direction and man he believes in, stick by him, and build upon his work if he should leave.
Cause this is going nowhere, it's not like they haven't spend good money down the years neither

Kimbo wrote:

did he get the date wrong?

A shame - they were only 6 points behind Man Utd.

will.i.glenn wrote:

Pierre Littbarski wrote:

I see Soldado failed again - can anyone give me a recent example of a player who is under 6ft and not especially pacey being a success as an out and out CF in EPL ?

I think a better question would be:  can anyone give me a recent example of a player who is under 6ft and not especially pacey not being a success as an out and out CF in EPL ?

Luis Suarez 
Sergio Aguero
DJ Campbell
Wayne Rooney
Carlos Tevez
Manucho
Gabriel Agbonlahor
Henri Camara
Craig Bellamy
Andy Cole
Peter Crouch
Iago Aspas
Roberto Soldado

6 out of the top 10 all time goalscorers by number of goals are: andy cole, robbie fowler, wayne rooney, michaelowen, les ferdinand and jimmy floyd hasselbainkare. They are under 6 foot and not especially fast, although owen was at one point. OK they are not recent except for rooney.

Pierre has a point, there are fewer players like rooney and aguero, more tend to be like benteke and giroud, but it is not a whitewash as he was suggesting.

Romford Pele wrote:The orphan (Nasri) played well yesterday. People will naturally talk about the spine (Kompany, Toure, Aguero) but I haven't seen Nasri influence a game like that in a while. Pellegrini obviously has much better man-management skills than Mancio and it's been evident so far. Central midfield is a slight worry for them if Toure or Fernandinho get injured though.

Sorry I have confused you by replying in an older thread, you probably wanted to say this in the latest weekend thread, so I have quoted you here.

I would point out that while man city were very good against man united, they were nothing special against hull or stoke. In fact stoke were the better team in that game although city did rest some players. So far pelligrini's city are not much different from the one under mancini in terms of how they play. They still don't seem to have a particular style, but are just a group of very good players. The main positive is that they have got rid of disruptive players like tevez and balotelli.

110% wrote:

Romford Pele wrote:The orphan (Nasri) played well yesterday. People will naturally talk about the spine (Kompany, Toure, Aguero) but I haven't seen Nasri influence a game like that in a while. Pellegrini obviously has much better man-management skills than Mancio and it's been evident so far. Central midfield is a slight worry for them if Toure or Fernandinho get injured though.

Sorry I have confused you by replying in an older thread, you probably wanted to say this in the latest weekend thread, so I have quoted you here.

I would point out that while man city were very good against man united, they were nothing special against hull or stoke. In fact stoke were the better team in that game although city did rest some players. So far pelligrini's city are not much different from the one under mancini in terms of how they play. They still don't seem to have a  particular style, but are just a group of very good players. The main positive is that they have got rid of disruptive players like tevez and balotelli.

   

You really don't think they're different style wise? Despite not doing anything flashy thus far, Fernandinho is a huge upgrade on Barry when it comes to usage of the ball. They also press the ball a lot more effectively than they did under Mancio. Pellegrini is a much more attack-minded manager than Mancio. The only downside i'd say so far is that bar yesterday, they've looked a tad suspect defensively.

Romford Pele wrote:

110% wrote:

Romford Pele wrote:The orphan (Nasri) played well yesterday. People will naturally talk about the spine (Kompany, Toure, Aguero) but I haven't seen Nasri influence a game like that in a while. Pellegrini obviously has much better man-management skills than Mancio and it's been evident so far. Central midfield is a slight worry for them if Toure or Fernandinho get injured though.

Sorry I have confused you by replying in an older thread, you probably wanted to say this in the latest weekend thread, so I have quoted you here.

I would point out that while man city were very good against man united, they were nothing special against hull or stoke. In fact stoke were the better team in that game although city did rest some players. So far pelligrini's city are not much different from the one under mancini in terms of how they play. They still don't seem to have a  particular style, but are just a group of very good players. The main positive is that they have got rid of disruptive players like tevez and balotelli.

   

You really don't think they're different style wise? Despite not doing anything flashy thus far, Fernandinho is a huge upgrade on Barry when it comes to usage of the ball. They also press the ball a lot more effectively than they did under Mancio. Pellegrini is a much more attack-minded manager than Mancio. The only downside i'd say so far is that bar yesterday, they've looked a tad suspect defensively.

They lost to cardiff and everyone except real madrid now know that javi garcia is shit, but they played worse against stoke and hull.

I watched both those games in full and this is a pretty accurate description of the hull game:
http://espnfc.com/uk/en/report/367456/report.html?soccernet=true&cc=5739
Hull created a lot of chances, and: "Manchester City were unable to impose themselves and frustration among the fans was evident, even as early as the 30-minute mark"

This is an accurate description of the stoke game:
http://espnfc.com/uk/en/report/367456/report.html?soccernet=true&cc=5739
I in particular draw your attention to: Stoke continued to dictate the game and went close again when Jones rose above Nastasic to head narrowly over from another fine Adam cross

It could be the sign of champions that they were poor and they took the points, but there is nothing positive to say about their style so far, except for the very last game against man united and I remember a 6-1 win at old trafford under mancini.

Man City weren't exceptional, they were just better than Man Utd.

This is going to be an interesting sub plot this season, Man Utd will probably still get a lot of free points against the teams who come and lay down against the name, but the games against teams who raise their game or see themselves as equal will be different to the SAF era. I won't be surprised to see Moyes poor record against the big sides continue this year.

They have always needed a classy midfielder. Over relying on width caught up with them in the CL once Scholes grew older. Now its happening in the league Moyes is not Ferguson but there is a legitimate practical reason Moyes it seems cannot make up for that the older gaffer could.

In the last couple of seasons Man City has simply been stronger and better than Man Utd. Mancini found an approach that worked well against Man Utd and I was hoping Pellegrini wouldn't venture to far from that. Luckily this game resembled previous games in terms of City's approach so I don't think Pellegrini can be given credit as such. Haven't seen City too much but this big game style is the same it used to be, at least so far. The difference yesterday was that Man Utd looked weaker than they had in previous encounters against them.

The task for Pellegrini will be to find a set up that works for most teams they meet outside of the top teams. But even if Aguero simply delivers the goods this season I'm not even sure what Pellegrini should do tactics/style wise. I think it is mostly a man management problem.

On another note I was surprised by Fernandinho who I hadn't really seen too much. He doesn't look like a great player who can contribute much except he is more agile, technical than Barry but other than that he doesn't seem too impressive so far.

Super Laudrup wrote:
On another note I was surprised by Fernandinho who I hadn't really seen too much. He doesn't look like a great player who can contribute much except he is more agile, technical than Barry but other than that he doesn't seem too impressive so far.

Agreed. Although his close control is better, so far he's not passing the ball any better than Barry. On the other hand, although his play was unexceptional his ability to cover ground was a factor against United's starting pair. Still, I'm happy to believe people who saw a lot of Shaktar and say he's got more up his sleeve.

This is gold.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/sunderland/10328138/Paolo-Di-Canio-sacked-as-Sunderland-manager-after-massive-player-rebellion-undermined-his-authority.html

it was always going to end messily, but it's particularly impressive that he managed to make so many enemies so quickly & get himself sacked so early in the season. you might be able to get away with dictatorial approach if you have proven success as a manager, but coming from managing Swindon to a Premier league club that's not a smart approach. only way he'll ever get another PL managing gig is if West Ham let nostalgia rule their heads.

whoever takes over Sunderland is gonna have tough job as they've got a total mish-mash of a squad & a lot of problems that won't magically go away with Di Canio gone. they'll probably go for a perceived safe option (Pulis) & that'll be another big shift in management style & tactics, which is hard to implement when the season already underway.

Saw Di Mateo being mentioned. That wouldn't be too bad, Italian at least.. Might get a bit from the new Italian guys.

Could see them taking a punt on Poyet too.

I'd love it if it was McClaren

christmasborocooper wrote:Saw Di Mateo being mentioned. That wouldn't be too bad, Italian at least.. Might get a bit from the new Italian guys.

Could see them taking a punt on Poyet too.

I'd love it if it was McClaren

no way will they go for Poyet, they're not going to go for another high risk after Di Canio backfired. also I'd be a little surprised if they went for Di Matteo. McLaren possibly, I also saw McLeish mentioned as one of the favourites, the poor bastards

christmasborocooper wrote:Saw Di Mateo being mentioned. That wouldn't be too bad, Italian at least.. Might get a bit from the new Italian guys.

Could see them taking a punt on Poyet too.

I'd love it if it was McClaren

you already love it

debaser wrote:it was always going to end messily, but it's particularly impressive that he managed to make so many enemies so quickly & get himself sacked so early in the season. you might be able to get away with dictatorial approach if you have proven success as a manager, but coming from managing Swindon to a Premier league club that's not a smart approach. only way he'll ever get another PL managing gig is if West Ham let nostalgia rule their heads.

whoever takes over Sunderland is gonna have tough job as they've got a total mish-mash of a squad & a lot of problems that won't magically go away with Di Canio gone. they'll probably go for a perceived safe option (Pulis) & that'll be another big shift in management style & tactics, which is hard to implement when the season already underway.

McLeish was at the WBA game, and he's one of the betting favourites!   I'm hoping for him or Pulis.

no self respecting manager is going to take that job, 3 weeks after the transfer window has shut with the squad in disarray.

Pulis wouldn't be a bad appointment. I don't see why he or di Matteo would want the job, unless he's in a massive hurry. Steve Kean or Dougie Freedman seems like the more likely outcome. 

Next Permanent Manager

Roberto Di Matteo 6/5	Tony Pulis 4/1	Gus Poyet 4/1	Alex McLeish 8/1
Kevin Ball 16/1	Steve McClaren 16/1	Neil Lennon 18/1	Gianfranco Zola 20/1
Andrea Stramaccioni 25/1	Gary Neville 25/1	Ole Gunnar Solskjaer 25/1	Paul Ince 33/1
Neil Warnock 40/1	Stuart Pearce 50/1	Peter Reid 66/1	Martin O'Neill 66/1
Alan Curbishley 66/1	Mick McCarthy 80/1	Gianluca Vialli 80/1	Giovanni Trapattoni 100/1
Martin Jol 100/1	Roy Keane 100/1	Nigel Clough 100/1	Ian Holloway 100/1
Jurgen Klinsmann 100/1	Niall Quinn 100/1	Ralf Ragnick 100/1	Hope Powell 250/1
Joe Kinnear 250/1

Would like to see hope powell given a go

will.i.glenn wrote:no self respecting manager is going to take that job, 3 weeks after the transfer window has shut with the squad in disarray.

Pulis wouldn't be a bad appointment. I don't see why he or di Matteo would want the job, unless he's in a massive hurry. Steve Kean or Dougie Freedman seems like the more likely outcome. 

Next Permanent Manager

Roberto Di Matteo 6/5	Tony Pulis 4/1	Gus Poyet 4/1	Alex McLeish 8/1
Kevin Ball 16/1	Steve McClaren 16/1	Neil Lennon 18/1	Gianfranco Zola 20/1
Andrea Stramaccioni 25/1	Gary Neville 25/1	Ole Gunnar Solskjaer 25/1	Paul Ince 33/1
Neil Warnock 40/1	Stuart Pearce 50/1	Peter Reid 66/1	Martin O'Neill 66/1
Alan Curbishley 66/1	Mick McCarthy 80/1	Gianluca Vialli 80/1	Giovanni Trapattoni 100/1
Martin Jol 100/1	Roy Keane 100/1	Nigel Clough 100/1	Ian Holloway 100/1
Jurgen Klinsmann 100/1	Niall Quinn 100/1	Ralf Ragnick 100/1	Hope Powell 250/1
Joe Kinnear 250/1

Pulis or Di Matteo would leap on Sunderland job. they're not likely to get much better offers. Even if worse happens and they get relegated & sacked, the Di Canio mess will get a lot of blame & they'll get a nice fat payoff.

Di Matteo won the Champions League and scored the fastest ever goal in an FA Cup Final. He's probably ringing round to find out how safe Mourinho's job is first. 

I'd like to see them go all out and make Roy Hodgson an offer he can't refuse.