Black German Talent

Was Charles Gyamfi the first black player to play top flight football in Germany. He played for Fortuna Dusseldorf in 1960, returning to Ghana in 1961. He was definitely the first African to play at top level in Germany. Since then Abedi Pele played for 1860 Munich towards the end of his career and the German -born Tony Baffoe played for Fortuna Dusseldorf, among others. Baffoe played in late 80s and early 90s at top level. He chose to play at international level for Ghana. Is he the first German-born black player to play at top level?

Since then Gerald Asamoah, Kevin Prince Boateng and David Odonkor have broken through. Are there any other significant players that I have missed? Why do you think that it has taken so long for them to come through, or are there other reasons? Are there any black coaches at top level in Germany? Are any coming through? If not when do you think the first will come through and who do you think it will be?

And before Otto detects a pattern he doesn't like I will be doing this with other countries later.

It's taken a long time for black players to come through in the Bundesliga and national team simply because Germany does not have the same history with Africa as somewhere like Britain or the US for example. The influx of African people in the US and UK has been going on for hundreds of years starting with the slave trade. Therefore the integration of black people in general society has had a head-start there compared with Germany.

The global society we now live in (Western Europe in particular) has opened the door to many foreign nationals due to immigration, asylum and freedom of movement laws. This is why you are now seeing black players representing Germany and Russia I think as well.

HSV and Dortmund have several black german youth players coming through. In fact, I think there are quite a few. Jermaine Jones is another.

It's worth to mention though, that Germany featured a black international before the English NT. Erwin Kostedde, who was born to an Afro-American GI, played for West Germany in the mid 70s. He also played for Dortmund and Bremen and he's the all-time top-scorer of Kickers Offenbach.

Jimmy Hartwig is another example to name here. Also born to an Afro-American GI, he then played for Hamburg and won with them three German championships and the European Cup.

Well...Gunther is German

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4bXBqXsF28

Metze's Haeschen wrote:It's worth to mention though, that Germany featured a black international before the English NT. Erwin Kostedde, who was born to an Afro-American GI, played for West Germany in the mid 70s. He also played for Dortmund and Bremen and he's the all-time top-scorer of Kickers Offenbach.

Jimmy Hartwig is another example to name here. Also born to an Afro-American GI, he then played for Hamburg and won with them three German championships and the European Cup.

Thanks Haeschen and Isar. Didn't know any of that. Precisely the sort of stuff I was looking for. Not a lot available on either Gyamfi or Baffoe either. Will check on this, but although Gyamfi was the first I think another Ghanaian player came after him pretty rapidly. Do any of you have links on the players that you mentioned. Was Gyamfi the first black man to play in Germany?

@EMP: What about Otto Addo ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Addo ) and Anthony Yeboah ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Yeboah ) ?

Otto Addo is an interesting one. Like Baffoe he wa born in Germany, played there, but chose to play internationally for Ghana. Yeboah certainly counts as one of the best black players to play in Germany. How do Germans feel about him now? Did he encourage young black talent to come through?

What about coaching? Are there any black coaches, or any learning the trade? Pretty sad the way things turned out for both Kostedde and Hatrwig. Isn't there anything to look after old players in Germany?

One of the best black player ever to have played in Germany was also Jay Jay Okocha; in 1993 he won the Goal of the Year award for his dazzling dribbling.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC3s7hJDK6o

I found an article on Kostedde
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/internationals/they-have-forgotten-kostedde-and-me-667303.html

And another one on Gyamfi; it's in German unfortunately, but worth a read. Starts at p. 12.
http://www2.fortuna-duesseldorf.de/fileadmin/media/fa/703.pdf

Metze's Haeschen wrote:One of the best black player ever to have played in Germany was also Jay Jay Okocha; in 1993 he won the Goal of the Year award for his dazzling dribbling.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC3s7hJDK6o

Nice one !

Das ganze Stadion brüllte:"Schieß,Schieß,Schieß..."........das werde ich mein Leben nicht vergessen!!!!Einer der größten Momente im Waldstadion!!!

hehe : sounds so instantly recognisable

How important are players like Gyamfi, Abedi Pele, Tony Yeboah, and Jay Jay Okocha in developing black German talent such as Odonkor, Asamoah, Jones, Addo, etc. Are German clubs looking to bring in more African players?

Okocha plays for Hull now. They want him to extend his contract, but he's been injured and is talking about retiring at the end of the season.

EMP wrote:How important are players like Gyamfi, Abedi Pele, Tony Yeboah, and Jay Jay Okocha in developing black German talent such as Odonkor, Asamoah, Jones, Addo, etc. Are German clubs looking to bring in more African players?

They got Nando Rafael for free, because he couldn't get a Dutch passport.

Incredible story *why* he didn't get a passport : he was staying over at neighbours watching football, when he returned home he found his whole family slaughtered.....to have gotten a passport he would have had to be present to witness it all

We're ruled by c**ts

At Axe: Are you sure about that? The link below implies that it was illegal for Ajax to play him because he was an asylum seeker. Is that true? How do they expect them to survive if they can't work? Ridiculous law that forces them onto welfare or something like it. Not surprised he went to Germany. I know he has played at youth level for Germany, but how close is he to a full cap?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/low/tv_and_radio/world_football/2188824.stm

EMP wrote:At Axe: Are you sure about that?

Yep, quite sure : it's a bloody disgrace.

EMP wrote: The link below implies that it was illegal for Ajax to play him because he was an asylum seeker. Is that true? How do they expect them to survive if they can't work? Ridiculous law that forces them onto welfare or something like it. Not surprised he went to Germany. I know he has played at youth level for Germany, but how close is he to a full cap?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/low/tv_and_radio/world_football/2188824.stm

It was illegal because he didn't have a "staying permit" and thus couldn't get a working permit.

His family was slaughtered when he was 8, but the idiot powers that be over here judged that he was an economical immigrant : if he had witnessed the slaughter he would have been a "sincere" refugee....

On that basis he couldn't get a visa/passport/staying permit and had to leave Holland. The Germans in typical fashion immediately gave him a passport, naturalized him and put him in their U21. I have no problem with that though, because Nando should be allowed to stay in Europe

If you can understand it :

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nando_Rafael

Can't understand Dutch, but I'll take your word for it. Utterly ridiculous decision.

@Germans: Is Kevin Prince Boateng out of contention at international level now?

EMP wrote:@Germans: Is Kevin Prince Boateng out of contention at international level now?

Our U21 had a youth tournament in Portugal last year and rumour has it that KPB caused some trouble there; it was never confirmed by the DFB though, but he was constantly overlooked by our U21 manager since then, so there might be some truth to it. It's actually a pity; I've always enjoyed watching him play for Hertha BSC, but he's having some serious attitude problems. He's not playing much for Tottenham either and therefore no option for the German NT at the moment.

His younger brother Jérôme is doing fairly well at Hamburg though. He's also a U21 international.

Metze's Haeschen wrote:

EMP wrote:@Germans: Is Kevin Prince Boateng out of contention at international level now?

Our U21 had a youth tournament in Portugal last year and rumour has it that KPB caused some trouble there; it was never confirmed by the DFB though, but he was constantly overlooked by our U21 manager since then, so there might be some truth to it. It's actually a pity; I've always enjoyed watching him play for Hertha BSC, but he's having some serious attitude problems. He's not playing much for Tottenham either and therefore no option for the German NT at the moment.

His younger brother Jérôme is doing fairly well at Hamburg though. He's also a U21 international.

Thanks Metze's Haeschen: Any idea what he did and where he is likely to go as it seems pretty clear he's not wanted at Spurs? Why does Baffoe get no credit or love in Germany. He was German-born, opted to play for Ghana, but still played for German clubs including Fortuna Dusseldorf.

Boatend allegedly told his team-mates to stop playing well so they did not proceed any further in the tournament and could go home earlier

an egotistical Pr!ck

his brother is at HSV now though

+

one of the hottest striker TALENTS in German football now

http://www.weltfussball.de/spieler_profil.php?id=74526

26-Otto-19 wrote:Boatend allegedly told his team-mates to stop playing well so they did not proceed any further in the tournament and could go home earlier

an egotistical Pr!ck

his brother is at HSV now though

+

one of the hottest striker TALENTS in German football now

http://www.weltfussball.de/spieler_profil.php?id=74526

Really? I find that hard to believe. Surely if there wa proof of this the German FA would just say, that is it he never plays for Germany again under any circumstances.

you don't just get kicked out of the Nationalmannschaft FOR NO REASON

the rumours make sense

the DFB does not want to aggrevate the situation any further by making public announcement ; people would just hate him and turn on him

this way the matter is closed

Boateng is an egotistical guy; the kind of lad who wears gigantic designer sun glasses at night

he once gave an interview to Sportbild in the most ludicrous outfit, seemginly shouting, look at me, I'm a superstar Pr!ck, but what are ye gonna do about it

Berlin have now thrown out MANY of their TALENTS because most of them adhered to the Ghetto look and behaved accordingly

the new mantra is : talents with a sound character

EMP wrote:

26-Otto-19 wrote:Boatend allegedly told his team-mates to stop playing well so they did not proceed any further in the tournament and could go home earlier

an egotistical Pr!ck

his brother is at HSV now though

+

one of the hottest striker TALENTS in German football now

http://www.weltfussball.de/spieler_profil.php?id=74526

Really? I find that hard to believe. Surely if there wa proof of this the German FA would just say, that is it he never plays for Germany again under any circumstances.

Agree with Otto here. Why should the DFB confirm that? It was a little youth tournament without any relevance. He's a young player and allowed to make mistakes. There is no reason to permanently ban him from the NT.

And whatever gave you the idea that Baffoe gets no respect/credit/love in Germany? He had his own TV show in the past, his little sister is a known actress as well btw, and during the ACN he gave lots of interviews to German TV stations who all praised his good work for the Cup.

Boateng

Hoping he can break into our first team this season, I like the look of the guy

[quote="Metze's Haeschen"]

EMP wrote:

26-Otto-19 wrote:Boatend allegedly told his team-mates to stop playing well so they did not proceed any further in the tournament and could go home earlier

an egotistical Pr!ck

his brother is at HSV now though

+

one of the hottest striker TALENTS in German football now

http://www.weltfussball.de/spieler_profil.php?id=74526

Really? I find that hard to believe. Surely if there wa proof of this the German FA would just say, that is it he never plays for Germany again under any circumstances.

Agree with Otto here. Why should the DFB confirm that? It was a little youth tournament without any relevance. He's a young player and allowed to make mistakes. There is no reason to permanently ban him from the NT.

And whatever gave you the idea that Baffoe gets no respect/credit/love in Germany? He had his own TV show in the past, his little sister is a known actress as well btw, and during the ACN he gave lots of interviews to German TV stations who all praised his good work for the Cup.[/quote]

It was that he was alleged to have told his teammates to lose so they could go home early that I found hard to believe. If he did that it is more than just a little mistake; it is an unacceptable attitude. You could say not far from match-fixing. That's why I thought the FA would come down hard on it and should if he actually said that.

Regarding Baffoe, I started a thread about him previously and what he does in Germany a while back and nobody answered. I've mentioned him subsequently and mention of him has been greeted with a deafening silence until now, so I assumed that none of the German posters have any respect or love for him. Glad I was wrong as I met him in Ghana and found him to be a very articulate and interesting person. He has some interesting views on several topics including Germany.

Senor Woody wrote:Boateng

Hoping he can break into our first team this season, I like the look of the guy

Is that likely?