Hargreaves Is Fans' Top Man

Bayern Munich midfielder Owen Hargreaves has been voted England's best player at the recent World Cup.

Hargreaves produced several consistent performances in midfield and at right-back under Sven-Goran Eriksson in Germany while the likes of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard did not meet expectations.

And the versatile midfielder, subjected to ridicule for much of his international career, has been identified as the most impressive player in Germany in a Football Association poll last month.

Canada-raised Hargreaves received more than 35,000 votes - just under a quarter of those polled - beating Rio Ferdinand, Joe Cole, David Beckham and John Terry.

Champions League-winner Hargreaves told thefa.com: "Any time you can have the public's support is great. Obviously before the World Cup I got a taste of the other side of it but it's far better to be on the positive side of it.

"I saw some English people when I was on holiday in Dubai and it was great. They came up to me and thanked me for working so hard.

"They just said thank you which is the best thing you can really say to someone."

People are so fickle.

Painfully so.
He really only had one good game and he was only decent at playing at right back.
Ferdinand would have been the better choice.

Kevin wrote:Painfully so.
He really only had one good game and he was only decent at playing at right back.
Ferdinand would have been the better choice.

or terry

I think it's generally agreed now that Hargreaves was England's most impressive player at the World Cup (although the fans' lamentable failure to notice how valuable he was is obviously a factor in this subsequent praise), even if that's scarcely a spectacular accolade – Terry was poor against Ecuador, while Hargreaves was virtually carrying England in their final match, and did all that could be asked from him otherwise (I would say he was a candidate for England's best player against Sweden and Ecuador too, as in whenever he played from the start), even when played out of position.

Could never be faulted for effort either, unlike plenty of his more lauded teammates, and – fittingly and symbolically – seems to be the only English player capable of taking a penalty.

Fair enough, we're just finding it amusing how he wasnt good enough for England and now suddenly he was their best player.
I'd say Ferdinand was and then Hargreaves...

So people will moan when he isnt rated...now he is and people take the piss?


who's fickle?

I agree – obviously it IS fickle, but better to recognize your mistake late than never. Credit where it's due... the abuse he got might have betrayed a tragic lack of football understanding, but even the rags had the grace to print "apologies" and the like – not that anything could make up for their disgraceful and ill-informed hate campaigns.

You don't deserve him! Well, not you guys, but the vast majority of England fans. His success will presumably alert England to the need to play at least a semi-balanced midfield...

Allez_les_rouges wrote:semi-balanced midfield

Isn't that an oxymoron? Isn't half balanced by definition unbalanced?

We'll probably go to the other bloomin' extreme now and end up with Carrick and Hargreaves, and no attacking central mid.

borocooper wrote:
who's fickle?

I was making comment at the hoards of people in general who didn't want him anywhere near the squad and kept on saying he was shit.

2/3 good games later and he's amazing.

For all its worth, I think Lennon was England's best player. Both times he came on- against TNT and Ecuador, he helped turn the game, and should have scored against Portugal after being the only England player to actually beat a man and dribble into the box...

But pretty sad how our best player in my mind played all of about 20 minutes.

Allez Rouges- to be fair, Hargreaves had hardly inspired anyone in the times he did play for england.

Lets not forget he had over 30 caps; admittedly many as substitute and many out of position- but the fact still remained that at times he did look totally pedestrian (something we can with hindsight see is a trait with Eriksson and his midfielders).

to say we dont deserve him is a little over the top- the guy hardly deserved a place in the side up until the WC- he only got in in the end because of how poorly Gerrard and Lampard played as a combo.

Obispo wrote:

borocooper wrote:
who's fickle?

I was making comment at the hoards of people in general who didn't want him anywhere near the squad and kept on saying he was shit.

2/3 good games later and he's amazing.

Yeah, well what can you expect though?

had he ever performed for England? no

People cant be blamed because of lack of coverage of a league....from what they have seen, he was poor.

Now they've seen him properly, they give him credit.

The Real White Pele wrote:For all its worth, I think Lennon was England's best player. Both times he came on- against TNT and Ecuador, he helped turn the game, and should have scored against Portugal after being the only England player to actually beat a man and dribble into the box...

But pretty sad how our best player in my mind played all of about 20 minutes.

Allez Rouges- to be fair, Hargreaves had hardly inspired anyone in the times he did play for england.

Lets not forget he had over 30 caps; admittedly many as substitute and many out of position- but the fact still remained that at times he did look totally pedestrian (something we can with hindsight see is a trait with Eriksson and his midfielders).

to say we dont deserve him is a little over the top- the guy hardly deserved a place in the side up until the WC- he only got in in the end because of how poorly Gerrard and Lampard played as a combo.

To be fair, DOwning made just as much impact...if not more than Lennon did in the T&T game.

borocooper wrote:

Obispo wrote:

borocooper wrote:
who's fickle?

I was making comment at the hoards of people in general who didn't want him anywhere near the squad and kept on saying he was shit.

2/3 good games later and he's amazing.

Yeah, well what can you expect though?

had he ever performed for England? no

People cant be blamed because of lack of coverage of a league....from what they have seen, he was poor.

Now they've seen him properly, they give him credit.

Totally agree Coop. Fact is, he really was unimpressive in all his 30plus caps for England. Yes he sometimes played out of position and yes he was often a sub, but a truly decent player will show glimpses- I cant remember a glimpse from Hargreaves pre WC. I think the stick he took actually helped him raise his game on the international scene. That and playing in the position he enjoys of course...

Gerrard did, and still does get stick for not producing his Liverpool performances for England, yet in how ever many games for England, hs too has only really played his favourite position on the odd occassion. So its not half as clear cut as "Hargreaves plays in Germany, we dont like/watch german football, so we dont like Hargreaves" situation that some seem to be bandying around....play well in an England shirt and it really doesnt matter where you play

IMO Gerrard got a lot of stick around Euro2004, when his performances were clearly substandard.

He has been OK since then. Not great by his own high standards but on balance deserves his place in the squad. He had a good world cup, again not great but 2 goals and solid performances.

But to be perfectly honest if he never played for England again I'd not cry. Club over country every time.

Gerrard is THE man, if he has Hargreaves/Carrick covering him.

In 2004 he had to do all that work for Lampard.

On his day he really is a truly WC player, and it would be unthinkable not playing him, we all know that.

Fair enough, I see the point about his never having wildly impressed for England before, but I'd have thought that the failure of Gerrard and Lampard ever to consistently live up to their reputations in an England shirt, or ever be able to play together, might've been the teensiest bit more important/worthy as a criticism.

And surely it should have been obvious England would need at least one defensive midfielder against half-decent teams? that it might not be ludicrous for a Munich first-teamer to get into the national squad? For goodness' sake, most national sides are used to having at least a few players playing abroad...

(Yes, of course "semi-balanced" is a bit of an oxymoron but I suppose I'm trying to say "halfway towards being...")

It was just depressing to see idiots like Wright and Hansen leaping on a couple of occasions when he lost the ball or failed to intercept successfully in a warm-up game as if it "proved" the point – people paid to be experts comprehensively failing to see the point/necessity of having a hardworking defensive midfielder (who if they have a game like Hargreaves will always make the odd "mistake" anyway). But good to see the balance redressed in the end, and presumably you guys will be keen to see what the midfield looks like when he's one of the first names on the team-sheet...

Congrats Owen. Too little too late.

I though Ferdinand deserved it myself. That's 2 world cups he's been to and his been near-flawless in both.

Hargreaves was actually a regular member of Englands 1st XI going into the 2002 WC, but injury curtailed that. It's been a long time coming but he's in the XI where he belongs - I never lost the faith in him.

I dont think anyone lost faith in him, people had no faith in him at all

borocooper wrote:I dont think anyone lost faith in him, people had no faith in him at all

Touché!

He's the best DM around for England ( I dont think Parker is a classical DM that sits , he surely has some attacking skills) and teams usually need these kind of players so when he did his job people were impressed.

He's a good player though , does his job efficiently nothing more nothing less.

people=fickle yes but FULL VINDICATION FOR THIS BOARD. we stuck by him when nobody else did.

I can't remember the number of posts Otto posted about how good he actually was on 606. Finally the idiots see the light.

Samba De Baiano wrote:I can't remember the number of posts Otto posted about how good he actually was on 606. Finally the idiots see the light.

to be fair though otto says every german/german based player is brilliant... once you sift through the minefield u often find a bit of wisdom

COTR wrote:

Samba De Baiano wrote:I can't remember the number of posts Otto posted about how good he actually was on 606. Finally the idiots see the light.

to be fair though otto says every german/german based player is brilliant... once you sift through the minefield u often find a bit of wisdom

Is there some kind of Otto fan club taking off? I can't remember him saying that much about Hargreaves but then you have to get through so much dross that you give up before you hit anything sensible. Hargreaves was immense in the Portugal game and won over a lot of converts. Put him in the right role and he delivers. Thank goodness SGE has gone and Terry Venables looks as if he will be contributing his tactical nouse to the England team.

Terry Venables was saying in punditry that errard and Lampard could still work in a 442

Reading that Venables comment makes me have to repeat that England's problem is not the players. Perhaps you may not have the depth of one of three or four national sides out there, but you have a capable team where even the squad players play in one of the big leagues. You even have a couple of players alot of teams would be jealous of.
This should be enough to reach semifianls of big tournaments and further.

Englands problem is from higher up: the management & the ones who appointed them.


I'm gobsmacked to read that big guys are still trying to convince people that midfield of two of them can/will work.

poiuy1 wrote:Terry Venables was saying in punditry that errard and Lampard could still work in a 442

arghhh where was he saying this.... if i remember correctly was he not strongly against it throughout the WC...

COTR wrote:

poiuy1 wrote:Terry Venables was saying in punditry that errard and Lampard could still work in a 442

arghhh where was he saying this.... if i remember correctly was he not strongly against it throughout the WC...

and he was right. It's one or the other. I see Frank is back scoring for Chelsea after missing all those chances in the WC.

Hargreaves could never settle in the great poser midfield squad under Eriksson.........Becks, Gerrard and Lampard all required baby sitters. Gerrard covering Lampard for years was so negative. Cut the stardom crap Hargreaves is a top support player now I hope the england fans see him as someone that brings out the best in the players around him.


-------------------------Robinson----------------------------

----------Ferdinand--------Terry------------Brown---------

------------------------Hargreaves---------------------------

-------------Gerrard-------------------Lampard-------------

-Lennon-----------------------------------------------J.Cole-

---------------------Bent---------Ashton---------------------