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Formerly known as sheva7
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    Oranje Thread

    debaser
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    Post by debaser Sat Jun 07, 2014 4:09 pm

    Fey wrote:They let the people decide over the last few weeks what would be the best Holland team of all-time, this is what the people came up with:

    ----------van der Sar--------------
    Suurbier----Rijkaard---de Boer----van Bronckhorst
    -------Neeskens---Cruijff-----van Hanegem
    ---Bergkamp----van Basten-----Robben

    no Drenthe?
    Isco Benny
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    Post by Isco Benny Sat Jun 07, 2014 4:44 pm

    Oi Fey, how good is Janmaat? Apparently Pochettino wants him. Sounds like another overrated Rottendam c**t. Am I right?
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    Post by Fey Sat Jun 07, 2014 7:04 pm

    Best right fullback in the world..cant really defend but who cares. Why would he go to Spurs though, Napoli and Juve want him as well.
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    Post by bluenine Sat Jun 07, 2014 11:50 pm

    Fey wrote:They let the people decide over the last few weeks what would be the best Holland team of all-time, this is what the people came up with:

    ----------van der Sar--------------
    Suurbier----Rijkaard---de Boer----van Bronckhorst
    -------Neeskens---Cruijff-----van Hanegem
    ---Bergkamp----van Basten-----Robben

    Ruud Gullit is so under rated, I would put him there above Bergkamp, afterall he was key in Holland winning the only trophy they have ever won.
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:15 am

    Funny you mention him, I wanted to start a monologue about Ruudje Dill for a while now.

    If he was anything, then it's overrated. Ahead of his time he was, that's something else. A nr 10 like him today would be at Everton or something like that. In his time he stood out due to his EPL physics, which in Holland was something new to have a playmaker-second striker like him. Was also a great header, and he was a born leader due to his charisma. But a truly great player, no. A more versatile version of a Rooney or a Drogba. But im fairly sure if he would play today, he woudnt have the same stats or being as good as them. And he had the same nose as Zlatan, in picking good potential teams.

    As for the all-time team, bare in mind, it was done with a poll on internet I believe, so many players of the last couple of years. Gullit did come second after Bergkamp.
    blutgraetsche
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    Post by blutgraetsche Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:13 pm

    Louis van Gaal loses temper during Holland training - video

    Van Gaal makes a pretty ordinary Dutch squad at least 30% better. And he has understood that this is going to be a World Cup of extreme climatic challenges, so the teams have to adapt to the situation. Can see Holland getting a 'surprise result' vs. Spain.
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    Post by Fey Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:54 pm

    You mean young and talented? Tell me Blut, how many Bremen kids are at the WC? Also deGuzman is out for Spain it seems IE Clasie vs Xavi/Iniesta  Blush 

    Love how the crowd goes wild when Louis is bursting, with that fat belly of him.

    Must say Holland has a blazing location to stay in, unlike the Germans who build their own village, Holland stay on the beach of Ipanema. Which is very nice for the locals as well, they can bump into a world class player any time of the day

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 Media_xll_2300333

    They train on the field of Flamengo, and their president said that now 45 million Brazilians will support Holland as well now!
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    Post by messiah Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:58 pm

    given that van gaal is probably the best coach at the world cup, holland are my dark horses
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Sun Jun 08, 2014 4:22 pm

    He most likely is the best coach out there. Unworkable with once you get older...but if you see who made his debut under him:

    Ajax - Edgar Davids, Jari Litmanen, Patrick Kluivert, Michael Reiziger, Edwin van der Sar and Clarence Seedorf.
    Barca - Victor Valdes, Carles Puyol, Xavi Hernandez, Andres Iniesta, Motta, Gabri, Pepe Reina.
    Bayern - Thomas Müller and David Alaba.
    blutgraetsche
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    Post by blutgraetsche Sun Jun 08, 2014 4:58 pm

    Fey wrote:You mean young and talented?

    No, I mean pretty shit, just putting it more diplomatically.


    Tell me Blut, how many Bremen kids are at the WC?

    None, because we're shit currently and simply not good enough. That so many Feyenoord players are in the Dutch squad is telling though...


    Also deGuzman is out for Spain it seems IE Clasie vs Xavi/Iniesta  Blush

    Iniesta will be happy to see a younger guy with a worse hairline than his. And he's even smaller, too. Wonder how much Clasie and Sneijder are bringing the average height of the team down, knowing that the Dutch are one of the smaller teams of the tournament, despite (supposedly) being the "tallest nation on earth"....
     

    Love how the crowd goes wild when Louis is bursting, with that fat belly of him.

    Must say Holland has a blazing location to stay in, unlike the Germans who build their own village, Holland stay on the beach of Ipanema. Which is very nice for the locals as well, they can bump into a world class player any time of the day

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 Media_xll_2300333

    They likely confused Kuyt with the janitor or something and wanted to be polite, Brazil's economy can do with the tourists after all, even the loud and annoying Dutch ones.


    They train on the field of Flamengo, and their president said that now 45 million Brazilians will support Holland as well now!

    Oh my, you guys are a gullible lot. 45 million Brazilians on the streets demonstrating (and looting your hotel) is more like it.
    debaser
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    Post by debaser Sun Jun 08, 2014 9:29 pm

    messiah wrote:given that van gaal is probably the best coach at the world cup, holland are my dark horses

    you really can't pick one of the finalists from the last world cup as 'dark horses' Laughing 
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    Post by messiah Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:13 pm

    debaser wrote:
    messiah wrote:given that van gaal is probably the best coach at the world cup, holland are my dark horses

    you really can't pick one of the finalists from the last world cup as 'dark horses' Laughing 

     Laughing yeah thats true
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    Post by mongrel hawk Mon Jun 09, 2014 2:17 am

    Fey wrote:They train on the field of Flamengo, and their president said that now 45 million Brazilians will support Holland as well now!

    actually, Flamenguistas are divided between Germany and Holland, because Germany adopted Flamengo's shirt design as their away shirt.
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Mon Jun 09, 2014 7:17 pm

    Blutty wrote:No, I mean pretty shit, just putting it more diplomatically.

    You never ever even seen the Fey-Jugend. They won more as kids as Germany's kids, which did well in 2010


    Bernie wrote:None, because we're shit currently and simply not good enough. That so many Feyenoord players are in the Dutch squad is telling though...

    You are right, Bremen are shite and were lucky not to relegate. In 1974 Holland also had many Feyenoord players, worked out fine back then.

    Is wrote:Iniesta will be happy to see a younger guy with a worse hairline than his. And he's even smaller, too. Wonder how much Clasie and Sneijder are bringing the average height of the team down, knowing that the Dutch are one of the smaller teams of the tournament, despite (supposedly) being the "tallest nation on earth"....

    Clasie has a great hairline, and will be playing his own idol, Xavi, Iniesta will be jealous of his hair and his muscled calfs.
     

    My Favourite wrote:They likely confused Kuyt with the janitor or something and wanted to be polite, Brazil's economy can do with the tourists after all, even the loud and annoying Dutch ones.

    Brazilians know what a good footballer is, and they see one in Kuyt. Just because he aint Joga Bonito, doesnt mean they wont like him. They know he was MotM against them 4 years ago. And they embrace Dutch people who are now there for the football instead of fucking 12-year olds in the pooper.

    Look how happy this kid from the Favela is when he gets the training shirt from Kuyt

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 Album_10

    Drink wrote:Oh my, you guys are a gullible lot. 45 million Brazilians on the streets demonstrating (and looting your hotel) is more like it.

    Germany gets the support of Indian tribes, the whole of Rio will support Oranje if Brazil goes out. Cold hard facts.
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Mon Jun 09, 2014 8:24 pm

    Leaked!

    Starting team against Spain on friday:

    ------------Cillessen------
    Janmaat---Vlaar---De Vrij----BMI----Blind
    ---------Clasie----de Jong----
    -------------Midget---------------
    ------HSWHW------Robben

     cheers
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    Post by Formerly known as sheva7 Mon Jun 09, 2014 9:21 pm

    Fey, don't envy Robben.

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 2014060958332-%282%29

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 2014060958344

    Midget and Robben are very popular amongst brazilian fans. They don't care if both kicked our asses four years ago. Sportmanship  <Ale> 

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 2014060958327


    I just think that staying in Ipanema and São Conrado like England and Holland might not be a good idea. There are too many distractions.


    mongrel hawk
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    Post by mongrel hawk Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:12 pm

    Formerly known as sheva7 wrote:I just think that staying in Ipanema and São Conrado like England and Holland might not be a good idea. There are too many distractions.

    The girls from Ipanema.  Bubbly 
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    Post by Kimbo Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:31 pm

    mongrel hawk wrote:
    Formerly known as sheva7 wrote:I just think that staying in Ipanema and São Conrado like England and Holland might not be a good idea. There are too many distractions.

    The girls from Ipanema.  Bubbly 

    One of our excuses from the last world cup was boredom.
    Fey
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    Post by Fey Mon Jun 09, 2014 11:20 pm

    Sheva, I dont, I still think Kuyt is a decent footballer, but he showed his Christian face too many times now. And as you might know, I cant stand religious people. Therefore, my love is all for Clasie now these days. 


    Oranje Thread - Page 15 2014060958308

    Looked at him, happy young labrador in the sea. 

    Personally I think it's great players can go outside when they want. They are pro's and adults, it's not a kindergarten. In Poland they were only in the hotel, and Huntelaar started to annoy the shit out of everyone. Sure there are many, many distractions, but if you want a girl you can get one in any place. Though considering the wags arent there, it's a bit asking for it. If I had to pick between this and being with my family in Nova Germania in a hut in the middle of nowhere im going for the first.

    Oranje Thread - Page 15 Laranja
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    Also, yesterday morning they had a yoga session or something like that on the beach, but the weird thing was....they were protected by a battleship! Cant find any pictures of it though.
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    Post by mongrel hawk Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:20 am

    Now I'm certain Brazil will win this WC. All the other nations will forget they are playing a WC before the 2nd round.
    blutgraetsche
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    Post by blutgraetsche Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:10 am

    Formerly known as sheva7 wrote:
    I just think that staying in Ipanema and São Conrado like England and Holland might not be a good idea. There are too many distractions.

    Nah, it's alright. They're just tourists after all...
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    Post by blutgraetsche Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:19 am


    Van Persie: Crash mit Kitesurfer

    Glück im Unglück für ein Duo der niederländischen Nationalmannschaft:

    Beim Spaziergang am Ipanema-Strand von Rio de Janeiro standen Robin van Persie und Daryl Janmaat einem landenden Kitesurfer im Weg.

    "Ich hätte beinahe das Board an den Kopf bekommen", sagte Janmaat dem TV-Sender "NOS". Laut Verbands-Mitteilung seien beide mit "leichten Schürfwunden" davongekommen.

    Der Einsatz am Freitag im Topspiel der Gruppe B gegen Welt- und Europameister Spanien sei daher nicht in Gefahr. Und so steht vor der Neuauflage des WM-Finales von 2010 bei den Niederländern nur ein Fragezeichen hinter Jonathan de Guzman, den Muskelprobleme plagen.

    http://www.sport1.de/de/fussball/wm/newspage_904312.html

    Laughing
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    Post by mongrel hawk Tue Jun 10, 2014 11:15 am

    Fey wrote:Sure there are many, many distractions, but if you want a girl you can get one in any place.

    The thing is, they won't get the girls, the girls will get them. They have no choice.
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    Post by blutgraetsche Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:20 pm

    World Cup: 25 stunning moments … No25: the Cruyff Turn is born in 1974

    When Johan Cruyff sold Jan Olsson the mother of all dummies with the subtlest of swerves, the Dutch captain’s signature move became world-famous as the enduring symbol of Total Football

    It’s the defining image of the 1974 World Cup; the defining image of the great Dutch team of the 70s; the defining image of one of the most talented, enchanting and magical players to ever breeze around a football field.

    It’s the 23rd minute of the Group 3 game between Holland and Sweden at the Westfalenstadion in Dortmund, and Wim van Hanegem has the ball at his feet on the right wing. He’s about to be crowded out by Bjorn Andersson and Ralf Edstrom, so clips a pass back along the flank to Wim Rijsbergen, who in turn flicks the ball inside to Arie Haan, airily ambling through the centre circle. Haan takes a couple of quick, adroit touches to tee himself up, then wafts his right leg, spraying a long diagonal pass towards the left-hand corner flag, towards … Johan Cruyff.

    Cruyff has already spent the opening exchanges of the game causing Sweden’s right-back, Jan Olsson, all manner of pain, bother, trouble and angst. But now he’s going to take it up a notch. Sticking out a telescopic left leg, Cruyff kills Haan’s pass. Well, nearly. The ball slides a touch to the right, and for a second looks like sticking awkwardly under Cruyff’s right boot. But the Dutch captain adjusts on the hoof, rolls the ball under his studs while turning through 180 degrees. He’s now facing back down the pitch, with Olsson tight behind him and nowhere to go. The full back is doing everything right. Then, through no real fault of his own, he’s doing everything wrong. Having read an almost imperceptible drop of Cruyff’s left shoulder, Olsson makes to chase him back downfield. It’s the right decision 999,999 times out of a million.

    What are the chances? By dropping his shoulder a few millimetres, Cruyff has sold the defender the mother of all dummies, the subtlest of swerves. He caresses the ball with his right instep, pulls it back and spins to the right, retracing those 180 degrees. Olsson’s been packed off downtown, but his opponent is away in the other direction, making good for the touchline, and the Swedish box. A split second, and already there are a couple of yards between the players, Olsson struggling to stay upright as he realises he’s been diddled by a million-to-one shot, Cruyff striding into the area, free as a bird.

    Those are the base mechanics of it, though a thousand words would never be quite enough to paint the full picture. No matter, as two suffice as a trigger to jog the memory: Cruyff Turn. The move became instantly world famous, seared indelibly on the brain, stored forever and available for replay on your mind’s eye-player. There it is! Cruyff Turn!

    This was athletic, aesthetic, balletic brilliance out of the very top drawer. Cruyff was beginning, argued our reporter David Lacey, “to make the sort of impression on the competition that was left by Didi in 1958 and Garrincha in 1962”. Elite company – and that was the reason Olsson never felt ashamed about being diddled, reasoning, quite correctly, that nobody could have stopped a peak-era Cruyff from executing that trick, and in any case to be preserved in amber as an integral part of one of sport’s most magical moments isn’t the worst fate that can befall a player.

    Cruyff’s turn came to symbolise the Total Football being played at the 1974 World Cup by the Dutch, somewhat erroneously perhaps, as it’s really all about one man’s other-worldly skill. Then again, the move does possess many of the trademarks of Holland’s constant carousel: a central midfielder and defender faffing around in tight spots down the right wing; another defender stepping forward to assume the role of playmaker; Cruyff patrolling the left which, if the Dutch footballers’ union had been far stricter about job demarcation, really should have been the beat of his team-mate Piet Keizer.

    In any case, Total Football was less a tactical approach, more a state of mind. Haan explained the concept to the Observer’s man in Munich, Hugh McIlvanney: “People talk of total football as if it is a system, something to replace 4-2-4 or 4-3-3. It is not a system. As it is at any moment, so you play. That is how we understand. Not one or two players make a situation, but five or six. The best is that with every situation all 11 players are involved, but this is difficult. In many teams maybe only two or three play, and the rest are looking. In the Holland team, when you are 60 metres from the ball, you are playing.”

    The Dutch proved the stars of the tournament. They saw off Uruguay 2-0, trounced Bulgaria 4-1, then started turning it on big-style in the second group stage, routing Argentina 4-0 before putting away the reigning world champions Brazil, who ended up resorting to base thuggery. Holland reached the final playing a new style of sexy soccer, and what’s more looked damn fine doing it, long hair flowing, love beads jangling, cheekbones glistening, the first football hipsters. (You can’t blame Cruyff for the way that particular trend developed, any more than you can finger Escoffier for McDonalds, or Laurel and Hardy for Sex Lives of the Potato Men.)

    But there was a small flaw in the plan, which this most famous of moves inadvertently illustrated. The Cruyff Turn didn’t actually lead to anything. At all. Certainly nothing so crass as a goal. Having Harry Houdini’d his way into the Swedish area past Olsson, Cruyff flicked a nonchalant cross with the outside of his right foot towards Johnny Rep, level with the right-hand post, 10 yards out. Rep miscontrolled. Van Hanegem attempted to retrieve the situation by scampering across the face of the area from the right, but merely bounced to the floor off Bo Larsson, looking for a penalty kick that was never going to be awarded. Never mind: who remembers that bit anyway? This was art for art’s sake, more Whistler than Winterbottom, and there’s nothing intrinsically wrong with that.

    Providing you don’t mind not winning trophies, of course. The Dutch dominated the remainder of the Sweden match, but Rep and Keizer were off form up front, while the Swedish goalkeeper Ronnie Hellstroem was in an inspired and awkward mood. Indeed, Sweden could easily have nicked the win, Roland Sandberg fluffing a close-range shot on 81 minutes, Edstrom’s low fizzer being hacked away by a panicked Haan four minutes later. “It is a pity when you fail to produce a positive result after playing so well,” sighed Cruyff after the game. “We have played attacking and entertaining football.” His new party piece had symbolised the sparkling artistry of Total Football, but also served as a reminder that the purest forms of art are devoid of any utilitarian function whatsoever. No goal!

    The Dutch masters also had to address another small problem: the hosts West Germany were world-class operators themselves, staffed with just as much (arguably even more) top-drawer talent. Holland had Cruyff, Rep, Haan and Johan Neeskens; the West Germans boasted Franz Beckenbauer, Sepp Maier, Berti Vogts, Paul Breitner and Gerd Müller. Not only that, the Germans were reigning European champions, had several players from the Bayern Munich team that had recently deposed Ajax as the continent’s No1 club side, and were confident enough to sideline their own idiosyncratic genius, Günter Netzer.

    And their manager Helmut Schön’s view of football, while not quite Total, was not too far removed from that of the Dutch. “His definition of a good team would satisfy the Total Football lobby,” reported this paper. “He says it is one in which attack and defence are equally strong and in which all players are engaged whether the team is attacking or defending. Defenders are involved when the team is attacking, and attackers are involved when the team is defending.” West Germany could certainly walk it like Schön talked it, the left-back Breitner’s winner against Chile in their first match of the 1974 finals illustrating the point. He scored from distance along the inside-right flank, the culmination of a move he’d started himself on the other side of the field. If you blinked, you could have been forgiven for thinking the Bayern prodigy was patrolling both wings at once. The more robust-looking Germans may not have been blessed with the sultry sass of the dynamic Dutch, but a goal like Breitner’s qualified as Total Football. Totally.

    Having said all that, West Germany weren’t half as impressive in the early matches as Holland. They fell to an embarrassing defeat in the group stage to East Germany, though that proved a more political and ideological blow than a sporting one, given it sent them into the easier second-stage group alongside Poland, Sweden and Yugoslavia. Or, to put it another way, Not Holland, Not Holland, and Not Holland. It gave Schön’s side time, space and opportunity to get their chops up and hit their stride; by the time they reached the final, they were ready to square up to the best team in the tournament.

    How three weeks of tournament football had changed perceptions! Before a ball had been kicked, West Germany were “the outstanding favourites” for the 1974 World Cup, according to both the bookmakers and David Lacey, the latter noting that while Australia, Haiti and Zaire were “obvious makeweights, there is remarkably little to choose between the other 12 countries”. Holland had only scraped into the finals thanks to a highly dubious offside decision that went against Belgium in qualification, and despite boasting the “star attraction” in Cruyff, were no more fancied to do well than Poland, Yugoslavia, Uruguay, Argentina or Italy. But the Dutch touchpaper had been lit – an oranje boom – by the sheer audacity of Cruyff’s turn. Holland, now poets in motion, went into the final as new, hot favourites over the hosts.

    “In the Dutch players,” began Hugh McIlvanney’s Observer preview of the final, “as they take the field at the Olympic Stadium, the normal flutter of nerves is likely to be tranquilised by a deep conviction that they have the talent, the courage and the collective maturity to lay emphatic hold on the championship. All who have seen them play, who have thrilled to an attacking style at once so spirited and so cuttingly precise that the effect is of a cavalry charge of surgeons, must share that belief. Yet, for some of us, those echoes of events that took place so many seasons ago tend to form ice cubes in the blood.” The legendary scribe then went on to recall the fate of the Hungarians in the 1954 final. Where, of course, the darlings of the tournament came a cropper against resolute German underdogs.

    The Dutch flew out of the blocks in the final, so much so that they were a goal up before West Germany had even touched the ball. After 16 passes stroked around the back from kick off, Cruyff suddenly drove forward from the centre circle and along the inside-left channel, before drawing a hapless challenge from Uli Hoeness. To nick the catchphrase of the greatest television commentator of the day: one nil!

    Vogts was then booked for persistently fouling Cruyff, an achievement that was quite remarkable (thanks to the BBC’s David Coleman again) seeing only four minutes had elapsed. But this was about as good as it got for the Dutch. They enjoyed the lion’s share for the next 20 minutes or so, stroking the ball around, almost teasing their hosts. Never mind Total Football; Total Humiliation was on the cards. (Mind you, whether the Dutch were collectively hell bent on deliberately shaming their opponents, as the legend states, is a moot point. Van Hanegem certainly had payback for the atrocities of war on his mind, but the team as a whole didn’t goad the Germans with any notable arrogance in their play, or put on any bullfighter’s airs and graces; it was just that, when on song, as they were in these opening exchanges, Holland were simply better at retaining the ball and recycling possession).

    But this approach, while giving Holland dominance, was not foolproof, and the dangers inherent in their laid-back, probing style became apparent soon enough. One 51-second passage of play saw the Dutch ping the ball around with signal insouciance, 11 passes which culminated in an aimless Haan cross from the right. Breitner headed upfield with straightforward purpose, instigating a quick break. Müller was only stopped from racing clear by a desperate last-ditch intervention by Rijsbergen.

    “Misguidedly, Holland continued to slow the rhythm of their game,” reported Lacey. “Perhaps they thought they could win the World Cup without allowing Germany to play in the final. If so, it was a rash assumption, for the Germans needed only a goal to recover their poise and confidence.” The equaliser came after Wim Jansen was denied a chance to break into the German box by an imperious Beckenbauer interception, then made a proper horlicks of chasing back after Bernd Hölzenbein, who was making good towards the area up the other end. The German winger took all available advantage of Jansen’s clumsy lunge; a hint of moral turpitude in the ease with which he went over, perhaps, but the challenge was dafter than the dive was saucy. Breitner, aged 22, slotted the penalty away. Before this match, there had never been a penalty in a World Cup final, a run that had stretched 44 years. Now there had been two in 25 minutes.

    Three minutes after the equaliser, West Germany should have taken the lead. And if you wanted an example of Total Football – or Ramba Zamba in the much more sing-song German parlance – then this was it, Vogts of all people exchanging passes with Hoeness down the inside left, then belting a shot towards the top-left corner. Jan Jongbloed palmed away. Despite all the early Dutch pressure, their keeper had now been forced into more meaningful action than his German counterpart Maier.

    Cruyff quickly began to betray inner turmoil, voicing legitimate concerns at a couple of barely legitimate challenges from Vogts, who was treading a fine disciplinary line, but also coming out on top in the majority of their encounters. But while Vogts gets most of the credit for doing a number on Holland’s star man in this final, the unflappable Beckenbauer won perhaps the most important mental duel with Cruyff. On 35 minutes, Cruyff and Rep sprung into the German half with Breitner and Hans-Georg Schwarzenbeck claiming offside, even though Cruyff received the ball in his own half. The Dutch pair were two on one with Beckenbauer, but the German captain held a central line as he tracked back, ensuring Cruyff couldn’t get a shot away. Cruyff was forced to lay off to Rep on the left, who sent the ball straight at Maier from a much more difficult angle. The star of the 1974 World Cup had been effortlessly shepherded away from danger, the loser of a battle that was less football, more One Man And His Dog.

    The decisive moment came two minutes before half-time. One of Jürgen Grabowski’s increasingly dangerous sorties down the right ended with Müller resetting himself and screwing a shot towards the bottom left, away from a wrong-footed Jongbloed, eight yards out. Müller’s Twist was everything Cruyff’s turn was not. It looked inelegant and scrappy. It was also forensic and brutal. Müller had adjusted his body weight on the hoof, then brilliantly threaded the ball home. Doing what had to be done, he had opportunistically found a way to win the World Cup for his country. It was a swivel as skilful in its own way as Cruyff’s had been. It was just positioned in a different place along the spectrum.

    That was that. The hosts held the lead at half-time and – with Cruyff whining at the referee as the pair left the field and receiving a booking as punishment – had the upper hand mentally, too. Holland would come at West Germany with great determination during the second period, pinning them back in their own area for the last half-hour or so, Rep guilty of an astonishing miss on 77 minutes as he failed to connect at close range with a low Wim Suurbier right-wing cross. But even then, the Germans looked the more likely to actually get the business done: they had a perfectly good Müller chest-down and finish ruled out by an appalling offside decision, and a good appeal for a second penalty turned down when Jansen upended Hölzenbein again, for real this time.

    Poor Holland, who ended up suffering for their art. They’d bared their souls to show the world all they had, and refused to compromise, giving so much pleasure over the course of the tournament. But it was the hosts who were lifting the brand-new Fifa World Cup trophy (Brazil having made off with Jules Rimet’s goddess of victory with their third win four years earlier). A sporting tragedy for Cruyff not to get a winners’ medal, but then what sort of world would we live in if the likes of Beckenbauer and Müller didn’t have one in their collection? And at least Cruyff, the aesthete supreme, was leaving with a unique consolation prize. He went home with an (admittedly intangible) award for artistic merit: the Cruyff Turn ensured his own personal legend, as it became the defining image of the 1974 World Cup, the defining image of the great Dutch team of the Seventies, the defining image of one of the most talented, enchanting and magical players to ever breeze around a football field.

    But is there an image that defines it all better? As Müller twisted again, in celebration at the final whistle of West Germany’s astonishing victory, Cruyff could be seen standing stock still in the middle of a melee, towering above a throng of associates and punters who had surrounded him to offer commiserations. A perfect portrait of existential pain, he’s looking straight ahead, ashen-faced, in a world of solitude, peering exactly one thousand yards into the distance. Another arresting snapshot, but this one said even more about his, and his famous team’s, ultimate failure to get the job done. Never has a man on a football pitch looked so disoriented, lost and alone. With the possible exception, of course, of poor old Jan Olsson.

    http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/jun/11/world-cup-stunning-moments-johan-cruyff-turn-1974
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    Post by Fey Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:38 pm

    Brazilians are so rude when they are confronted with famous people. They turn in Americans. Perhaps it's a new world thing.




    That's what I like about Dutch people, so down to earth we couldnt give a shite if Holland or any other team were walking on the beach.
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    Post by mongrel hawk Wed Jun 11, 2014 5:24 pm

    Brazilians are possibly the most communicative people in the world. 90% of Brazilians are Portuguese speakers only, but language is not a problem. They may talk for hours with sign language with an unknown Jap as if it was the most natural thing.

    And I agree it's rude, and not only with famous people. Here you're walking in the streets and someone you never saw in your life may come to you and ask for the subway fare as if you were his best buddy. Brazilians are streetwise and they don't give a shit if you think they are rude.

    But we have to be careful when we talk about Brazilians, cuase there are many Brazils. In Curitiba, where Spain are based, people are as cold as ice. In Bahia, where Germany is, you may get to know someone and be invited to go to his house after half an hour as if you were his best friend (and I'm not talking about famous people).

    Rio people are also very open. São Paulo is a mix of everything, cause there are people from all over Brazil living here.
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    Post by blutgraetsche Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:07 pm

    Dutch no longer the masters

    POSTED BY SIMON KUPER

    I grew up in Holland, and have supported the Dutch since the 1970s, and I'm familiar with the way the Dutch build up to World Cups. Cafés, houses, even entire streets are decorated orange. If one neighbor refuses to participate, a punch-up can ensue. Possibly no other country lives the World Cup more fully: when Holland played Uruguay in the semifinals in 2010, three-quarters of Dutch people saw at least part of the game on TV. Yet when I visited Amsterdam four weeks before the tournament kicks off, I didn't see orange anywhere in town. The Dutch are approaching this World Cup with expectations near zero. It's not merely that their team is mediocre. The era when this little country punched above its weight in soccer may be over for good.

    There was a telling moment in Holland's last serious warm-up game, the friendly in Paris on March 5. A long pass reached France's striker Karim Benzema. He accelerated away from the Dutch central defender Bruno Martins Indi, who had obviously never seen anything move that fast before. The Dutch keeper, Jasper Cillessen, appeared to share Martins Indi's response, because he had barely begun to move when Benzema's shot rocketed into the net behind him.

    When Dutch clubs play in European competition, you have long had the feeling of watching men play Teletubbies. That may be what awaits them at the World Cup. Part of the problem is a simple lack of muscle. In the showers after an international game last year, some of the Dutch players who play with clubs abroad were teasing Feyenoord center-back Stefan de Vrij, 22, about his weediness. Look at the muscles of his fellow center-back Ron Vlaar, they said. Indeed, Vlaar, who plays for Aston Villa, is one of the few Dutch internationals built like a modern international player. De Vrij got the message. Since Feyenoord did hardly any strength training, he hired his own trainer and began building himself up. But when Feyenoord found out he'd been doing secret training, the club was irate. It stripped him of his captain's armband. Now he's probably about to start the World Cup, and he's still weedy.

    Given the weakness of the defense, Holland's coach Louis van Gaal -- who will join Manchester United after the tournament -- has decided to play five defenders in Brazil. The team's formation will be 5-3-2. "It's a difficult system to play against," he says. The system might be, but the players in it aren't particularly: four of Van Gaal's starting defenders could come from Feyenoord, runner-up in the feeble Dutch league last season. Ruud Gullit, Holland's captain when the country won its only prize, the 1988 European championship, told me that the current generation of home-based players "isn't ready. And of course that has to do with our Dutch league. We have to learn to defend better."

    Holland has only three stars left: the injury-prone 30-year-old forwards Arjen Robben and Robin van Persie, and playmaker Wesley Sneijder, who turned 30 on Monday. Still, he'll probably play, with two defensive midfielders behind him to do the running. Up front, Robben and Van Persie will have to sort things out themselves without much help. For the second World Cup running, Holland won't play the "Dutch school" soccer of constant possession and flowing combinations.

    Johan Cruyff, the father of Dutch football, told the Algemeen Dagblad newspaper: "There is quality. But the players are still too young. ... It's going to be fantastically difficult."

    Most Dutch fans now place what hope they have in Van Gaal, a master tactician who generally prefers playing with young players, whom he can steer almost like robots. This hope is shared by Van Gaal himself. "For every match you have a team tactic," he told the Algemeen Dagblad. "You have to make that trainable. So that you as a team with less individual quality can beat an opponent that is individually better. If you don't execute the tactics well you'll be slaughtered, because then individual quality is decisive. But that generally doesn't happen with the teams I train."

    It would be better for Holland, Van Gaal added, if he were stay on after the World Cup instead of joining Manchester United. "But Dutch soccer doesn't have the highest priority. I myself have the highest priority. Most people don't dare say that, but I do." He's probably leaving a sinking ship. This country of just 17 million people used to have only one advantage in soccer: know-how. As Cruyff once said, "Soccer is a game that you play with your head." Brains took the Dutch to three out of the past 10 World Cup finals. No other small country in recent decades has a comparable record.

    But since about 2000, the Dutch have exported their soccer know-how. Lots of countries now play Dutch soccer, though not the Dutch themselves. Take the three teams Holland will face in its group in Brazil: Spain began importing Dutch intelligence in the early 1970s when Cruyff and his coach Rinus Michels moved from Ajax to Barcelona. In 1988 Cruyff became Barcelona's coach, and made the "Dutch school" the club's house style. From 2008 his protégé Pep Guardiola updated that as "tiki-taka."In Johannesburg in the World Cup final of 2010, Spain beat Holland playing the 21-century version of the Dutch game.

    Chile, also in Holland's group in Brazil, learned its Dutch style through the intermediary of Marcelo Bielsa, the Argentine manager enchanted by Van Gaal. And even the outsider in Holland's group, Australia, had its best run in history at the World Cup of 2006 under the tutelage of the Dutch coach Guus Hiddink. Meanwhile, the Dutch themselves have stopped thinking hard.

    In Brazil, Holland will be playing against versions of itself -- in the case of Spain and probably Chile, better versions. Expect the Spaniards and Chileans to play Dutch-style against Holland, pressing deep on the weak Dutch defense, rather than sitting back and letting Van Persie and Robben attack. The know-how that made Dutch soccer unique is now the property of the world. That may prove fatal. This month could be a mere foretaste of dry times ahead.

    http://www.espnfc.com/team/netherlands/449/blog/post/1864047/simon-kuper-do-holland-stand-a-chance


    lol! oh my Feyenoord. Can't make this up...
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    Post by Fey Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:54 pm

    And rightly so, what if he gets injured there!

    Nontheless, another tedious article from a genuine jew and overrated footballjournalist, that thinks that if Ajax fails to produce talents Dutch football is doomed.


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    Post by Fey Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:01 pm

    van Gaal you DELUDED FUCK! He is gonna play TS afterall!

    Silly man, he needs Clasiesta to disrupt their tiki-takka movenement.
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    Post by blutgraetsche Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:17 pm

    He can only afford one Smurf in the team at a time. This isn't some tournament in the land of Liliput, this is a football world cup.

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