The Liverpool discussion thread 2006/2007

Don't think this has been mentioned yet, but how did Arbeloa do when he came on at Newcastle? or couldn't you tell

Jordy Brouwer, Emiliano Insua and Ronald Huth made their club debuts on Tuesday as Liverpool Reserves slipped to a 3-1 friendly defeat to Preston.
A stunning 20-yard lob from former Red Neil Mellor helped ruin their big day at a windswept Academy.

Of all the debutants, left-back Insua looked most capable of knocking on the first-team door, though all three showed glimpses of why they were brought to the club in January.

Indeed, it was Brouwer who carved out the game's first opportunity on three minutes, controlling the ball neatly on the edge of the box before sending a shot into the visiting keeper's arms via a deflection.

Jack Hobbs, back in the starting line up following a six-month spell on the sidelines with a thigh injury, began brightly in midfield alongside Danny Guthrie.

The pair looked assured throughout against an experienced Preston side which included Daniel Dichio and former West Ham man Adam Nowland.

It was Nowland who opened the scoring on eight minutes, bending a sublime free-kick beyond David Martin following a clumsy challenge by the robust Huth.

To their credit, Gary Ablett's side did not let their heads drop and, perhaps inspired by a mob of screaming Academy youngsters, managed to pull level seven minutes before the break.

Besian Idrizaj pounced on a loose ball on the edge of the box before dummying Sean St Ledger (of Big Ron Manager fame) and side-footing beyond the keeper.

The Reds were stringing together some decent passing moves, though too often things broke down as they entered the final third.

The hosts' only other real chance of the first-half came when Nabil El Zhar skipped past his man and cut back for Brouwer, the Dutch debutant volleying narrowly over from 10 yards.

Minutes later Brouwer again came close, this time linking up with Insua before directing a mid-range curler too close to the keeper.

Liverpool were made to pay for their lack of cutting edge on 42 minutes, former Academy starlet Mellor bringing back memories of his famous long-range goal against Arsenal with a stylish lob over Martin from 25 yards.

Two became three on the stroke of half-time when Nowland's in-swinging cross evaded everyone before bulging the back of the net.

Insua had the first chance after the break with a thirty-yard drive. It may have looped over the bar, but it nevertheless illustrated why he was later ushered forward to take a free-kick deep in Preston's half.

The Reds were a far better unit in the second-half, with Paul Anderson and El Zhar starting to get into the game, and Idrizaj and Guthrie looking dangerous.

El Zhar should have pulled one back when careless defending left him one-on-one. Stretching, he sent his 25-yard lob inches wide.

Insua got a slice of what English football's all about when Mellor hacked him down from behind – though it was heartening to see the 17-year-old walk away without a word.

Minutes later the roles were reversed when a routine tackle from the Argentine left Mellor needing stitches in his knee.

Debutant watch:

Insua - showed a willingness to get forward throughout. Displayed good aerial ability and composure on the ball. With a bit of work on his positional play, he could soon be joining up with the first team.

Brouwer – the lanky striker looked like an out-and-out forward. A good touch and able to hold up the ball.

Huth – watched by his mum and little brother, he grew in composure as the game wore on. Will be given time to adapt to the English lifestyle.

Duran and Padelli – A knock sustained while playing for Spain Under 19s kept Francisco Manuel Duran on the sidelines, while Daniele Padelli is currently training with the first-team in Portugal.

Man of the match: Danny Guthrie

Liverpool Reserves: Martin, Peltier, Antwi (Hobbs 45), Huth (Antwi 70), Insua, Hobbs (Brouwer 32), Guthrie, Anderson, El Zhar, Brouwer (Roque 23), Idrizaj.

Luis wrote:A stunning 20-yard lob from former Red Neil Mellor

HAHAHA!!!

Now you know what it feels like.

Huth.

No relation to Robert?

Cesc wrote:

Luis wrote:A stunning 20-yard lob from former Red Neil Mellor

HAHAHA!!!

Now you know what it feels like.

Genuine lol!

Huth's Paraguayan, so no. Don't think I didn't nearly have a stroke when I saw the "Liverpool snap up Huth" headlines though.

Luis wrote:Jordy Brouwer, Emiliano Insua and Ronald Huth made their club debuts on Tuesday as Liverpool Reserves slipped to a 3-1 friendly defeat to Preston.
A stunning 20-yard lob from former Red Neil Mellor helped ruin their big day at a windswept Academy.

Of all the debutants, left-back Insua looked most capable of knocking on the first-team door, though all three showed glimpses of why they were brought to the club in January.

Indeed, it was Brouwer who carved out the game's first opportunity on three minutes, controlling the ball neatly on the edge of the box before sending a shot into the visiting keeper's arms via a deflection.

Jack Hobbs, back in the starting line up following a six-month spell on the sidelines with a thigh injury, began brightly in midfield alongside Danny Guthrie.

The pair looked assured throughout against an experienced Preston side which included Daniel Dichio and former West Ham man Adam Nowland.

It was Nowland who opened the scoring on eight minutes, bending a sublime free-kick beyond David Martin following a clumsy challenge by the robust Huth.

To their credit, Gary Ablett's side did not let their heads drop and, perhaps inspired by a mob of screaming Academy youngsters, managed to pull level seven minutes before the break.

Besian Idrizaj pounced on a loose ball on the edge of the box before dummying Sean St Ledger (of Big Ron Manager fame) and side-footing beyond the keeper.

The Reds were stringing together some decent passing moves, though too often things broke down as they entered the final third.

The hosts' only other real chance of the first-half came when Nabil El Zhar skipped past his man and cut back for Brouwer, the Dutch debutant volleying narrowly over from 10 yards.

Minutes later Brouwer again came close, this time linking up with Insua before directing a mid-range curler too close to the keeper.

Liverpool were made to pay for their lack of cutting edge on 42 minutes, former Academy starlet Mellor bringing back memories of his famous long-range goal against Arsenal with a stylish lob over Martin from 25 yards.

Two became three on the stroke of half-time when Nowland's in-swinging cross evaded everyone before bulging the back of the net.

Insua had the first chance after the break with a thirty-yard drive. It may have looped over the bar, but it nevertheless illustrated why he was later ushered forward to take a free-kick deep in Preston's half.

The Reds were a far better unit in the second-half, with Paul Anderson and El Zhar starting to get into the game, and Idrizaj and Guthrie looking dangerous.

El Zhar should have pulled one back when careless defending left him one-on-one. Stretching, he sent his 25-yard lob inches wide.

Insua got a slice of what English football's all about when Mellor hacked him down from behind – though it was heartening to see the 17-year-old walk away without a word.

Minutes later the roles were reversed when a routine tackle from the Argentine left Mellor needing stitches in his knee.

Debutant watch:

Insua - showed a willingness to get forward throughout. Displayed good aerial ability and composure on the ball. With a bit of work on his positional play, he could soon be joining up with the first team.

Brouwer – the lanky striker looked like an out-and-out forward. A good touch and able to hold up the ball.

Huth – watched by his mum and little brother, he grew in composure as the game wore on. Will be given time to adapt to the English lifestyle.

Duran and Padelli – A knock sustained while playing for Spain Under 19s kept Francisco Manuel Duran on the sidelines, while Daniele Padelli is currently training with the first-team in Portugal.

Man of the match: Danny Guthrie

Liverpool Reserves: Martin, Peltier, Antwi (Hobbs 45), Huth (Antwi 70), Insua, Hobbs (Brouwer 32), Guthrie, Anderson, El Zhar, Brouwer (Roque 23), Idrizaj.

Encouraging to hear. I remember when we were first linked with Insua the word was that he could break into the first team before the end of the season. I was skeptical then and remain so, but it's promising that he's had a good start.

I think it's next season we'll see the benefit of all these players in the reserves. With the amount of signings we've made, it's hard for them to strike up any rhythm. Hopefully though Brouwer can get a few goals and generally hold on to the ball upfront. No one else seems capable of that.

Gary Ablett believes Liverpool have a real talent on their hands in Argentine left-back Emiliano Insua.
The reserve-team manager was delighted with the 17-year-old's debut in a friendly against Preston on Tuesday lunch-time.

He said: "Insua has a lot of potential. He's only 17 and is still eligible for our youth team, yet he's already played for Argentina Under-20s. That tells you something about his quality.

"To say it was his debut, I was very pleased. The potential is there and we now have to make sure we harness it.

"He is a prospect, we have a lot of prospects. You have to be exceptional to get into the Liverpool first team, but we have some very good players who are going in the right direction. Now, they've got to flourish over the next year to 18 months."

The game, played at the Academy, also marked the debuts of Jordy Brouwer and Ronald Huth.

Ablett went on: "It was always going to be difficult for Huth – he was against Mellor and Dichio, which is a physical challenge.

"But he's come from half-way round the world so that's never easy. Again though, the potential is there.

"Jordy did okay as well. He has a great physique but perhaps needs to develop himself physically in order to hold-off the centre-halves."

Despite losing the game 3-1, Ablett insists there were plenty of positives.

"I'm disappointed with the scoreline but, although I wouldn't say we expected it, we knew Preston were a good side with a lot of players who've got Championship experience.

"We had two new lads at the back who've never played together. There was confusion at times with the language barriers. That's something we can sort out – they'll have to learn English as soon as they can.

"As much as David Martin shouted, they couldn't understand him.

"We let in three sloppy goals but we were good with the ball and passed it well at times. The lads showed at times that they're improving tactically and playing the way we want them to play.

"We created a lot of chances but again we couldn't score the goals.

"Danny Guthrie did well. I think he is really starting to show the benefits of training with the first team now."

Ablett added that Francisco Manuel Duran, who sat out with a hamstring injury, could make his debut for the reserves against Bolton next Thursday.

Liverpool pair named in Europe XI

Liverpool's Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher will play for a Europe XI side in a jubilation match against Manchester United on 13 March.
The game at Old Trafford commemorates the 50th anniversary of United's first competitive European fixture as well as the founding of the Common Market.

Marcello Lippi will manage the Europe team and Real Madrid's David Beckham will also play against his former club.

Fixture congestion means Lippi cannot select Arsenal and Chelsea players.

Sir Alex Ferguson has already pledged to field a full-strength line-up, including Henrik Larsson in what could be his farewell United appearance.

While the precise European line-up is yet to be finalised, Lippi has expressed the hope that most of his 2006 World Cup-winning squad will be at Old Trafford.

Liverpool boss Rafael Benitez insists he is happy to release his two most senior England internationals for the fixture.

He said: "It is an honour for our club that two of our players have been selected to represent Europe.

"I know that they feel very privileged to be in the team and that they will enjoy playing alongside the top players from other clubs.

"It will be a nice experience for them and one I am sure they will remember with pleasure in years to come."

posted that in the manc thread TS

Been done in our thread.

Hope they don't get booed. Though I'm not sure the same would happen with Gary Neville at Anfield.

Parks lives wrote:Been done in our thread.

Hope they don't get booed. Though I'm not sure the same would happen with Gary Neville at Anfield.

Aye, I'm sure it's the boos that bother them. Not the anti-hillsborough banners all the way up the M62

Liverpool may have to wait until next week before a decision is reached over the legality of Javier Mascherano's loan move from West Ham United.

The Premier League's legal department is poring over details of the contracts between the Argentina international and his representatives to investigate whether there has been any breach of the Premier League's regulations over player ownership. Sources claim that so complex are the reams of paperwork that the league is not ready to announce its verdict and might not be in a position to do so until next week.


That should not concern Liverpool unduly, since they have no match this weekend following their third-round exit from the FA Cup to Arsenal. But it would extend West Ham's worries.
The relegation-threatened Upton Park club are not currently under investigation. However, if any transfer documents are found to have been withheld or falsified in Mascherano and Carlos Tevez's original moves to West Ham, it is expected that club officials will be interviewed.

Daily Mail are linking us with Eto'o

Would kill for it to happen though...

Dirk Kuyt has revealed what he and his teammates have been getting up to during their five-day training camp in Portugal.
In a diary piece for icons.com, the Dutchman admitted the lads were having a great time preparing for next week's Champions League clash with Barca.

He said: "I'm in Portugal at a training camp with Liverpool at the moment. We haven't got a game until next Wednesday so the boss has brought us away for five days to do some training and team-building.

"We're training in the morning, and then in the afternoon we'll have a game of golf, play some cards and have a meal with the lads in the evening.

"It's a great chance for everyone to get to know each other better, particularly for people like me who are in our first season at the club.

"It's also a good chance for me to improve my golf! I don't have a handicap, but I reckon I would play off about 22. It's not something I played much before, but the lads at Liverpool play all the time and some of them are pretty good.

"So I'm taking lessons now. I play every week and go to a driving range because I'm determined to get better. I like to win at everything I do, and golf is no different. I'll let you know how I get on."

Kuyt also spoke about his love of Liverpool and the Anfield faithful.

"To have the respect of the supporters is great. It has really helped me settle in," he said.

"I'm so lucky. When I was at Feyenoord, I had the greatest fans in Holland behind me, and now I'm at Liverpool I think we have the best fans in England.

"The support they give us is unbelievable, I've never known anything like it.

"What honours me most is that when we played Arsenal in the Carling Cup, it was a horrible night, it was cold, it was raining, and of course it's a lot of money to come and watch. But it was sold out!"

The striker has inspired several Kuyt-related songs since his arrival in the summer, but he admits there is one that has stuck out.

"I've heard the song the fans sing for me, too: Put your hands up for Dirk Kuyt. I want to thank every one of them for that. To have the respect of the supporters is great. It has really helped me settle in. It was a great song already and now I like it even more!"

Kuyt also revealed he and his teammates are feeling confident of progressing to the quarter-finals of the Champions League despite the quality of next week's opposition.

He said: "What a game it is, away to Barcelona. We will have to improve on our performance against Newcastle, for sure.

"I believe we drew the best team in the Champions League when we got Barcelona, they are the champions after all, but I also believe we can beat them.

"It's always good to play against the best teams, and if you want to win the trophy you have to beat the strongest teams at some stage.

"We're lucky that we have the second leg at Anfield, and when we get them back there we will have the incredible Anfield crowd behind us."

Great article I thought from the Guardian about Roy Evans.

Remembered as a weak man who let his Spice Boys run riot, the former Liverpool boss was closer to winning the Premiership than his successors.


Rob Smyth
February 15, 2007 01:59 PM


Long before Stan Collymore appeared on the reality TV show The Verdict, he had served as judge and jury on the managerial career of Roy Evans.


"One morning we were all wandering out to training when Roy [Evans] made some quip to Robbie Fowler and they started joking about. Robbie got the gaffer's head in an armlock and started rubbing his other hand across his head, frizzing up his hair. I caught myself imagining what would have happened if Gary Neville ever tried that with Alex Ferguson. Somehow, I couldn't see it."


This withering appraisal in Collymore's autobiography seemed to capture the essence of the Evans years: of the nice boy who couldn't control his Spice Boys, the shandy-weak boss who wasted an abundantly talented squad that should have dominated English football but instead are remembered for peroxide-blond mops, cream Armani suits and green-eyed envy at the tangible achievement of the other Red Army across the M62.


It might be time for a bit of revisionism. It was under Evans that Liverpool had their strongest title challenge of the last 15 years, in
1996-97 (they eventually finished fourth but had they beaten Manchester United at Anfield in mid-April they would've gone top with three games to go); it was under Evans that they played their best football of the last 15 years; and it was under Evans that the likes of Robbie Fowler, Jamie Redknapp and, arguably, Steve McManaman reached the high watermark of their careers.


Evans was certainly not without flaws - he bought some poor players, he had no idea how to handle or utilise a one-off like Collymore, and he cut his players too much slack on occasion - but he is hardly alone in that. He may not have been a born winner, but nor was he the hapless loser that some have made out.


It is revealing that, under Evans, Liverpool's average Premiership
position* (3.5) was higher than under Gérard Houllier (3.6) or Rafa Benítez (4.0), yet Evans is ranked well below the two. The suspicion remains that, for all Liverpool fans' moralistic carping about the Holy Grail of a 19th league title, they are as susceptible to the cheap thrill of a Cup triumph as anyone else.


Evans won only a League Cup in 1995, with his side frequently going out in the early rounds in Europe and the FA Cup, often in humiliating circumstances. By contrast, Houllier and Benítez wowed their public with a Treble and a Champions League victory which, while glorious, were entirely meaningless in terms of restoring Liverpool to the top of the pile. They are further away from that now than they were at any time under Evans:
Liverpool are currently 16 points behind United, whereas the most they trailed under Evans was by 15 in 1994-95.


And at least they were good to watch back then. The quality and purity of the football played by Evans's teams was beyond reproach: he was the last of the Boot Room boys, and appropriately his side were the last to play in the pass-and-move tradition developed in the Boot Room. In 1996, their FA Cup final song was even called 'Pass & Move (The Liverpool Groove)'.


In the mid-nineties, particularly that 1995-96 season, Liverpool's Spice Boys were the best side in England to look at in every sense (Fowler the "Growler" notwithstanding). They played catwalk football. Kevin Keegan's Newcastle were thrillingly gung-ho, and Manchester United's forward play could be devastatingly decisive, but nobody was as striking, as aesthetic, as Liverpool.


They took part in the greatest game in Premiership history - the 4-3 against Newcastle in April 1996 (it rather sums up Evans's career that that match is remembered more for the losing manager, Keegan, than him). There were other memorable performances that season in particular, most notably when they blew away Blackburn and Aston Villa, defending champions and surprise packages respectively, at Anfield with devastating three-goal bursts in the first quarter of the game. And they outclassed eventual champions United home and away.


Yet when it came to the real crunch - the FA Cup final - they were locked in a full nelson by Roy Keane and deservedly beaten by Eric Cantona's fairytale late winner. It summed up Evans's Liverpool: they were consistent only in their inconsistency. That rout of Blackburn followed defeat away to 10-man Wimbledon. The 4-3 over Newcastle, which breathed new life into their title challenge, was followed by a miserable 1-0 defeat at Coventry.
In the winter months they smashed Manchester City 6-0 before going seven matches without a win, and then snapping back into life to stuff United and Arsenal.


The problem for Evans was that the highs were so high that they left observers bemused as to how the lows could possibly be so low. So attention turned to off-field matters. The perception was thus fostered of a group of players who had the keys to the kingdom but decided they'd prefer a VIP suite at Chinawhites. Yet if team spirit is an illusion glimpsed in the aftermath of victory, as Steve Archibald famously said, then Evans might legitimately feel that Spice Boy excess is a delusion perceived in the aftermath of defeat. Like Cool Britannia, Britpop, TFI Friday and everything else that defined that period, those who criticise with hindsight are quick to forget just how enjoyable it was at the time.


Nor does it hold that Evans's romantic beliefs led to a damaging sacrifice of defensive principles: in three of his four seasons, Liverpool conceded fewer goals than the champions. Maybe the reality is that, as players, they just weren't that good; that Evans overachieved with the squad at his disposal. Whereas United, the dominant force, had Ryan Giggs and Keane in their prime, as well as a nascent David Beckham, Paul Scholes and Gary Neville and a renascent Cantona, Liverpool had only Fowler approaching the mythical world-class status.


Most of the other main attacking forces played better under Evans than before or since. Fowler was truly magnificent. Redknapp has never passed as aggressively or purposefully. McManaman, one of nature's uncomplaining lieutenants, was turned into the side's general. Collymore, though not as he good as he was at Nottingham Forest, never reached the heights of 95-96 again. It might be coincidence (certainly the cruciate injury that Fowler suffered in 1998, towards the end of Evans' reign, had a damaging effect on his career). Or it might be that Evans' gregarious methods - for richer or poorer - empowered some free spirits to play with a verve and joie de vivre that other managers could not locate.


Either way, his reign certainly wasn't all bad. Where his reputation is concerned, it might be time for the football cognoscenti to order a retrial

Have your lot played their FA Youth Cup quater final yet? I think your playing our lot in the semi's, we made it ofcourse.

Kimbo wrote:Have your lot played their FA Youth Cup quater final yet? I think your playing our lot in the semi's, we made it ofcourse.

We play away to Sheffield United tonight. We've got some decent players in the youth team; Darby, Threlfall and Flynn are all meant to be alright and obviously Lindfield and Ajdarevic look the part.

I'm interested to know who plays in goal. Hansen's done well in the few games he's played apparently but David Roberts is usually first choice and was in the team that won the youth cup last season.

Don't think this side is as strong as that one.

Kimbo - looks like we'll be playing your lot in the semi's. We're 3-1 up in the second half at the moment.

Only 10-15 minutes left I think.

Rafa plans raid for Barcelona duo
Thu 15 Feb, 4:30 PM

Liverpool boss Rafael Benitez is being linked with an ambitious summer raid for Barcelona duo Samuel Eto'o and Giovanni dos Santos.The Reds and Barcelona - the two most recent winners of the Champions League - are preparing to face one another at the Nou Camp in a last-16 first-leg tie next Wednesday.

Speculation in Spain has linked controversial striker Eto'o with both Liverpool and Chelsea, while Benitez is also believed to be planning a summer move for 17-year-old Mexican Dos Santos.

The Reds have increased spending power following the takeover by Tom Hicks and George Gillett and are set to launch a bid for the unsettled pair when the transfer window re-opens.

Dos Santos is regarded as Barca's hottest youth product, and Benitez knows he is set to gain his Spanish passport next month.

The youngster almost joined Lyon in the transfer window and has been frustrated by his lack of first-team chances since being promoted to Frank Rijkaard's senior squad in pre-season.

The talented midfielder is contracted to Barca until 2009, with a buy-out clause of £20million.

Meanwhile, Anfield legend Ian Rush believes Benitez is just the man to handle such high-level transfer dealings.

Rush told Sky Sports: "We have progressed from last season - and we must look to progress again.

"It is just as important to get players out as it is to get players in. That is the art of management.

"It is not just about an open chequebook - 'Rafa' is not that sort of manager.

"He is the right manager for the job now and he is the right manager to get new players in.

"We now have to rely on the manager's talent, with the knowledge that the money will be available if needed."

Rush also believes Benitez holds the upper hand as the Barca clash approaches, because Liverpool do not have a game this weekend - while the Catalans face a tough trip to Valencia on Sunday.

"It will help Liverpool that they have not got a game this weekend - they are in Portugal training, while Barcelona will be playing," the former Wales forward noted.

"By the time the Barcelona game does come around, Liverpool will be physically and mentally tuned-in for the game."

One Liverpool star looking forward to the showdown more than most is former Barcelona goalkeeper Jose Reina, who played for the club against Liverpool at Anfield in the 2001 UEFA Cup semi-final.

Reina later joined Villarreal before his move to Liverpool in July 2005.

He said: "Going back to the Camp Nou will be very special for me. It makes me happy, not just because it's Barca - but because it's a fantastic venue with great people and great fans.

"I don't feel I have anything to prove, going back there. I want to win, but not because I want to get revenge or anything like that. If I'd spent 10 years there it would have been brilliant, but that didn't happen. I have no regrets.

"I spent two years there and took a lot of positives from that spell. I learnt a lot and will be grateful to the club for the rest of my life."

Parks lives wrote:Great article I thought from the Guardian about Roy Evans.

Remembered as a weak man who let his Spice Boys run riot, the former Liverpool boss was closer to winning the Premiership than his successors.


Rob Smyth
February 15, 2007 01:59 PM


Long before Stan Collymore appeared on the reality TV show The Verdict, he had served as judge and jury on the managerial career of Roy Evans.


"One morning we were all wandering out to training when Roy [Evans] made some quip to Robbie Fowler and they started joking about. Robbie got the gaffer's head in an armlock and started rubbing his other hand across his head, frizzing up his hair. I caught myself imagining what would have happened if Gary Neville ever tried that with Alex Ferguson. Somehow, I couldn't see it."


This withering appraisal in Collymore's autobiography seemed to capture the essence of the Evans years: of the nice boy who couldn't control his Spice Boys, the shandy-weak boss who wasted an abundantly talented squad that should have dominated English football but instead are remembered for peroxide-blond mops, cream Armani suits and green-eyed envy at the tangible achievement of the other Red Army across the M62.


It might be time for a bit of revisionism. It was under Evans that Liverpool had their strongest title challenge of the last 15 years, in
1996-97 (they eventually finished fourth but had they beaten Manchester United at Anfield in mid-April they would've gone top with three games to go); it was under Evans that they played their best football of the last 15 years; and it was under Evans that the likes of Robbie Fowler, Jamie Redknapp and, arguably, Steve McManaman reached the high watermark of their careers.


Evans was certainly not without flaws - he bought some poor players, he had no idea how to handle or utilise a one-off like Collymore, and he cut his players too much slack on occasion - but he is hardly alone in that. He may not have been a born winner, but nor was he the hapless loser that some have made out.


It is revealing that, under Evans, Liverpool's average Premiership
position* (3.5) was higher than under Gérard Houllier (3.6) or Rafa Benítez (4.0), yet Evans is ranked well below the two. The suspicion remains that, for all Liverpool fans' moralistic carping about the Holy Grail of a 19th league title, they are as susceptible to the cheap thrill of a Cup triumph as anyone else.


Evans won only a League Cup in 1995, with his side frequently going out in the early rounds in Europe and the FA Cup, often in humiliating circumstances. By contrast, Houllier and Benítez wowed their public with a Treble and a Champions League victory which, while glorious, were entirely meaningless in terms of restoring Liverpool to the top of the pile. They are further away from that now than they were at any time under Evans:
Liverpool are currently 16 points behind United, whereas the most they trailed under Evans was by 15 in 1994-95.


And at least they were good to watch back then. The quality and purity of the football played by Evans's teams was beyond reproach: he was the last of the Boot Room boys, and appropriately his side were the last to play in the pass-and-move tradition developed in the Boot Room. In 1996, their FA Cup final song was even called 'Pass & Move (The Liverpool Groove)'.


In the mid-nineties, particularly that 1995-96 season, Liverpool's Spice Boys were the best side in England to look at in every sense (Fowler the "Growler" notwithstanding). They played catwalk football. Kevin Keegan's Newcastle were thrillingly gung-ho, and Manchester United's forward play could be devastatingly decisive, but nobody was as striking, as aesthetic, as Liverpool.


They took part in the greatest game in Premiership history - the 4-3 against Newcastle in April 1996 (it rather sums up Evans's career that that match is remembered more for the losing manager, Keegan, than him). There were other memorable performances that season in particular, most notably when they blew away Blackburn and Aston Villa, defending champions and surprise packages respectively, at Anfield with devastating three-goal bursts in the first quarter of the game. And they outclassed eventual champions United home and away.


Yet when it came to the real crunch - the FA Cup final - they were locked in a full nelson by Roy Keane and deservedly beaten by Eric Cantona's fairytale late winner. It summed up Evans's Liverpool: they were consistent only in their inconsistency. That rout of Blackburn followed defeat away to 10-man Wimbledon. The 4-3 over Newcastle, which breathed new life into their title challenge, was followed by a miserable 1-0 defeat at Coventry.
In the winter months they smashed Manchester City 6-0 before going seven matches without a win, and then snapping back into life to stuff United and Arsenal.


The problem for Evans was that the highs were so high that they left observers bemused as to how the lows could possibly be so low. So attention turned to off-field matters. The perception was thus fostered of a group of players who had the keys to the kingdom but decided they'd prefer a VIP suite at Chinawhites. Yet if team spirit is an illusion glimpsed in the aftermath of victory, as Steve Archibald famously said, then Evans might legitimately feel that Spice Boy excess is a delusion perceived in the aftermath of defeat. Like Cool Britannia, Britpop, TFI Friday and everything else that defined that period, those who criticise with hindsight are quick to forget just how enjoyable it was at the time.


Nor does it hold that Evans's romantic beliefs led to a damaging sacrifice of defensive principles: in three of his four seasons, Liverpool conceded fewer goals than the champions. Maybe the reality is that, as players, they just weren't that good; that Evans overachieved with the squad at his disposal. Whereas United, the dominant force, had Ryan Giggs and Keane in their prime, as well as a nascent David Beckham, Paul Scholes and Gary Neville and a renascent Cantona, Liverpool had only Fowler approaching the mythical world-class status.


Most of the other main attacking forces played better under Evans than before or since. Fowler was truly magnificent. Redknapp has never passed as aggressively or purposefully. McManaman, one of nature's uncomplaining lieutenants, was turned into the side's general. Collymore, though not as he good as he was at Nottingham Forest, never reached the heights of 95-96 again. It might be coincidence (certainly the cruciate injury that Fowler suffered in 1998, towards the end of Evans' reign, had a damaging effect on his career). Or it might be that Evans' gregarious methods - for richer or poorer - empowered some free spirits to play with a verve and joie de vivre that other managers could not locate.


Either way, his reign certainly wasn't all bad. Where his reputation is concerned, it might be time for the football cognoscenti to order a retrial

Decent article but it isn't half spun to make him look alot better than he was.

Some rightly pointed out that if you include the season where both he and Houllier managed, his average of league positions isn't that high. Also, the premiership was the 4th best league in Europe at best at the time. So it's no massive acheivement.

As for comments about the cup-runs, well I think we can all agree there's a slight difference between fluking a Worthington Cup victory and going out and winning the Champions League.

Not as good a manager as that article makes out. Even if he did play good football. Ultimately, he's as much responsible for the decline of Fowler as he is for anything positive. Ferguson or Wenger would not have let him get so out of control in his youth and would have nipped the whole spiceboys thing in the bud IMHO.

Not a patch on what replaced him and I include Houllier in that.

RAFA'S SECRET RONALDINHO WEAPON
Jimmy Rice 13 February 2007

Right-back Alvaro Arbeloa has assured his teammates that Ronaldinho can be stopped – because he's done it himself.

Arbeloa kept the Brazilian playmaker quiet earlier this season when Deportivo drew with Barcelona.

"I was happy with most of my performances for Depor this season but that one against Barcelona stands out because I was up against Ronaldinho directly, and he is one of the best players in the world," the Spaniard told LFC Magazine.

"We drew 1-1 and I did well but I was helped by the rest of my teammates. They helped me double up on him when I needed assistance and we fought well all over the pitch so they didn't get a lot of time on the ball.

"You are nothing in football as an individual; you need the team to get good results."

Arbeloa believes Barca have weaknesses that Liverpool are more than capable of exploiting.

"It is true that they are not playing at their best this season and they have been dropping points to teams that people expect them to beat. We should be confident going into those games because we are not inferior to them.

"There will be areas we can exploit over there and the fact that the home leg is second also gives us a small advantage.

"It means that Barca will have to take the game to Liverpool and from what I have seen of this team they like to play the game this way."

Obispo wrote:

Not as good a manager as that article makes out. Even if he did play good football. Ultimately, he's as much responsible for the decline of Fowler as he is for anything positive. Ferguson or Wenger would not have let him get so out of control in his youth and would have nipped the whole spiceboys thing in the bud IMHO.

Not a patch on what replaced him and I include Houllier in that.

Evans was a great part of the Liverpool past but he was the bottom of the barrel when it came to the boot room boys managers. The likes of him, Ronnie Moran and Graeme Souness were only really treading water. As a part of the backroom staff he was great, it's a shame once promoted the way he was it's very difficult to go back.

Interesting to compare to my 'team from ten years ago vs now' thread last week. Basically the current team is better than Evans's in virtually every respect, apart from strikers, and as you've pointed out, Evans's handling of Fowler and Collymore was far from perfect. And Houllier's and Rafa's teams have been mentally tougher and as a result more consistent.

It's like saying Kevin Keegan was a great Newcastle manager because he nearly won the league once.

What's happened to Speedy Gonzalez

Crouching Punty wrote:What's happened to Speedy Gonzalez

Shat himself at the thought of facing Oleguer in 5 days time.

kas wrote:

Crouching Punty wrote:What's happened to Speedy Gonzalez

Shat himself at the thought of facing Oleguer in 5 days time.

Whats happened to Oleguer, i haven't heard anybody moaning about him in age

Crouching Punty wrote:

kas wrote:

Crouching Punty wrote:What's happened to Speedy Gonzalez

Shat himself at the thought of facing Oleguer in 5 days time.

Whats happened to Oleguer, i haven't heard anybody moaning about him in age

That's because he is the world's second best rightback

Naahh.. honestly, he has been our best rightback lately, with Zambrotta playing on the left pushing forward, and Oleguer forming a 3 man defense when we have possession.. he has even been taking shots on goal

We keep getting linked with voronin on a pre contract

don't know much about him but the thought of getting him hardly fills me with delight

Same here. He's a decent player, nothing more. The only thing I can think is that one of Crouch/Bellamy (more like Bellamy given the style of player Voronin) will be sold in the summer. Voronin will come in as back up and we'll get another top class forward to replace Robbie.

But if that's the case just bring Pongo back!

He'll probably end up going to Celtic anyways. More first team chances and all that.

Obispo wrote:Same here. He's a decent player, nothing more. The only thing I can think is that one of Crouch/Bellamy (more like Bellamy given the style of player Voronin) will be sold in the summer. Voronin will come in as back up and we'll get another top class forward to replace Robbie.

But if that's the case just bring Pongo back!

He'll probably end up going to Celtic anyways. More first team chances and all that.

Don't you think that Pongo might be tempted to stay at Recre?