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Pierre Littbarski
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Formerly known as sheva7
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Ricardo Jol
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fcb
33 posters

    Weekend Winners and Losers

    fcb
    fcb


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    Weekend Winners and Losers Empty Weekend Winners and Losers

    Post by fcb Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:36 pm

    May as well start this thread ourselves, because it's obvious what will be the main feature of this column when F365 publish it on Monday.

    Wawawewa, wow, wow, wow...last year everyone talked about how Liverpool were awful in the mini-league between the Big 4, but this year they've already got 6 points in that, and in some style - comeback win against Man. Utd. without Gerrard and Torres, and a win *at* Chelsea without Torres, ending their 28295729752 game unbeaten streak.

    People may pick Hull beating Arsenal, but I honestly think this is the result of the season so far. Massive implications of course, and now Liverpool and their fans can't hide or show false modesty about their title chances anymore. In fact, the only negative of today's win is that if Liverpool now fail to at least be involved in the title race until the end, it will be even more embarrassing.

    We can't ignore the luck factor either...when the rub of the green goes your way, when deflections go into goal, when the odd 50-50 decision is your way, when you score multiple late/injury-time winners...it's all part of the package of becoming champions in any competition.

    And Man. Utd. will now rue their draw yesterday even more. Early days, but looks like we'll definitely have a 3 horse race this year Ale
    L.r.d
    L.r.d


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    Post by L.r.d Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:42 pm

    Well not really. Would rue the draw if Chelsea won and puled further away. But now it doesn't seem so bad. Today was a great result for us. Chelsea have a lot of quality to come back while Liverpool have started well i cant see anyone worrying about them unless they are still there in March. All looks good imo.

    Big winners are Hull and Liverpool.
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:45 pm

    I'm putting Alonso into the winners section


    Martin O'Neill helped us more than he could ever imagine
    S4P
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:50 pm

    COTR wrote:I'm putting Alonso into the winners section


    Martin O'Neill helped us more than he could ever imagine

    Alonso will be in the winners section for sure. Shame, because he should have only been on the pitch for about 15 minutes. Wink
    TITO
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    Post by TITO Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:02 pm

    All hail Tottenham cheers cheers cheers
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:03 pm

    S4P - 13 wrote:
    COTR wrote:I'm putting Alonso into the winners section


    Martin O'Neill helped us more than he could ever imagine

    Alonso will be in the winners section for sure. Shame, because he should have only been on the pitch for about 15 minutes. Wink

    Question


    Go on Sp, give us the hard luck story as I have no idea what you are taking about and sincerely hope it has nothing to do with the challenge which was harshly given as a foul when he won the ball cleanly Wink
    Roger Hunt
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    Post by Roger Hunt Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:18 pm

    L.r.d wrote:while Liverpool have started well i cant see anyone worrying about them unless they are still there in March.

    Well duh Doh
    S4P
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:30 pm

    COTR wrote:
    S4P - 13 wrote:
    COTR wrote:I'm putting Alonso into the winners section


    Martin O'Neill helped us more than he could ever imagine

    Alonso will be in the winners section for sure. Shame, because he should have only been on the pitch for about 15 minutes. Wink

    Question


    Go on Sp, give us the hard luck story as I have no idea what you are taking about and sincerely hope it has nothing to do with the challenge which was harshly given as a foul when he won the ball cleanly Wink

    The tackle from behind before you scored your goal & the late tackle just after the goal. Both were worse than the Gerrard challenge which actually got a yellow card (and Ashley Cole's "foul" on Carragher)
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:32 pm

    S4P - 13 wrote:
    COTR wrote:
    S4P - 13 wrote:
    COTR wrote:I'm putting Alonso into the winners section


    Martin O'Neill helped us more than he could ever imagine

    Alonso will be in the winners section for sure. Shame, because he should have only been on the pitch for about 15 minutes. Wink

    Question


    Go on Sp, give us the hard luck story as I have no idea what you are taking about and sincerely hope it has nothing to do with the challenge which was harshly given as a foul when he won the ball cleanly Wink

    The tackle from behind before you scored your goal & the late tackle just after the goal. Both were worse than the Gerrard challenge which actually got a yellow card (and Ashley Cole's "foul" on Carragher)

    Ahh I get it now

    You were joking all along


    Clever Laughing Wink
    S4P
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    Post by S4P Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:37 pm

    No joke about it. Just watch the opening 15 minutes again if you can. You'll see what I mean and I'm sure you'll enjoy it.
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:39 pm

    S4P - 13 wrote:No joke about it. Just watch the opening 15 minutes again if you can. You'll see what I mean and I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

    Mate I was watching it and I enjoyed almost every minute Wink
    Luis
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    Post by Luis Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:41 pm

    Ashley Cole should have been sent off to be honest.
    L.r.d
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    Post by L.r.d Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:57 pm

    Roger Hunt wrote:
    L.r.d wrote:while Liverpool have started well i cant see anyone worrying about them unless they are still there in March.

    Well duh Doh

    Where as they would be Chelsea, United or Arsenal ok
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    Post by Glenarch of the Glen Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:59 pm

    WHAT?
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Sun Oct 26, 2008 6:49 pm

    Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.
    Deluded F*ck™
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Sun Oct 26, 2008 6:51 pm

    Roman Pavlyuchenko ok

    That goal will do him the world of good.
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Sun Oct 26, 2008 6:52 pm

    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    To be fair to us you won't find many posters who didn't think kuyt was shite last year. This is a guy who didn't score in the league for almost a year cyclops


    But we have faith now and he has even earned a few MOTM's outright this season


    Dirk Bubbly
    christmasborocooper
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    Post by christmasborocooper Sun Oct 26, 2008 6:54 pm

    Hip Hip Heurelho™️ wrote:Roman Pavlyuchenko ok

    That goal will do him the world of good.

    ok

    'arry will get the best out of him.
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Sun Oct 26, 2008 6:58 pm

    COTR wrote:
    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    To be fair to us you won't find many posters who didn't think kuyt was shite last year. This is a guy who didn't score in the league for almost a year cyclops


    But we have faith now and he has even earned a few MOTM's outright this season


    Dirk Bubbly

    If I was a woman, I wouldn't marry a Liverpool fan!! You lot would all dump a woman when she would get ill or got fat. I always had faith in Dirk..until death seperates us!!

    Anyway, what about Torres...second big win over a top team...and again without him!

    In Rafa we trust afro
    Chocolate Thunder
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    Post by Chocolate Thunder Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:03 pm

    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    WHAT? Doh

    When he couldn't pass complete a pass or trap a ball then he shouldn't have started and as COTR said it took him nearly a year to score an EPL goal. He was a passanger at times last season espically, Voronin scored more goals in the league than him, at least from open play.

    We all said he should be a starter in Europe when other supporters still didn't think he should last season.

    Kuytadona is playing like his first season and thats all we ever asked for... Ale

    Kalou and the Hitman game is shite... Wink Ale
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:39 pm

    Ade Alves wrote:
    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    WHAT? Doh

    When he couldn't pass complete a pass or trap a ball then he shouldn't have started and as COTR said it took him nearly a year to score an EPL goal. He was a passanger at times last season espically, Voronin scored more goals in the league than him, at least from open play.

    We all said he should be a starter in Europe when other supporters still didn't think he should last season.

    Kuytadona is playing like his first season and thats all we ever asked for... Ale

    Kalou and the Hitman game is shite... Wink Ale

    B.Kalou wasnt too bad today, he got a warm welcome!

    Kuytini scored less because Rafa uses him for everything. Wouldnt surprise me at all if he would help with the building of the new stadium!

    But it doesnt matter cause he does it for the team! He is so awesome btw a while a go some Feyenoord fans came to visit him and they could all stay in his house!! I wish i was there too, but i prefer to have some one-on-one quality time with him.

    Hitman is frecking awesome btw!
    Chocolate Thunder
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    Post by Chocolate Thunder Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:44 pm

    Fey wrote:
    Ade Alves wrote:
    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    WHAT? Doh

    When he couldn't pass complete a pass or trap a ball then he shouldn't have started and as COTR said it took him nearly a year to score an EPL goal. He was a passanger at times last season espically, Voronin scored more goals in the league than him, at least from open play.

    We all said he should be a starter in Europe when other supporters still didn't think he should last season.

    Kuytadona is playing like his first season and thats all we ever asked for... Ale

    Kalou and the Hitman game is shite... Wink Ale

    B.Kalou wasnt too bad today, he got a warm welcome!

    Kuytini scored less because Rafa uses him for everything. Wouldnt surprise me at all if he would help with the building of the new stadium!

    But it doesnt matter cause he does it for the team! He is so awesome btw a while a go some Feyenoord fans came to visit him and they could all stay in his house!! I wish i was there too, but i prefer to have some one-on-one quality time with him.

    Hitman is frecking awesome btw!

    My Feyenoord loving(2nd club) joke of a bro loves Hitman as well. He still plays the old versions during the holidays Rolling Eyes You're all the fucking same, weirdos Laughing

    I think it is fairly average personally though the movie wasn't half bad.
    3 chins IMO.
    Kroos
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    Post by Kroos Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:50 pm

    ballack is the winner

    with ballalck chelsea had not lost
    avatar
    Glenarch of the Glen


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    Post by Glenarch of the Glen Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:51 pm

    GERMANY cheers
    Ricardo Jol
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    Post by Ricardo Jol Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:52 pm

    Toni Kroos wrote:ballack is the winner

    with ballalck chelsea had not lost

    With Ballack you are 100% for sure your team to finish SECOND...
    Deluded F*ck™
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:54 pm

    Ricardo Jol wrote:
    Toni Kroos wrote:ballack is the winner

    with ballalck chelsea had not lost

    With Ballack you are 100% for sure your team to finish SECOND...

    This is true.

    if Germany ever gets to host an Olympics again, Ballack's face engraved on the silver Medals would be very apt. ok
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:00 pm

    Ade Alves wrote:
    Fey wrote:
    Ade Alves wrote:
    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    WHAT? Doh

    When he couldn't pass complete a pass or trap a ball then he shouldn't have started and as COTR said it took him nearly a year to score an EPL goal. He was a passanger at times last season espically, Voronin scored more goals in the league than him, at least from open play.

    We all said he should be a starter in Europe when other supporters still didn't think he should last season.

    Kuytadona is playing like his first season and thats all we ever asked for... Ale

    Kalou and the Hitman game is shite... Wink Ale

    B.Kalou wasnt too bad today, he got a warm welcome!

    Kuytini scored less because Rafa uses him for everything. Wouldnt surprise me at all if he would help with the building of the new stadium!

    But it doesnt matter cause he does it for the team! He is so awesome btw a while a go some Feyenoord fans came to visit him and they could all stay in his house!! I wish i was there too, but i prefer to have some one-on-one quality time with him.

    Hitman is frecking awesome btw!

    My Feyenoord loving(2nd club) joke of a bro loves Hitman as well. He still plays the old versions during the holidays Rolling Eyes You're all the fucking same, weirdos Laughing

    I think it is fairly average personally though the movie wasn't half bad.
    3 chins IMO.

    Awesome brother you have! Get him on here! The movie was shite Ade, Hitman isnt supposed to act like Rambo!
    Chocolate Thunder
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    Post by Chocolate Thunder Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:08 pm

    Fey wrote:
    Ade Alves wrote:
    Fey wrote:
    Ade Alves wrote:
    Fey wrote:Winners: Kuyt, what a guy, battles his way to ensure a Liverpool league title.

    Losers: Liverpool fans on the EMB site (especially the Irish ones) never had faith in Kuytinovic,they all say he is shite and only believe that Torres can score.

    WHAT? Doh

    When he couldn't pass complete a pass or trap a ball then he shouldn't have started and as COTR said it took him nearly a year to score an EPL goal. He was a passanger at times last season espically, Voronin scored more goals in the league than him, at least from open play.

    We all said he should be a starter in Europe when other supporters still didn't think he should last season.

    Kuytadona is playing like his first season and thats all we ever asked for... Ale

    Kalou and the Hitman game is shite... Wink Ale

    B.Kalou wasnt too bad today, he got a warm welcome!

    Kuytini scored less because Rafa uses him for everything. Wouldnt surprise me at all if he would help with the building of the new stadium!

    But it doesnt matter cause he does it for the team! He is so awesome btw a while a go some Feyenoord fans came to visit him and they could all stay in his house!! I wish i was there too, but i prefer to have some one-on-one quality time with him.

    Hitman is frecking awesome btw!

    My Feyenoord loving(2nd club) joke of a bro loves Hitman as well. He still plays the old versions during the holidays Rolling Eyes You're all the fucking same, weirdos Laughing

    I think it is fairly average personally though the movie wasn't half bad.
    3 chins IMO.

    Awesome brother you have! Get him on here! The movie was shite Ade, Hitman isnt supposed to act like Rambo!

    I was fairly pissed when I saw it in the cinema. I can remember only 2 parts the bird who follows him around showing off her tits and the 4 Hitman's fighting eachother.

    He said he'll come on here when he has time. In Uni, first year and so lives in the bar these days... Bubbly
    Chocolate Thunder
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    Post by Chocolate Thunder Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:08 pm

    Glenn Hysén wrote:GERMANY cheers

    = FOOTBALL cheers
    avatar
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    Post by Glenarch of the Glen Mon Oct 27, 2008 12:43 pm

    The Premier League Weekend Winners And Losers

    Thoughts on a weekend that proved Liverpool really could win this....

    Winners

    The New League Leaders
    Genuine title contenders.

    Liverpool
    Liverpool's display was a masterclass in match-management, a lesson in how suffocate opponents, in exploiting and revealing weaknesses, in the power of discipline, in refusing to yield the initiative.

    Entertainment in football can take many different forms. Sunday's game would have been subdued viewing for those who have bought into the modern-day, TV-dictated definition that an entertaining game of football is a game of numerous goalmouth action and endless end-to-end breaks. This was a throwback, a reminder for those who can appreciate the skill of controlling as a game as an artform that football works best as a contest. It's not just about how you play; how you make the opposition play matters just as much. Liverpool's performance was a demonstration in how to make good on a piece of slight fortune and win. As such, it was close to perfection.

    That Xabi Alonso's 10th-minute shot required a deflection to make its transformation from hopeful punt to match-winning strike is undeniable. Yet, with eighty minutes still on the clock, Chelsea had ample time in which to make their response. Their stage was set; either they scored or they lost. Simple, really. And yet despite the clarity of that knowledge, they managed to create a grand total of one chance. One.

    A lucky win? Forget it. A boring win? Forget about football if you couldn't appreciate its quality.


    Rafa Benitez
    The key to Liverpool's victory was their organisation, discipline and the absolute belief that they could repel whatever Chelsea would throw at them. Tactically, they were yard-perfect, from Steven Gerrard's liberation behind Robbie Keane, to the use of Albert Riera and Dirk Kuyt to nullifying Chelsea's hitherto rampaging full-backs. Now we know why the Dutchman was omitted in midweek despite three goals in his previous two matches - Benitez was saving him for the task of making Ashley Cole the brattish, prattish, self-absorbed, spoilt, obnoxious garden-gnome lookalike he actually is.

    No doubt, the phrase 'tactical masterclass' will be bandied about in praise of Benitez. More accurately, this was a triumph for the 4-2-3-1 formation that has become Liverpool's starting point and been an integral factor behind their best-ever start to a Premiership season. It works because it plays to Liverpool's strengths and disguises their faults, and it worked on Sunday because one of its by-products is the easy deployment of two of the three into a second bank of four (which is the long-winded way of saying that a 4-2-3-1 can be seamlessly morphed into a 4-4-1-1 as and when the circumstance demands).

    For Benitez, the lay-out could not have been better. Not only were Liverpool set up exactly as he wanted, but so too were Chelsea.

    "Chelsea have full backs going forward all of the time, but we demonstrated you can go forward and create something," he explained afterwards. "They will have problems behind their defenders because they go forward all the time."

    With Gerrard thus able to find and exploit space on either flank, John Obi Mikel was made redundant and irrelevant. Instructed since the start of the season to hold station in front of his two central defenders, he found himself marking fresh air.

    He was not the only Chelsea player to endure a chastening experience, though. Put on the spot, they could not even come up with any questions let alone answers to the quandary Liverpool presented. To state they lacked imagination would be a grave understatement.

    In Scolari's mitigation, the identity of Chelsea's substitutes - Carlo Cudicini, Branislav Ivanovic, Paulo Ferreira, Alex, Franco Di Santo, Scott Sinclair and Juliano Belletti - provided limited scope for maneuver or alteration. Yet the pathetic, gutless display of Florent Malouda damned Scolari as the fair price he deserved to pay for his arrogant claim in the summer that he could fix the Frenchman in a way that Avram Grant and Jose Mourinho could not. From that boast followed the failure to buy the creative forward that his team is now in dire need of - even at £35m, it was mistake to judge Robinho as overpriced because of his value as the final piece in the Chelsea jigsaw - and the regular sight of Malouda in a Chelsea shirt no matter how badly he performs.


    Steven Gerrard
    Dear Steven, now do you realise that you don't have to be a central-midfielder to be the best player on the pitch?


    Daniel Levy
    The easy thing to do was nothing, to sit back and wait in hope rather than expectation, to wallow in the delusion that Tottenham, even as a side with just two points from seven games, were too good to go down. The hardest thing to do was admit he was wrong; wrong to appoint a man who could not communicate, wrong to muddle the management process with the interference of a Sporting Director, wrong to assure White Hart Lane staff just two weeks ago that Juande Ramos had his full confidence.

    Levy must have known how his decision to sack Ramos - on the eve of his one-year anniversary and a must-win fixture against Bolton - would be interpreted by a hostile media: knee-jerk, reactionary, proof of his own failure. But Levy has fronted-up and owned up, both in words and deeds, to his own mistakes and the reality of the club's predicament. Such has been the danger of their delusion that the public acknowledgment Tottenham are in the middle of a relegation fight from which they have no divine right to escape is cause for celebration.

    To go forward, Tottenham have had to go backwards. Redknapp is not a Top Four manager; never has been, never will be. But he is a canny operator, a firefighter, a galviniser. He is more likely to keep Tottenham in the Premiership than Ramos was. He is the short-term fix to what, it will be hoped, will be a short-term problem.

    Next year's problem can wait. The problem that needed addressing is this year.


    Losers

    Wayne Rooney
    Footballers kissing the badge is generally about as cynical as politicians kissing babies. Like a chairman's vote of confidence, it is generally tends to be the harbinger of a split rather than a declaration of everlasting loyalty. Rooney's reaction to the heckles of the Goodison Park crowd after his booking was revealing in how little value he placed upon the ritual. The badge wasn't kissed because he wanted to declare his love for his current club, it was kissed only because he wanted antagonise the crowd still suffering for his rejection. Has Rooney really become so removed from the processes of being a football fan that he felt it necessary to hurt them further? It was a cheap act, one that demeaned the shirt and revealed an aspect to his personality that can only be described as repugnant.


    Tackling
    Did we miss a memo? Has there been a directive passed by UEFA or FIFA that has outlawed the act of tackling? Kicking the kickers out of the game is one thing but the crackdown on tackling that officialdom has taken upon itself to introduce in the past two weeks is quite another. The shame is that it has taken the dubious bookings from incidents involving two of the league's leading stars, Steven Gerrard and Cristiano Ronaldo, for the issue to be raised. The clue, no, the warning, that a crackdown so severe that it threatens to be more dangerous than the dangerous tackling it is apparently designed to eradicate was underway occurred last week at the Riverside when Middlesbrough's Gary O'Neil was cautioned for the crime, in the words of The Guardian's match report, 'playing football'.

    'There's not anything amiss with his tackle on Alex, but referee Dowd doesn't like it and flashes yellow,' the newspaper noted. Expect that complaint to become a familiar one before the authorities realise what path they are set upon. Football is not a non-contact sport and tackling is one of its skills. For the game to lose that aspect would be a crime.

    Dowd, on duty this weekend at Upton Park, has taken to the crackdown with the relish of a true zealot. As Carlton Cole's tackle was the type that can cause serious injury, there should be no argument with his decision to dismiss the West Ham forward in injury-time. But his work beforehand was a frightening glimpse of the game that officialdom is developing. As Andy Gray remarked in commentary, "Every time a tackle has been made, it's been given as a foul." And almost every time a foul was given, a yellow card followed.

    And that's the real problem with this crackdown. Responding to dangerous tackles with a red card is right; what's wrong is the frightening frequency that yellow cards are being issued for innocuous fouls and that players are then just another innocuous foul away from being banished from the field of play.

    Pete Gill

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