The Greatest… In Spain At Least

I can't even believe this is even up for debates; Buffon and cech are head and shoulders above all other keepers, casillas is good but not in their class.

Target Man SSK wrote:

Hardrada wrote:

supermadrid(zizou legend) wrote:
so you think that if cech or buffon was in the madrid goal they would do better. i doubt it and we dont concede loads of goals. also casillas has shown his concentration before when we were a better team and dominated play. at that time the opposition would get maybe a chance or two maybe and casillas never failed. so casillas has done it both ways and succeded.

No - Casillas is better for you. He would certainly be worse for us, ManU, Inter, Milan, Lyon etc. than Cech or Buffon though.

And how do you come to this conclusion?

Opinion. In the same way that you Madridstas believe Casillas is better for you than any other goalkeeper.

wasn't capello even considering replacing casillas with madrid's second keeper at the start of the season?

One thing about Cech is that I have never, ever seen him make a mistake. Please do point one out because I can't think of any. He's fucking superhuman.

I always imagine it like a scene from Terminator 2:

Cech walks up to Terry: "I'm here to protect you". "Come with me if you want a clean sheet".

OwenThomas4 wrote:One thing about Cech is that I have never, ever seen him make a mistake. Please do point one out because I can't think of any. He's fucking superhuman.

I always imagine it like a scene from Terminator 2:

Cech walks up to Terry: "I'm here to protect you". "Come with me if you want a clean sheet".

Having watched either the full match/highlights of each Chelsea game since Cech came here, I can only think of one against F*lham, where he came out to collect the ball, fumbled it and F*lham scored.

Of all the teams it had to happen against

Still, 1 mistake in 3 seasons.

S4P2 wrote:

OwenThomas4 wrote:One thing about Cech is that I have never, ever seen him make a mistake. Please do point one out because I can't think of any. He's fucking superhuman.

I always imagine it like a scene from Terminator 2:

Cech walks up to Terry: "I'm here to protect you". "Come with me if you want a clean sheet".

Having watched either the full match/highlights of each Chelsea game since Cech came here, I can only think of one against F*lham, where he came out to collect the ball, fumbled it and F*lham scored.

Of all the teams it had to happen against

Still, 1 mistake in 3 seasons.

Yup that's his biggest one.
Its not like he doesn't make mistakes, but the bigger ones he rarely makes and the minor ones people either can't recognise them or remeber them.
He's fumbled an aditional ball or three over the seasons, but none had a consequence as bad this one. He has a very percentage of either catching the ball or punching it away, but I have noticed him a couple of minor mistake son his part now and then (between lots of games I have to say). I have also seen Cech waste a long kicks and remember vividly him also fluffing a kick completely. Its not really fair on him though as you could count his big prem mistakes on one hand. And besides we're only focussing and tryiong to remember his mistakes here.

Cech is certainly among the very best.

Spot on DD.

I've seen Cech make loads of minor mistakes (e.g. pushing the ball back out when catching is easier - although Terry has usually picked up the pieces so it hasn't looked like a mistake), but the major mistakes which you see even the best keepers make are very very few and far between.

bluenine wrote:Serie A got some good ones too:

Buffon, Cesar, De Sanctis, Frey, Pantanelli, Amelia, Abbiati, Perruzzi, Dida, Agliardi, Doni, Curci, Toldo, Storari, etc

blutgraetsche wrote:

S4P2 wrote:The Premiership is probably the strongest league around when it comes to goalkeepers.

Nein.


Wiese, Kahn, Weidenfeller, Enke, Rensing, Neuer, Adler, Jentzsch, Schäfer, Rost etc.


Thank God that they have not caught the attention of foreign clubs yet.

to the bolded name

As someone who has watched Buffon a lot in Italy games, and Cech and Casillas (almost) week in week out, here's my ranking:

1. Buffon

2. Casillas

3. Cech


I can't be bothered to explain since most points have been raised in this thread already, and I posted my views on this topic in a thread last week.
One point - take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

kas wrote:As someone who has watched Buffon a lot in Italy games, and Cech and Casillas (almost) week in week out, here's my ranking:

1. Buffon

2. Casillas

3. Cech

I can't be bothered to explain since most points have been raised in this thread already, and I posted my views on this topic in a thread last week.
One point - take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

i agree, but cech is still a fantastic goalkeeper

kas wrote:
One point - take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

In that case, you can say take away Casillas' $h!t defence, then see how his long-term concentration is.

S4P2 wrote:

kas wrote:
One point - take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

In that case, you can say take away Casillas' $h!t defence, then see how his long-term concentration is.

But concentration is not as big a factor as height is

kas wrote:

S4P2 wrote:

kas wrote:
One point - take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

In that case, you can say take away Casillas' $h!t defence, then see how his long-term concentration is.

But concentration is not as big a factor as height is

You think?

A goalkeeper has to be fully concentrated throughout the 90 minutes. Especially if they play behind a well organised defence, because the attacks will be few and far between so they have to be ready for when they are.

Casillas isn't a tall goalkeeper, yet you regard him as the 2nd best in the world.

S4P2 wrote:

OwenThomas4 wrote:One thing about Cech is that I have never, ever seen him make a mistake. Please do point one out because I can't think of any. He's fucking superhuman.

I always imagine it like a scene from Terminator 2:

Cech walks up to Terry: "I'm here to protect you". "Come with me if you want a clean sheet".

Having watched either the full match/highlights of each Chelsea game since Cech came here, I can only think of one against F*lham, where he came out to collect the ball, fumbled it and F*lham scored.

Of all the teams it had to happen against

Still, 1 mistake in 3 seasons.

Blackburn at home in 05-06 I believe... I'm sure he made a gaff, or had an indecisive moment that led to a goal.

Maybe I'm just being picky.

Concentration is definitely important...my team's keeper is Valdes who has a similar situation to Cech. Despite what most people think about Barcelona's defending, Valdes often has nothing to do in games, but suddenly has to make saves.

The thing is, Cech's height makes a huge difference when he makes saves that are unsaveable. Because he just naturally has a bigger reach than anyone else. Same with crosses, he just has to run out and stretch his arms, so even if he mis-judges it we'll never know because he can catch it anyway. And even if he doesn't have to dive to make a save, his frame automatically puts off strikers, since they have less of the goal to aim for.

I guess I'm unfairly criticising him for his physical attributes, but in terms of talent I can't say he's as good as the first two. Trust me, it's very difficult for me to put a Madrid player in the top 3 of anything, and I actually think Casillas is very dodgy at crosses. In my ranking there is a huge gap between Buffon and the other two.

And one more factor - that ranking is as of this moment in time. Cech is still 22 I think, and already playing in a very challenging league for goalkeepers. So I think he can improve a lot.

I wouldn't be ok with marquez leaving unless we sign Andrade,Chivo or Milito 1st.

Messiah wrote:I wouldn't be ok with marquez leaving unless we sign Andrade,Chivo or Milito 1st.

Milito's off to Juve. Chivu most probably Inter, though apparently we're still in touch. Andrade is possible.

I think things will be a lot clearer a week from today, once the league and South African friendly have finished.

S4P2 wrote:

kas wrote:
One point - take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

In that case, you can say take away Casillas' $h!t defence, then see how his long-term concentration is.

but have you seen Real madrid or casillas when we were dominating. it was the same as with cech and valdez now. he had little to do but always showed up. im sorry but this argument simply doesnt hold up if look back at all of casillas time. and like i said casillas is best suited for Real style and cech/buffon is best suited for chelsea/juve style of play.
casillas might get problems with height in the prem but cech would problems with anticipation for example. cant we just leave it at that.

it all really depends on how you rate a keeper
if its mobility, shot stopping or reflexes its casillas
if its strength and aerial and cross control is cech
if you want all of those attributes mixed at best its buffon.

clearly everybody has an opinion on these matters but i think its fair to state that these statements are true

kas wrote:take away Cech's height, and let's see how many he saves. This is esp. important also regarding his excellent handling of crosses.

erm

that's incredibly retarded.

Its like saying "take away Eto'o/Essien/Ronaldinho's pace and they won't be as good".

Being tall also means that its harder for him to reach low shots, but he does it anyway (save vs Puyol's header at the Bridge in 05 springs to mind).

Buffon is also being overrated on this thread. He's the best, but not massively better than Cech. The main advantage he has is that he's been better for longer, so deserves to be number 1 for now. Buffon does not have as good reactions as Casillas, but is still better.

S4P2 wrote:

Torrente wrote:

S4P2 wrote:The Premiership is probably the strongest league around when it comes to goalkeepers.

Cech is considered by many to be the best goalkeeper around.

Reina would be 1st choice if he were almost any other nationality.

VDS may not be as good as he was, but would still walk into the vast majority of La Liga teams.

Lehmann - See VDS. Also disposed Kahn as Germany's no.1

Given is also a very good goalkeeper, as is Jussi and Brad Friedel.

Cudicini is probably the best no.2 goalkeeper in Europe (although I won't say he definitely is because there may be another keeper I'm unaware of).

I can tell you don't watch much of La Liga, because there's no way Van Der Sar or Lehman would walk into most teams. They are both highly mistake prone and definitely not as good as most La Liga goalies. I'll give you Cech and Reina (who came from Villareal anyway). Given is pretty good, though Friedle is past it IMO.

We have Casillas, Kameni, Canizares, Cesar, and Palop, who are all top class. So is Diego Lopez (Madrid's number 2), who will be playing in Zaragoza next year.

When I watched Chelsea v Valencia at the Bridge I was appalled by Canizares performance. He made a couple of excellent saves in the 2nd leg, but was still poor. If you are telling me that Valencia would have him over VDS or Lehmann, I'm shocked to tell you the truth.

How often have you seen Cañizares? Two performances, one of which was outstanding, but for a shot that should have never have been allowed to get near him anyway. Why do you not blame Valencia´s defence for not closing Essien down? If that had happened you would all be raving about Cañizares incredible save in that match. I would prefer a new goalkeeper, but would let Cañizares fight for his place. He is still a good keeper.