Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

+61
NCFC
Riviera
Rasiak-9
briz
bluenine
Effenberg
BoBo Vieri 32
elbecko
Juligen
forza_rossi
Green Arrow
The Pröfessör
Chap
OP9
quack
Batman
Sgoater1
Rosy
TM
Dwarf
Kroos
shazlx
Puro
SuperMario
Calidad
110%
Fey
Glenarch of the Glen
Luso
Bashmachkin
Roger Hunt
Football Genius
Allez les rouges
Isco Benny
Pierre Littbarski
Machiavel
Di Caniooooo!
fcb
robert
DD
The Easter Bunny
Arnaud loves Catherine
Brian2468
debaser
S4P
Liverpool 0 - 1 Man U
DS
Deluded F*ck™
The-Frank-Tavern
L r d hAsta LueGo
Tweesus
Kimbo
COTR
EMP
Luis
Deano
Z
DeLux
dont panic!
Parks lives
Sheffield gunner
65 posters

    England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:00 pm

    Pierre Littbarski wrote:
    Tweedle wrote:Can someone remind me why Lennon isn't in the squad?

    b) I think he has only recently returned from injury.

    ok

    Much more likely to be the second claim, unless you consider SWP has firmly nailed the right wing position for England
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:00 pm

    Pierre Littbarski wrote:
    Tweedle wrote:Can someone remind me why Lennon isn't in the squad?

    a) 'cos he's not all that

    b) I think he has only recently returned from injury.

    Well, he's better than Downing.

    You watch MsWankstain though, if he brings on a winger sub, it'll be Downing Erm
    Kimbo
    Kimbo


    Number of posts : 38171
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Kimbo Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:21 pm

    I've no problem with that, atleast Downing can deliver a good ball into the box. <Ale>
    The-Frank-Tavern
    The-Frank-Tavern


    Number of posts : 8505
    Age : 55
    Supports : Atlético de Madrid
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by The-Frank-Tavern Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:25 pm

    Krimbo wrote:I've no problem with that, atleast Downing can deliver a good ball into the box. <Ale>
    ok downing is limited but lennon is just a pace merchant whose delivery is shite
    COTR
    COTR


    Number of posts : 26580
    Age : 40
    Supports : Liverp8-0l
    Favourite Player : Xabier Alonso, Fabio Aurelio, Daniel Agger, Pepe Reina, Alberto Aquilani, Elano, Luis Suarez, Glen Johnson
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by COTR Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:31 pm

    The-Frankinsense-Tavern wrote:
    Krimbo wrote:I've no problem with that, atleast Downing can deliver a good ball into the box. <Ale>
    ok downing is limited but lennon is just a pace merchant whose delivery is shite

    a pace merchant with trickery and good ball control who mades defenders look stupid

    pace is one of the best weapons you can have as a footballer and lennon also has great technique to go with it
    Kimbo
    Kimbo


    Number of posts : 38171
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Kimbo Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:35 pm

    Harsh frank, very harsh. Like coater said he has good close control. I'd prefer a slow ball player myself that can deliver a killer ball, pace will only get you so far against good defenders. <Ale>
    The-Frank-Tavern
    The-Frank-Tavern


    Number of posts : 8505
    Age : 55
    Supports : Atlético de Madrid
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by The-Frank-Tavern Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:36 pm

    but he consistantly fails to deliver a telling cross or final ball whereas at least downing can actually croos a ball. i honestly think lennon is one of the most over rated players around at the mo (except for kimbo)
    COTR
    COTR


    Number of posts : 26580
    Age : 40
    Supports : Liverp8-0l
    Favourite Player : Xabier Alonso, Fabio Aurelio, Daniel Agger, Pepe Reina, Alberto Aquilani, Elano, Luis Suarez, Glen Johnson
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by COTR Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:42 pm

    The-Frankinsense-Tavern wrote:but he consistantly fails to deliver a telling cross or final ball whereas at least downing can actually croos a ball. i honestly think lennon is one of the most over rated players around at the mo (except for kimbo)

    you also think torres is useless and he is totally proving you wrong on that one. sorry couldn't help myself Wink

    lennon is an excellent player and certainly better than SWP whose place he will regain when he gets back to full fitness
    The-Frank-Tavern
    The-Frank-Tavern


    Number of posts : 8505
    Age : 55
    Supports : Atlético de Madrid
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by The-Frank-Tavern Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:42 pm

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/internationals/7090216.stm

    the new sicknote is out again
    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:49 pm

    The-Frankinsense-Tavern wrote:but he consistantly fails to deliver a telling cross or final ball whereas at least downing can actually croos a ball. i honestly think lennon is one of the most over rated players around at the mo (except for kimbo)

    Sometimes you do talk some $h!t Frank.

    For a start, nobody is overrating Lennon at the moment, because he's harldy played since a long term injury.

    Before that, he was integral in helping Spurs to 5th placed finishes in 2 seasons. Berbatov looks twice the player with Lennon in the team. I cant even be bothered to bring in Video evidence courtesy of youtube that more than dispels any similarities the guy has with pace merchants of the game. Feel free to check it out if you want, otherwise carry on with your delusions. No one is saying he's World Class. He's still young and a lot to achieve, but certainly even a fucktard with half a brain can see the potential on the ball; crossing/distributing can be learnt; we see evidence of that everywhere <Ale>
    Kimbo
    Kimbo


    Number of posts : 38171
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Kimbo Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:52 pm

    Nobody is overrating him, yet he's going to walk straight back into the England team? scratch Confounded!
    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:55 pm

    Krimbo wrote:Nobody is overrating him, yet he's going to walk straight back into the England team? scratch Confounded!

    ??

    Who or when has that been said? Im pretty certain Lennon was brought up asking why he wasnt in the squad and the answer was that he has only just come back from injury.

    By the way, Stewart Downing's crossing is useless if he carries on doing it from deep like he has done recently for England. He needs to beat a man and get closer to the byline first
    Kimbo
    Kimbo


    Number of posts : 38171
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Kimbo Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:57 pm

    The Real Martin Troll wrote:
    Krimbo wrote:Nobody is overrating him, yet he's going to walk straight back into the England team? scratch Confounded!

    ??

    Who or when has that been said? Im pretty certain Lennon was brought up asking why he wasnt in the squad and the answer was that he has only just come back from injury.

    By the way, Stewart Downing's crossing is useless if he carries on doing it from deep like he has done recently for England. He needs to beat a man and get closer to the byline first

    COTR wrote:
    lennon is an excellent player and certainly better than SWP whose place he will regain when he gets back to full fitness
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:03 pm

    Out of Lennon, Young and Downing, I'd easily want Young to play.

    Its all an illusion that Downig can cross well. Has anyone ever seen him put in a decent cross in an England shirt?
    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:04 pm

    COTR has got a point though- its not like SWP's place is nailed on (he was awful against Russia and pretty average against Estonia), and Lennon has only been back a few weeks and already scored and involved in Spurs' gradual renaissance. So its not an absurd prediction to make
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:06 pm

    SWP had a great to start to the season and back then, I thought he fully deserved to be given a chance, but since then he's gone back to his old Chelsea self and not really done anything of note.

    Personally, I think an in form SWP is better than Lennon, but he's so often out of form that I'd rather see Lennon play.
    Pierre Littbarski
    Pierre Littbarski


    Number of posts : 12424
    Age : 114
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Pierre Littbarski Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:06 pm

    Tweedle wrote:Out of Lennon, Young and Downing, I'd easily want Young to play.

    <Ale>
    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:07 pm

    Tweedle wrote:Out of Lennon, Young and Downing, I'd easily want Young to play.

    Its all an illusion that Downig can cross well. Has anyone ever seen him put in a decent cross in an England shirt?

    Downing plays on the left, whilst Young and Lennon are primarily right wingers. So long as Joe Cole remains fit he is number 1 on the left; I wouldnt like to see Young or Lennon used on the left yet personally, they both need to mature their games a lot more, otherwise they might end up like Dyer who was criminally wasted on the left and judgement passed before he ever had a chance to do his thing at International level
    avatar
    Parks lives


    Number of posts : 34521
    Age : 43
    Favourite Player : The Ginger One
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Parks lives Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:09 pm

    Young plays on the left for Villa, Pele.


    J. Cole -- Gerrard -- Barry/Hargreaves -- Young
    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:10 pm

    Tweedle wrote:

    Personally, I think an in form SWP is better than Lennon, but he's so often out of form that I'd rather see Lennon play.

    Lennon is years behind SWP in terms of progression - I expect Lennon to be a better player when he is 25 than SWP currently is <Ale>
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:10 pm

    The Real Martin Troll wrote:
    Downing plays on the left, whilst Young and Lennon are primarily right wingers. So long as Joe Cole remains fit he is number 1 on the left; I wouldnt like to see Young or Lennon used on the left yet personally, they both need to mature their games a lot more, otherwise they might end up like Dyer who was criminally wasted on the left and judgement passed before he ever had a chance to do his thing at International level

    Yong's primarily both mate. He's played more on the left than he has on the right anyhow so to say he's a right winger seems somewhat bizarre.

    Lennon I agree on.
    Pierre Littbarski
    Pierre Littbarski


    Number of posts : 12424
    Age : 114
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Pierre Littbarski Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:21 pm

    Young is much better on the left.

    I've never understood the English fascination with a left footed left winger.

    OK - so Giggs and Robben are great but the hardest thing to deal with is a right footed player with a decent left foot.

    Eg Overmars, Young, C.Ronaldo.

    Ribery is much btter on the left and I thought Figo's best football was 99/00 when he was playing left mid for Barca nd Portugal.
    Isco Benny
    Isco Benny


    Number of posts : 19647
    Age : 44
    Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
    Favourite Player : Don't cha wish your left back was BAE? Don't cha
    Registration date : 2006-08-08

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Isco Benny Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:27 pm

    Thats good news- I was under the belief Young was played mostly on the right.

    Pierre- its not whether they are left or right footed, its more with what position they are comfortable playing in. Joe Cole is proof that a right footer can do the business on the left for England. Even though its not his natural position, he is a bit of one off- there are plenty of players before Cole who were dumped on the left and were Cr@p because they were totally unfamiliar with the role. Young should definitely get given the chance if he plays regularly on the left for club
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:29 pm

    Well, RVP plays on the right of a front three for Holland for the exact same reason.

    Basically, an in-curling cross is a lot harder to deal with for the defence than an outcurling one.

    Its the same for shooting because the ball can be hit outside of the pos and curved in - the keeper has no chance
    Allez les rouges
    Allez les rouges


    Number of posts : 8098
    Age : 108
    Supports : Deutschland, Arsenal
    Favourite Player : Jens Lehmann
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Allez les rouges Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:37 pm

    This is bloody interesting – instructive to compare it with the German national situation, where the current Lahm/Jansen first-choice full-back pairing sees Philipp switched back to his natural right-hand side with the left-footed Jansen coming in. Blut was always insistent that this was the way forward, with genuine width (and deep crosses etc) from the full-backs crucial in the absence of natural wingers, and that this was the best way to maximize their attacking potential, and I do basically agree, but still didn't think the value of inswinging balls from the left that Lahm could deliver when he was playing there should be dismissed, at least as another option...

    Be interesting to run your suggestion by him Tweedle (esp. with reference to RVP) and see if he has any time for it, if that is he ever comes back.

    Sorry for going off-topic Wink
    The-Frank-Tavern
    The-Frank-Tavern


    Number of posts : 8505
    Age : 55
    Supports : Atlético de Madrid
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by The-Frank-Tavern Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:41 pm

    i find it pathetic that these players aren't equally proficient with both feet ffs they practice every day.
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:52 pm

    @ Allez

    You still need natural width I think - if you plan on playing say the midfielders on the opposite flank to their foot, then IMO you need the two full backs to play with the strongest foot relating to their wing.

    If you play two full backs with opposite feet then IMO the wingers should maybe be correctly footed for the wing.

    What would be interesting though is to play swapsies - ie have one wing where the full back is the wrong footed and one where its the winger, and then see how it works.

    I'd argue that its better to have the winger with the wrong foot rather than the full back, although either way it would work. - if its the full back with the wrong foot, then they can cut inside and make runs between the full back and central defender that the correctly footed winger can feed balls through to.

    Sorry for making it so confusing Wink
    Pierre Littbarski
    Pierre Littbarski


    Number of posts : 12424
    Age : 114
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Pierre Littbarski Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:01 pm

    Best bet is an Overmars/Ribery/Figo at left mid with a Bridge/Grosso at LB to overlap when LM comes inside ok
    Tweesus
    Tweesus


    Number of posts : 34851
    Age : 41
    Registration date : 2006-08-06

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Tweesus Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:08 pm

    Robert Pires wasn't a bad right footed left winger either, although interestingly he linked up with Henry and not Cole to make himself effective.

    For England, I'd love to see how Bridge and Young would work down the left.
    Pierre Littbarski
    Pierre Littbarski


    Number of posts : 12424
    Age : 114
    Registration date : 2006-08-07

    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Pierre Littbarski Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:41 pm

    Tweedle wrote:Robert Pires wasn't a bad right footed left winger either, although interestingly he linked up with Henry and not Cole to make himself effective.

    For England, I'd love to see how Bridge and Young would work down the left.

    Oh yes.

    But that won't happen because Ashley Cole is great going forward.

    Sponsored content


    England squad for Austria and Croatia - Page 4 Empty Re: England squad for Austria and Croatia

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sat Nov 02, 2024 5:37 pm