Which league is the strongest?

About Sparta: http://www.ajax-usa.com/teams/sparta.html

Great read!

Ajax 9-0 Sparta

DeañoTheEmo-WHUFC wrote:

DD wrote:

DeañoTheEmo-WHUFC wrote:@DD...I was just comparing Germany and France...I didn't include Portuguese or Dtch teams

OK

Was a bit unclear. It seemed as if you disregarded those two leagues completely.

No...I just don't see the big deal about the French league....from what Ive seen it's poor...apart from Lyon...

Basicly yeah. There's some quality talent running around, and better defenses that's it. Plenty of young Africans getting their first taste of big league football too. As a league I'm not impressed, and I rate the German league above it; The Germans are more entertaining as well.

Its always when the French teams come up in the european football round ups that you doze slightly off. Most other leagues hold the attention better: Serie A, La Liga, Superliga, bundesliga.
The French are better than the Belgians though. Now that's championship level.

Axeslammer wrote:

Tweedle wrote:@ dutchies

I humbly apologise for not being an expert on the history of your league.

I almost went for Heerenveen but to be honest, apart from the big 4 in your league there really ain't too much else to know about

Nothing to be ashamed off.

We (Dutchies) know what are place is (unlike the Germans for example), we ourselves call de Eredivisie a Micky Mouse league

About Heerenveen : http://www.ajax-usa.com/teams/heerenveen.html

About Twente : http://www.ajax-usa.com/teams/twente.html

Try it, it's a great read !

Great site by the way, I love what they wrote about FC Groningen too

Thanks, that was ten minutes of my life well spent

The reason why I put Bundesliga above the rest is coz there are at least 4 pretty decent teams there, which on an average are better than the top 4 in the other leagues.

@DD

I would rate them roughly as follows (slightly different than yours):

Lyon = Bayern > PSV > Bremen > Porto > Benfica > Sporting > Schalke > Lens > AZ > Stuttgart > Ajax > Lille > Twente > Braga > Marseille

hence, Bundesliga > Ligue 1 > SuperLiga > Eredivisie

yeah, the difference is not that much, tho I do think that Bundesliga is a bit clear on top...

If you compare recent (let's say 5-6 years) results between the league 1 teams and Bundesliga teams they are clearly in favor of the league 1


Lyon beat Bayern, and Bremen

Sochaux kicked Dortmund ass 4-0 a few years ago,

and this year Nancy beat Schalke this year (the actual leader in the Bundesliga).

But to be honest I don't think there's a huge difference between the two. Both leagues have some big teams which are struggling, such as Dortmund and Leverkussen in the Bundesliga, and P.S.G, Monaco, Marseille in the League 1

Alive and Kicking wrote:If you compare recent (let's say 5-6 years) results between the league 1 teams and Bundesliga teams they are clearly in favor of the league 1


Lyon beat Bayern, and Bremen

Sochaux kicked Dortmund ass 4-0 a few years ago,

and this year Nancy beat Schalke this year (the actual leader in the Bundesliga).

But to be honest I don't think there's a huge difference between the two. Both leagues have some big teams which are struggling, such as Dortmund and Leverkussen in the Bundesliga, and P.S.G, Monaco, Marseille in the League 1

I agree, I honestly feel that ligue one is better than the bundesliga nowadays.

Its not just about lyon and Lille either - there's Monaco, Marseille, Bordeaux - all of which have done well in Euro comps recently

I know we were told not to include the big 3 but at the moment:

1. England/Spain

2. Italy/France

3.Portugal/Holland/Germany


Putting Germany ahead of France is comedy.

If France played Germany 1-20 I reckon France would win 15 of them.

German look like they play for fun - French can be boring but they are very serious.

Look where Nantes, PSG and Monaco are in the League - Germany has nothing like that depth.

French teams are negative but athletic - always going to be hard to play against.

Bayern and Werder are the 2 most well known but neither are very athletic teams and German defences in the CL over the last couple of years have been an absolute joke.

It may be fashionable to slag Lille off on here but you know they'd give anyone a game.

As for Monaco - they are near the relegation zone but I wouldn't be comfortable backing Real Madrid, Man U, Arsenal or Bayern to do them over 2 legs.

Why do you think our clubs are always being linked with Ligue 1 players more than players from other leagues ?

You are deluded, my friend, if you think Ligue 1 is anywhere near Serie A.

But I do take your point, if we only consider performance in Europe over the last 5 years as an indication, then Ligue 1 is better than Bundesliga...

As per performance in europe over last 5 years:

La Liga > EPL > Serie A > Ligue 1> SuperLiga > Bundesliga > Eredivisie

Stefan Kuntz wrote:

1. England/Spain

2. Italy/France

3.Portugal/Holland/Germany

What people fail to understand is that the (relative) strength of leagues goes in cycles as well. This "big three" nonsense can only be seen temporarily (if it makes sense at all), because not so long ago, the oh so weak Bundesliga was the strongest league in the world, for example, dominating in the European competitions.

There are a ton of factors that need to be considered, money is the most obvious one, but not the only one. Every European league, including the so called "big three", had a crisis, periods without success in the European competitons. They all came back, and so will the Bundesliga. It's just a matter of time.

The biggest, most football crazy (still the highest average attendances) European country won't go away anytime soon guys, I'm sorry.

blutgraetsche wrote:
The biggest, most football crazy (still the highest average attendances) European country won't go away anytime soon guys, I'm sorry.

The high attendances don't make it the most football crazy country in Europe.

The low ticket prices are responsible for the those attendance rates.

I do agree on the cycles though and I do expect better times will reach the Bundesliga in the future.

Nonsense. Even with relatively low ticket prices (only England is considerably more expensive btw.), you need to fill a 80,000 seater stadium like Dortmund does every week, despite their lack of success in the last few years (almost went bankrupt).

And not in many countries, especially not the bigger ones, you get viewing rates of over 90% on international games (~30 million households).

You only get that many viewers because there's nothing else good on TV

borocooper wrote:You only get that many viewers because there's nothing else good on TV

Hey, we get to see a lot of nekkidness on TV over here, much more than you guys. That usually works.

Dirty Germans.

Alive and Kicking wrote:If you compare recent (let's say 5-6 years) results between the league 1 teams and Bundesliga teams they are clearly in favor of the league 1


Lyon beat Bayern, and Bremen

Sochaux kicked Dortmund ass 4-0 a few years ago,

and this year Nancy beat Schalke this year (the actual leader in the Bundesliga).

But to be honest I don't think there's a huge difference between the two. Both leagues have some big teams which are struggling, such as Dortmund and Leverkussen in the Bundesliga, and P.S.G, Monaco, Marseille in the League 1

If you look at the head-to-head between French and Portuguese lately (4 years) Portuguese teams have beaten the French.

Porto beat Lens in the Uefa Cup and Marseille and Lyon in CL. Boavista beat PSG in the Uefa Cup.

Sporting beat both Feyenoord and AZ in Uefa cup as well.

So the head to head is a complicated affair.

Tweedle wrote:Dirty Germans.

You been on the shandy's again?

BTW, Tweeds where is Guimarães?

Braga=Guimarães

Huge rivalry.

In terms of potential, Guimarães has more; bigger fan base, very loyal and dynamic fans. If they could just get their act together like Braga has at the moment, Vitória Sport Club (V. Guimarães) would be fighting for the title.

As long as Braga beat T*ttenham they are good in my books

Luso wrote:

Alive and Kicking wrote:If you compare recent (let's say 5-6 years) results between the league 1 teams and Bundesliga teams they are clearly in favor of the league 1


Lyon beat Bayern, and Bremen

Sochaux kicked Dortmund ass 4-0 a few years ago,

and this year Nancy beat Schalke this year (the actual leader in the Bundesliga).

But to be honest I don't think there's a huge difference between the two. Both leagues have some big teams which are struggling, such as Dortmund and Leverkussen in the Bundesliga, and P.S.G, Monaco, Marseille in the League 1

If you look at the head-to-head between French and Portuguese lately (4 years) Portuguese teams have beaten the French.

Porto beat Lens in the Uefa Cup and Marseille and Lyon in CL. Boavista beat PSG in the Uefa Cup.

Sporting beat both Feyenoord and AZ in Uefa cup as well.

So the head to head is a complicated affair.

Well yes you did won from AZ and fair play but wasnt it like in the 96th minute in play? Or even after in the 122th minute?

And didn't Heerenveen won fairly easy from *cant remember the name* this year?

I think Portugal and Holland are pretty even overall with both producing great talents and both just behind France and a small larger gap towards Germany.

blutgraetsche wrote:Nonsense. Even with relatively low ticket prices (only England is considerably more expensive btw.), you need to fill a 80,000 seater stadium like Dortmund does every week, despite their lack of success in the last few years (almost went bankrupt).

And not in many countries, especially not the bigger ones, you get viewing rates of over 90% on international games (~30 million households).

Have to give the germans respect as the italians hardly ever fill their stadiums and the cost here is not that expensive, maybe something like 30-50 euros for the middle tier in the san siro.

110% wrote:

Have to give the germans respect as the italians hardly ever fill their stadiums and the cost here is not that expensive, maybe something like 30-50 euros for the middle tier in the san siro.

For a season ticket ?

Otherwise it *is* expensive.

I used to pay 4-6 euros to see NEC.

DD wrote:I used to pay 4-6 euros to see NEC.

I can remember paying 80 guilders for a FC Groningen grownups season ticket...

Milko Djurovski, Hennie Meijer, Harris Huizingh, Jos Roosien....those were the days

Since 1888 wrote:

Luso wrote:

Alive and Kicking wrote:If you compare recent (let's say 5-6 years) results between the league 1 teams and Bundesliga teams they are clearly in favor of the league 1


Lyon beat Bayern, and Bremen

Sochaux kicked Dortmund ass 4-0 a few years ago,

and this year Nancy beat Schalke this year (the actual leader in the Bundesliga).

But to be honest I don't think there's a huge difference between the two. Both leagues have some big teams which are struggling, such as Dortmund and Leverkussen in the Bundesliga, and P.S.G, Monaco, Marseille in the League 1

If you look at the head-to-head between French and Portuguese lately (4 years) Portuguese teams have beaten the French.

Porto beat Lens in the Uefa Cup and Marseille and Lyon in CL. Boavista beat PSG in the Uefa Cup.

Sporting beat both Feyenoord and AZ in Uefa cup as well.

So the head to head is a complicated affair.

Well yes you did won from AZ and fair play but wasnt it like in the 96th minute in play? Or even after in the 122th minute?

And didn't Heerenveen won fairly easy from *cant remember the name* this year?

I think Portugal and Holland are pretty even overall with both producing great talents and both just behind France and a small larger gap towards Germany.

Sporting won the first match in Portugal against AZ and lost the second in Holland, but qualified on away goals. That's football.

Sporting has actually never been knocked out of Europe by a Dutch club, but like I said, the comparisons aren't exactly conclusive.

As you pointed out, Herenveen beat Setúbal this year, although they were pretty lucky in Portugal and Setúbal is pretty shitty this year. But just like Sporting against AZ, that's football.

As I said, pretty equal.

Portugal has been producing shit loads of talent over the last decade and a half.... while people refered to the age of souza-figo-rui costa-pinto as the golden age, it has harding stopped with ronaldo-quaresma-nani-deco.... and so many others.... portugal are only becoming stronger as a football nation! If they had a Toni (instead of that wanker pauleta), they could ve won the world cup!!

(don't say that deco is not really portuguese, I know.... still)

Resilient Il Fenomeno wrote:I think the Portuguese teams are underrated!

bluenine wrote:

Portugal has been producing shit loads of talent over the last decade and a half.... while people refered to the age of sousa-figo-rui costa-pinto as the golden age, it has harding stopped with ronaldo-quaresma-nani-deco.... and so many others.... portugal are only becoming stronger as a football nation!

(don't say that deco is not really portuguese, I know.... still)

Resilient Il Fenomeno wrote:I think the Portuguese teams are underrated!

Agreed gentelmen.

Portuguese football has it's problems, and they are many, but it doesn't get nearly the respect it deserves. Most people would count it in around the 10th league in Europe, give or take, in terms of importance.

However, comparing it with other leagues of similar stature, Portugal holds it's own. How many European/International trophies have French clubs
won? The Dutch have done well in term of European Cups, but they haven't blown us away by any means.

It just seems even Scotland, Turkey and Greece are considered better leagues, and quite simply, there are no figures that point in that direction.

Portugal= 4 European Cups, 1 Cup Winners Cup, 1 Uefa Cup, 2 European Super Cups & 2 Intercontinental Cups.

If you count the number of times our clubs have made the Semi-finals and Finals of European competitions you'll see they've done quite well for themselves.

I'm done now.

Axeslammer wrote:

110% wrote:

Have to give the germans respect as the italians hardly ever fill their stadiums and the cost here is not that expensive, maybe something like 30-50 euros for the middle tier in the san siro.

For a season ticket ?

Otherwise it *is* expensive.

30 euros against certain teams, 50 euros against top teams (e.g. the derby)

But the season ticket is only about 250 Euros so it's not that bad. I have a friend who's a season ticket holder at the Emirates Stadium and I'm sure he's paying at least double, maybe even triple that.