Liverpool FC 2015/2016

Sturridge and Benteke aren't talented then?

Lallana, Firmino, Clyne, Moreno, Sakho, Can, Henderson.

Are they all shit players?

Firmino had the second most assists after KDB in the German League last season.

I thought the whole point of sacking Rodgers was that he couldn't get the best out of a good group of players this season?

Obviously Klopp will be judged long term but why should we write off this season when we're in a good position points wise 8 games in?

Did people not see how awful United were against Arsenal?

stinger wrote:

Luis wrote:We might as well have stuck with Rodgers if people will accept not finishing 4th and not winning a trophy. Rodgers probably would have finished 5th or 6th.

I think our squad is better than people think because it went stale under Rodgers. If Van Gaal managed to finish 4th in his first season then Klopp should be too - we have some very talented players. It's the defence that needs sorting out and then in January we need to look at the midfield but even so Henderson may be back by then.

You don't see it?

I like Van Gaal, but taking 4th spot last season wasn't super impressive - Liverpool was weakened after Suarez left and with many new players, Everton and Martinez had 2nd season syndrome (trying to look positively at things) and Tottenham wasn't able to put any serious challenge as well.

Klopp now will have to beat one of top 4 teams and United looks stronger and better balanced than last season. Klopp's challenge is much more difficult and taking over Liverpool during the season is making things even more challenging.

And your squad is so talented    that only one player (Coutinho) would be a significant upgrade over what Everton can put on the pitch (looking at realistic line-ups).

Sturridge and Henderson would walk into your team for a start. Clyne and Sakho too.

Everton are not on a par with Lierpool or Spurs. I see you in the same bracket as Swanea and West Ham.

United have been mostly shit this season - they faltered in Europe and faltered against Arsenal, when up against real quality.

Honestly, if you think United can win the title you might as well say Leicster can as well.

Luis wrote:

stinger wrote:

Luis wrote:We might as well have stuck with Rodgers if people will accept not finishing 4th and not winning a trophy. Rodgers probably would have finished 5th or 6th.

I think our squad is better than people think because it went stale under Rodgers. If Van Gaal managed to finish 4th in his first season then Klopp should be too - we have some very talented players. It's the defence that needs sorting out and then in January we need to look at the midfield but even so Henderson may be back by then.

You don't see it?

I like Van Gaal, but taking 4th spot last season wasn't super impressive - Liverpool was weakened after Suarez left and with many new players, Everton and Martinez had 2nd season syndrome (trying to look positively at things) and Tottenham wasn't able to put any serious challenge as well.

Klopp now will have to beat one of top 4 teams and United looks stronger and better balanced than last season. Klopp's challenge is much more difficult and taking over Liverpool during the season is making things even more challenging.

And your squad is so talented    that only one player (Coutinho) would be a significant upgrade over what Everton can put on the pitch (looking at realistic line-ups).

Sturridge and Henderson would walk into your team for a start. Clyne and Sakho too.

Everton are not on a par with Lierpool or Spurs. I see you in the same bracket as Swanea and West Ham.

United have been mostly shit this season - they faltered in Europe and faltered against Arsenal, when up against real quality.

Honestly, if you think United can win the title you might as well say Leicster can as well.

Where did you read about me predicting United to win the title?

Sturridge over Lukaku? Prefer Lukaku to be honest mostly because he can stay fit, they are similar quality, both are mostly finishers who thrives on through balls and counter attack football.

Henderson is better than McCarthy, but difference isn't massive, goals scoring ability by Henderson is probably the only difference. Both have similar engine and similar limitations skills wise.

Sakho over who? Jagielka? Stones? Maybe in old editions of Football Manager, but not in real world.

Clyne over Coleman? I really rate Clyne and he has been better than Coleman over last 12 months, but when in form they are both on the same level (Coleman is better offensively, Clyne more solid defensively).

Right now Coutinho is the only Liverpool player who would easily walk into Everton starting XI and would make a difference.

Luis wrote:Sturridge and Benteke aren't talented then?

Lallana, Firmino, Clyne, Moreno, Sakho, Can, Henderson.

Are they all shit players?

Firmino had the second most assists after KDB in the German League last season.

I thought the whole point of sacking Rodgers was that he couldn't get the best out of a good group of players this season?

Obviously Klopp will be judged long term but why should we write off this season when we're in a good position points wise 8 games in?

Did people not see how awful United were against Arsenal?

You described them as very talented players, I personally would only describe Coutinho as a very talented player. Most of the ones you listed are merely good players.

Stinger, I have got the impression from Everton fans that Jagielka has been rubbish for some time now.

Jagielka has been dog poop this season mostly. Sakho seems to perform well in most of the games he plays but because Martin Tyler says he can't pass, people seem to take his word for it.

Lukaku over Sturridge is silly. I rate Lukaku but Sturridge is superior by some distance.

Our team and squad are good enough to finish 4th and add in a few Klopp signings in January and we really have no excuse not to finish in that position this season.

Kloppo Koppo wrote:Stinger, I have got the impression from Everton fans that Jagielka has been rubbish for some time now.

I trust my own judgment more. He has a very solid season so far, especially he should be praised for keeping our defense respectable when he is playing together with likes of Browning, Galloway and Funes Mori.

Jagielka had poor 2 seasons under late Moyes IMO, when it was clear that Distin-Heitinga combination was clearly the best (Moyes still preferred Jagielka though). He is doing well under Martinez in my opinion though.

Luis wrote:Jagielka has been dog poop this season mostly. Sakho seems to perform well in most of the games he plays but because Martin Tyler says he can't pass, people seem to take his word for it.

Lukaku over Sturridge is silly. I rate Lukaku but Sturridge is superior by some distance.

Our team and squad are good enough to finish 4th and add in a few Klopp signings in January and we really have no excuse not to finish in that position this season.

So you just ignore reality to say Jagielka is better than Sakho then?

My joint Merseyside team would be:

--------------------Mignolet--------------------

---Clyne--------Stones------Sakho-------Baines-----------

----------------Henderson----Lucas-----------------------

---------Sturridge------Barkley--------Coutinho---------

---------------------------Lukaku------------------------

I'd think that Firmino will come good under Klopp so he may take Barkley's place soon.

7 (soon to be Liverpool players  

Henderson & Lucas    

You can put McCarthy and Barry instead, this two would at least fit well together skills wise.

Sturridge as wide midfielder is worse option there than typical winger like Mirallas.


Here is my team:


___________Mignolet (who is just marginally less shit than Howard)

Coleman- Stones-Jagielka-Baines

____________Can

   Henderson_______Barkley (Coutinho)

__________Coutinho (Barkley)

    Lukaku____________Sturridge


Too bad that some positions have shitty options (GK, LB with Baines injury as well) and some looks much stronger (Clyne could easily replace Coleman and I rate Benteke too, plus you can always replace Henderson with Milner).

This could actually work well in reality I think. Too bad GK options are shit and only deep lying playmaker candidate (Barry) doesn't have legs anymore. Not sure which position would suit Coutinho and Barkley better.

Joe Gomez out for the season.

Our squad is an expensive heap of shite. Coutinho is great on his day but he still disappears from games and is inconsistent. Benteke doesn't work in our team because we don't have any wide players. Lallana has a similar influence on games as Joe Allen does - no inluence - he just flatters to deceive. I've always thought Milner was shit, he just makes a nuisance of himself and the ball bounces off him as he runs about. Sturbridge is fantastic but is always injured. We don't have one good defender - Clyne might turn out good but I've not been that impressed yet. Mignolet is rubbish. Lucas is average. I quite like Can and Henderson but I'll always compare them to Alonso, Masch and Gerrard who are just leagues and leagues ahead in terms of quality.

Basically Klopp needs a lot of time and patience because he's not got much to work with at the moment. We don't have a spine and our defence isn't the least bit convincing. Thank god everyone in the Premiership is rubbish this season.

Luis it looks like you are still mental but I'm glad you've finally admitted losing Agger was a big mistake. Don't know if you recall when I argued Agger was great and you were all about Lovren. Ha.

Agreed Kneeling Tiger 

So when Rodgers is manager he's shite but when Klopp is manager the squad is shite.

The squad isn't a title challenging squad by any means (well it was 2 seasons ago) but it's good enough for top 4 if we keep players fit and the manager improves both or defence and how we operate in midfield.

As I keep saying - United are not that far ahead of us and Chelsea seem keen on being shit this season so far.

If we can just play exciting football and not be a complete joke at the back that will do for me for the next few months but I will be disappointed with anything less than 4th and no trophy as I always am - that's the very minimum I expect.

Pretty sure everyone said the squad was shit when Rodgers was in charge. In fact, the squad being shit was one of the main reasons people wanted him sacked, no? Cos he wasted a shit load of money?

Liverpool's squad reminds me of what ours was like after the Bale sale. They've got a lot of bodies, it's certainly deep, and there are some what you would class as 'big name' players in there who you'd expect to turn good.

However, it will all basically come down to whether they all buy into Klopp's regime, not just his philosophy or vision.

If Klopp goes in there and tells his players they need to run twice as hard in training than they have done under previous managers in order to implement his GEGGEN PRESSING football, with a squad that varied he's bound to get some players who either can't do it or won't want to do it. He'll also run into players who were promised certain things under Rodgers and will be straight onto the phone of their agents disgruntled because this Herman has come in and won't play him like he was promised. As a comparison, the reason United were so successful for many years with some relatively shite players on paper is the same reason Chelsea have also been so successful under Mourinho, or why perhaps despite being the most expensive / talented squad in the Premier League ever City aren't as successful as they should be under Pellegrini - for whatever reason whether it be through fear or respect or loving appreciation (or lack of thereof), having the right players willing to train hard to fit the manager's system is clearly just as important if not more than deciding whether they've got a decent looking squad on paper.

Therefore, clubs like Everton and Spurs might not have as big squads with big names as Liverpool, but they've got more streamlined, drilled set of players who have already been indoctrinated into a way of playing for their managers that Liverpool must now mould. Unless Klopp really is capable of making all those players happy and buy into his regime straight from the get go, then it's bound to take a bit of time (although given Rodgers' penchance for pressing football, shouldn't take as long as it has done for Spurs between Sherwood and Pochettino for example).

No matter what the Media thinks or how apparently good this Liverpool squad is, no reason in my mind to think Spurs (or even Everton for that matter) can't finish above them for the 7th time in 8 seasons. All this talk of 'but we're playing shit and still only X off top 4' very reminiscent of the situation we've had at manager junctures in the past. Aside from the Arsenal game, Liverpool have looked anything but worthy of points this season and it's only a matter of time as the spread of points per position increases that they would or will get found out if things don't change swiftly under Klopp.

Luis wrote:So when Rodgers is manager he's shite but when Klopp is manager the squad is shite.

The squad isn't a title challenging squad by any means (well it was 2 seasons ago) but it's good enough for top 4 if we keep players fit and the manager improves both or defence and how we operate in midfield.

As I keep saying - United are not that far ahead of us and Chelsea seem keen on being shit this season so far.

If we can just play exciting football and not be a complete joke at the back that will do for me for the next few months but I will be disappointed with anything less than 4th and no trophy as I always am - that's the very minimum I expect.

Rodgers bought all these players.

I couldn't case less that the rest of the top 4 are terrible as well. We are a million miles behind the best teams in Europe. We should be one of them after 300m of spending.

Rodgers has set us back years.

Ings out for the season our one good aspect of the season so far out the window.

Benteke not yet fit either and we know what Sturridge is like.

I have dreadful visions of Origi as a lone striker in November.

When Gerrard showed up at Anfield, I KNEW we wouldn't beat Crystal Palace. They guy has BAD LUCK all over him since "The Slip". He joined the L.A. Galaxy and the perennial winners can't even make the playoffs, and that's because of Stevie Me.

Now we hear he wants to work with Klopp doing some assistant work.

OH FOR f**k'S SAKE!!!!

Whatever you do, Klopp, DO NOT take Stevie Me - the guy now is pure BAD LUCK. Stevie Me is 'LA SAL'. TFS!

LA SAL, LA SAL, LA SAL - pure BAD LUCK.

Scouse Legend Danny Murphy reckons only 3 current Liverpool players would make the Tottenham side

http://www.espnfc.us/barclays-premier-league/story/2776278/liverpool-players-who-would-make-tottenham-team-murphy

Isco Benny wrote:Scouse Legend Danny Murphy reckons only 3 current Liverpool players would make the Tottenham side    

http://www.espnfc.us/barclays-premier-league/story/2776278/liverpool-players-who-would-make-tottenham-team-murphy

It's laughable really.  

If Klopp could somehow get 10 games out of Sturridge then we will easily finish top 4 above Spurs and Man Utd. We are a much better team.  

Having said that I may change my mind if we still end up relying on Origi and Benteke after this transfer window.

There's no Liverpool player that would strengthen Spurs, would just add squad depth.
Going the other way, 5 or 6 from Spurs would make Liverpool stronger.

rosenthal wrote:There's no Liverpool player that would strengthen Spurs, would just add squad depth.
Going the other way, 5 or 6 from Spurs would make Liverpool stronger.

Lloris and Kane. That's it.

+ Alderweireld, Dembele, Lamela
Unsure whether to add Alli or not, on form at least.

Isco Benny wrote:Liverpool's squad reminds me of what ours was like after the Bale sale. They've got a lot of bodies, it's certainly deep, and there are some what you would class as 'big name' players in there who you'd expect to turn good.

However, it will all basically come down to whether they all buy into Klopp's regime, not just his philosophy or vision.

If Klopp goes in there and tells his players they need to run twice as hard in training than they have done under previous managers in order to implement his GEGGEN PRESSING football, with a squad that varied he's bound to get some players who either can't do it or won't want to do it. He'll also run into players who were promised certain things under Rodgers and will be straight onto the phone of their agents disgruntled because this Herman has come in and won't play him like he was promised.  As a comparison, the reason United were so successful for many years with some relatively shite players on paper is the same reason Chelsea have also been so successful under Mourinho, or why perhaps despite being the most expensive / talented squad in the Premier League ever City aren't as successful as they should be under Pellegrini - for whatever reason whether it be through fear or respect or loving appreciation (or lack of thereof), having the right players willing to train hard to fit the manager's system is clearly just as important if not more than deciding whether they've got a decent looking squad on paper.

Therefore, clubs like Everton and Spurs might not have as big squads with big names as Liverpool, but they've got more streamlined, drilled set of players who have already been indoctrinated into a way of playing for their managers that Liverpool must now mould. Unless Klopp really is capable of making all those players happy and buy into his regime straight from the get go, then it's bound to take a bit of time (although given Rodgers' penchance for pressing football, shouldn't take as long as it has done for Spurs between Sherwood and Pochettino for example).

No matter what the Media thinks or how apparently good this Liverpool squad is, no reason in my mind to think Spurs (or even Everton for that matter) can't finish above them for the 7th time in 8 seasons. All this talk of 'but we're playing shit and still only X off top 4' very reminiscent of the situation we've had at manager junctures in the past. Aside from the Arsenal game, Liverpool have looked anything but worthy of points this season and it's only a matter of time as the spread of points per position increases that they would or will get found out if things don't change swiftly under Klopp.

Still relevant

Personally, I'll leave the arguments about which players are better etc to others (and their are many willing to go into battle over this ), just found it an interesting statement given at the beginning of the year it seemed cut and dry to even me that Liverpool had the better squad on paper. What it does go to prove so far - and things may still change but I actually somewhat doubt it - is that the cohesion of a squad is something you just cannot measure by looking at a list of names alone. Liverpool may appear to have more recognizable players, but Spurs have had time to enable a manager to do his work and is proving to be damn good at developing maximum potential from his team. It's still too early for Klopp. The Liverpool squad is clearly flawed as a group, for all of having 6 strikers they don't appear to have fixed the defensive issues that had plagued them since the Rodgers days. Klopp will need more time.

I've said it before time and time again but these owners are bad news. They may not be Gillette/Hicks level but they are still bad news. Either that or they are surrounded by people who are just totally inept.

For all our defensive and GK frailties, we were 1 striker away from getting into the top 4, make no mistake about it.  This team is streets ahead of Man Utd and on its day (a fully fit squad etc ) better than Spurs.  With the stadium progress, Klopp factor, etc, this was a great opportunity for the club to get back in the top 4 and give Klopp a great chance to rebuild in the summer with CL football to offer potential prospects.

We've had this well known problem with strikers since say August. To not have signed someone, even on loan, to get us over the line (hell, we still got 3 cups and were so close to 4th), is just unbelievably daft, and yet again, is another decision in long line of catostrophic decisions the board have made, yet no one is taking blame. Its all trial and error style boardroom decisions. We've signed 3 strikers over the years who clearly do not fit our style of play, Carroll, Balotelli and now Benteke. No one in the real world would make 3 expensive mistakes and still be in the job.

Furthermore, I would like to know what our strategy was going into Jan transfer window.  Was it all about Texieira?  Did we have a plan B?  Was signing a forward even on the agenda?

Arsenal have an 'almost' goal machine in Giroud yet people still talk of them needing to sign a prolific striker.

We had no one since August and still no one after a transfer window with no serious attempts made.  

Am i missing something here??

What I've been saying for some time mate but apparently we should be grateful because they let Rodgers spunk the Sterling and Suarez money on mid table fodder.

Klopp should walk away if the best we can offer him is Caulker on loan over a transfer window.

Henderson out for the rest of the season