winner mentality?

Our friend Deisler said Brazil would win because, like Germany, they have a winner mentality.

everyone thought Argentina would win, including me. is that the explanation for this Copa América title?

Partly, but IMO the main reason was just the teams' performances on the day - Brazil got the tactical 1-up against Argentina, and Argentina panicked and didn't play anywhere near their best.

Tim Vickery said something like when Brazil be the underdogs a spirit emerges that guides them against all odds...

There is a difference between being confident and being arrogant.

mongrel hawk wrote:Our friend Deisler said Brazil would win because, like Germany, they have a winner mentality.

everyone thought Argentina would win, including me. is that the explanation for this Copa América title?

I think you may be Deislers first ever friend Todo, but dont ever take anything writes seriously.

don't take Olé so seriously. They are better than any Brazilian sports magazine. And they are funny.

I don't think the Argentines were arrogant.

sheva7 wrote:There is a difference between being confident and being arrogant.

I don't. he's just a kid and I think he's funny.

Bon voyage Rossi wrote:

mongrel hawk wrote:Our friend Deisler said Brazil would win because, like Germany, they have a winner mentality.

everyone thought Argentina would win, including me. is that the explanation for this Copa América title?

I think you may be Deislers first ever friend Todo, but dont ever take anything writes seriously.

I think tactics

You need someone more attacking than Heinze if your are not playing with wingers.

Because Argentina did not play with any wide men the Brazil full backs had freedom to get forward.

The Brazil CM players did not give Riquelme or Veron any space throughout the game.

mongrel hawk wrote:Our friend Deisler said Brazil would win because, like Germany, they have a winner mentality.

everyone thought Argentina would win, including me. is that the explanation for this Copa América title?

I think Germans are Argies are very similar in that they're bullies. As soon as they face someone who stands their ground against them, they in turn pee their pants just like Germany does all the time against Italia in Europe.

mongrel hawk wrote:don't take Olé so seriously. They are better than any Brazilian sports magazine. And they are funny.

I don't think the Argentines were arrogant.

sheva7 wrote:There is a difference between being confident and being arrogant.

I'm not talking about their press, I'm talking about their players. They clearly thought that they would thrash Brazil today.

Do you rember 2000 pre Olimpico? They had the dream team, bla, bla, bla. They thought that they were much better than Brazil, conceded 4 goals and couldn't qualify to the Olympics.

BTW I like Ole.

Puro wrote:
I think Germans are Argies are very similar in that they're bullies. As soon as they face someone who stands their ground against them, they in turn pee their pants just like Germany does all the time against Italia in Europe.

What a clueless comment. Italy are our traditional bogey team, no doubt, but we never "peed our pants" playing them in major competitions. A couple of those encounters are all time classic matches, especially the "match of the century" in the 1970 WC for example, which could have gone both ways.

And while Brazil seem to have problems beating France, for example, another major force of international football, we always beat them in important matches.

Every country has its bogey teams, styles they don't like to play against traditionally. Nothing to do with being afraid, that's just clueless bullshit.

Other big sports train mentality, and of course it's a big thing. Not only the factor of being the underdog etc

But what goes around in your head when taking a penalty? Being alone with the keeper? Or simply to have to guts to challenge

Dunno how much big teams train on mentality stuff, but this is a thing they all should see the profit of, hence it can be the one factor between a victory (and goals for that sake) and a loose

Tevez was fucking shite

kas wrote:Partly, but IMO the main reason was just the teams' performances on the day - Brazil got the tactical 1-up against Argentina, and Argentina panicked and didn't play anywhere near their best.

yeah like i said, argies have huge mental problems in big games, like englands

Argentina rely almost totally on Riquelme to have a good game which of course he didn't last night. Secondly, the expectation that goes with being Brazil often spurs them on to perform in the big games. Finally, Argentina seem to have a bit of a mental block when they come to play the Brazilians

Rasiak-9 wrote:Argentina rely almost totally on Riquelme to have a good game which of course he didn't last night. Secondly, the expectation that goes with being Brazil often spurs them on to perform in the big games. Finally, Argentina seem to have a bit of a mental block when they come to play the Brazilians

, its what David Platt said last night ( ), Basile doesnt seem have as much tactical ability and mainly relies on his big players to perform, and when they dont he does not have a great back up plan.

Eg. Bringing on L.Gonzalez, a DM for Cambiasso, despite in my opinion Cambiasso being the only Argentine midfielder to put in a semi decent performance.

blutgraetsche wrote:
What a clueless comment. Italy are our traditional bogey team, no doubt, but we never "peed our pants" playing them in major competitions. A couple of those encounters are all time classic matches, especially the "match of the century" in the 1970 WC for example, which could have gone both ways.

And while Brazil seem to have problems beating France, for example, another major force of international football, we always beat them in important matches.

Every country has its bogey teams, styles they don't like to play against traditionally. Nothing to do with being afraid, that's just clueless bullshit.

Alright blut! perhaps "pee their pants" was a bit harsh. In the case of Germany against Italia, you guys just choke no matter what. I remember WC 1990 after Argentina defeated Italia, I thought Germany was the biggest winner after that result since I KNEW you wouldn't have beaten Italia, never mind beating them in their own house in a WC Final. Germany always finds a way to lose against Italia. In the USA that's called "the team chokes".

That's not exclusive to Germany, it happens everywhere. It happens to Argentina too. It happens a lot to them bully teams who feast on weaklings like San Marino putting 10+ goals past them. In my view, there's no difference winning 6-0 or by more than 10 goals.

Nice try to escape the point I made about France Puro, bully team my arse. Germany have beaten some of the very best teams of all times in their history (e.g. Hungary in 1954, and Holland in 1974), and you can't talk your way out of that I'm afraid.

Puro wrote:

mongrel hawk wrote:Our friend Deisler said Brazil would win because, like Germany, they have a winner mentality.

everyone thought Argentina would win, including me. is that the explanation for this Copa América title?

I think Germans are Argies are very similar in that they're bullies. As soon as they face someone who stands their ground against them, they in turn pee their pants just like Germany does all the time against Italia in Europe.

Tactically Basle fucked up. Aimar and Lucho Gonzalez weren't going to change anything in the team. He should have brought Crespo(yes a risk after his injury) or D.Millito(not really hot in his previous appearance) , dropped Messi to be part of midfield diamond.

Those I think at best would have just been stop gaps I don't think anything Argentina could do yesterday could have stopped that loss. Brazil choked the life out of them centrally and getting out wide and putting crosses in with no dominant striker would be a waste as Alex could defend those in his sleep.

Argies with the wonderful football so often run up against a brickwall. Like in 2002 the same happened against England. Route number one direct footy down the middle has hurt the developement as much as it has helped their national side. Brazil is still my favourite of the two because they are willing to be more open and try other tactics and learn.

blutgraetsche wrote:Nice try to escape the point I made about France Puro, bully team my arse. Germany have beaten some of the very best teams of all times in their history (e.g. Hungary in 1954, and Holland in 1974), and you can't talk your way out of that I'm afraid.

Germany's place in football is secured blut! We're just talking about certain teams that choke when they're up against someone who see them eye to eye. Germany and Argentina are like twins in that aspect.

By the way, your "dominance" over France is history, kiss that good bye. Ever since France opened the doors to the sons of their immigrants to the national team, the tie has turned. I see France beating Germany more often nowadays. Germany's bully makeup was found out blut, and there's nothing you can do about it. One just has to stand up to the bully to win.

What silly argument. Even if you take that argument seriously, it applies to Germany also, doesn't it? Germany have "opened the doors to the sons of their immigrants to the national team" also (Germany actually has the highest number of immigrants / people with non-German roots in Europe). Besides, France did that much earlier than Germany, with great players like Tigana already playing for them when we beat them in those classic matches, for example.

Every country has bogey teams they don't like to play against, including Brazil, including Argentina, including Italy, and of course including Germany. Absolutely nothing new, boo fucking hoo.

blutgraetsche wrote:

What silly argument. Even if you take that argument seriously, it applies to Germany also, doesn't it? Germany have "opened the doors to the sons of their immigrants to the national team" also (Germany actually has the highest number of immigrants / people with non-German roots in Europe). Besides, France did that much earlier than Germany, with great players like Tigana already playing for them when we beat them in those classic matches, for example.

Every country has bogey teams they don't like to play against, including Brazil, including Argentina, including Italy, and of course including Germany. Absolutely nothing new, boo fucking hoo.

Correct! However Brasil and Italia aren't bullies. Argentina and Germany are. That's why Germany takes a 1-5 can of whoop ass at home against England (England stood their ground that night, didn't show any fear, and spanked you). I remember the fear in the Germans' eyes, pure terror when they KNEW England were going toe to toe against them that night.

It's the psychology of the bully. The bully thrives on fear. If they fail to cause fear in their opponents, then fear creeps up on themselves. That's why you always lose to Italia. It's more psychology than anything else blut!

Oh dear. Now you actually sound like those deluded England fans who are still going on about a win against us, because there basically is nothing else to celebrate. Exactly the people you love to criticise and ridicule on a regular basis. Oh the irony and hyprocrisy.

Thank God that other teams don't try to "cause fear in their opponents" then Puro. It's only the 'bullying' Germans and Argies who use the psychological aspect. Yeah right.

You may need to tell yourself that because Argentina spanked Peru once again in the Copa this year, but it won't help you at all I'm afraid. This is actually the loser mentality the Germans have not, as one of the few countries in the world. We don't look for excuses, and we always respect our opponents, no matter how 'small' they may be.

I predicted a Brasil win too!

blutgraetsche wrote:Oh dear. Now you actually sound like those deluded England fans who are still going on about a win against us, because there basically is nothing else to celebrate. Exactly the people you love to criticise and ridicule on a regular basis. Oh the irony and hyprocrisy.

Thank God that other teams don't try to "cause fear in their opponents" then Puro. It's only the 'bullying' Germans and Argies who use the psychological aspect. Yeah right.

You may need to tell yourself that because Argentina spanked Peru once again in the Copa this year, but it won't help you at all I'm afraid. This is actually the loser mentality the Germans have not, as one of the few countries in the world. We don't look for excuses, and we always respect our opponents, no matter how 'small' they may be.

This is true about the Germans.............But on that day Blut, England were up against the wall and needed that win over Germany. Gloves were off your team was scared the football game told the hole story... End of story...

Still, one of the worst German teams of all times that got spanked on that night went to the final of the WC a year later. This is the difference between England and Germany in a nutshell.

Even when we are Cr@p, we do well when it really counts. There can't be a better compliment really. People say how bad the German team of 2002 was, and they are right actually, but they don't seem to understand that this only speaks for us, if anything.

blutgraetsche wrote:Still, one of the worst German teams of all times that got spanked on that night went to the final of the WC a year later. This is the difference between England and Germany in a nutshell.

Even when we are Cr@p, we do well when it really counts. There can't be a better compliment really. People say how bad the German team of 2002 was, and they are right actually, but they don't seem to understand that this only speaks for us, if anything.

This is true.....But it does showcase the point Germany in nature like to bully or use their past pedigree to an advanage over teams. When you come off the rails its a disaster.

"Past pedigree" is worthless if you have done your best to destroy your reputation in a few years, due to huge mistakes by your FA as far as youth development is concerned. This is actually nonsense Brian, and can be easily proven wrong: Last year, nobody, including most of the German media and fans, expected us to do well in the tournament. One of the reasons was the disappointing EC in 2004, and a few disappointing results in friendlies prior to the WC. Nobody believed us to cause any fear, on the contrary.

"Past pedigree" actually often does the opposite, as in England's case, when everybody (at home) still expects them to win a major tournament just because they did so once over 40 years ago.