Premier League Fixtures 19/20/21 October 2013

People argue that there isn’t a standout team in the EPL, but i’d say the overall quality has improved. Teams like Southampton/Swansea/WBA are a perfect case in point here. It’s very hard to roll over teams these days. Every team has at least one threat you have to be wary of. And with the advancements in technology/tactics – teams who only play once a week are better prepared for the big guns.

Nah because neither of Man Utd, Chelsea or City look like settled teams yet and they are the sides with the best quality. I'm still expecting that 1/2 of those sides to get their act together and that we will see a more conventional title chase in a couple of months.

Super Laudrup wrote:Nah because neither of Man Utd, Chelsea or City look like settled teams yet and they are the sides with the best quality. I'm still expecting that 1/2 of those sides to get their act together and that we will see a more conventional title chase in a couple of months.

The top sides getting beaten is nothing new though. This has happened for a few years now. With the new TV deals, you have clubs like Southampton that can buy Osvaldo and Ramirez. Norwich have Ricky Van Wollfswinkel. You get the drift. I do expect the aforementioned three to improve but when you have clubs like L'Pool who aren't in Europe and have Sturridge, Suarez playing one game per week, it's evident to see that the competition has improved overall. The only really rubbish club in this league are Palace. Maybe Cardiff too though they have pulled off a few shocks already.

Romford Pele wrote:

Super Laudrup wrote:Nah because neither of Man Utd, Chelsea or City look like settled teams yet and they are the sides with the best quality. I'm still expecting that 1/2 of those sides to get their act together and that we will see a more conventional title chase in a couple of months.

The top sides getting beaten is nothing new though. This has happened for a few years now. With the new TV deals, you have clubs like Southampton that can buy Osvaldo and Ramirez. Norwich have Ricky Van Wollfswinkel. You get the drift. I do expect the aforementioned three to improve but when you have clubs like L'Pool who aren't in Europe and have Sturridge, Suarez playing one game per week, it's evident to see that the competition has improved overall. The only really rubbish club in this league are Palace. Maybe Cardiff too though they have pulled off a few shocks already.

I think Sunderland with the worst start since PL began have got to count as rubbish! they got Giaccherini (who surely made one of the worst moves imaginable - Juve to Sunderland  ) and Fletcher, who'll score goals, but precious little other quality.

Sunderland are dreadful right now but they have some good players. Fletcher, Johnson, Giaccherini, Larsson. Not great but should be doing better than they are for sure.

Johnson's been cack for a few seasons now. Larsson is set pieces and little else. Really their squad is an unholy mixture of past-it/bog-standard PL players and unproven/new to the league. Poyet got a helluva job to make a team out of that lot.

if Fletcher starts scoring and a few of the newbies click they might be okay but otherwise they'll be staying in the bottom 3 all season..

Romford Pele wrote:

Super Laudrup wrote:Nah because neither of Man Utd, Chelsea or City look like settled teams yet and they are the sides with the best quality. I'm still expecting that 1/2 of those sides to get their act together and that we will see a more conventional title chase in a couple of months.

The top sides getting beaten is nothing new though. This has happened for a few years now. With the new TV deals, you have clubs like Southampton that can buy Osvaldo and Ramirez. Norwich have Ricky Van Wollfswinkel. You get the drift. I do expect the aforementioned three to improve but when you have clubs like L'Pool who aren't in Europe and have Sturridge, Suarez playing one game per week, it's evident to see that the competition has improved overall. The only really rubbish club in this league are Palace. Maybe Cardiff too though they have pulled off a few shocks already.

My point is not that the top sides are getting beaten but that they don't look like established sides yet.

Well, even if they don't look like 'established sides' yet, both Chelsea and Man City are winning (most of) their matches and are close to the top of the table, while Man United are lost somewhere in the nether regions. Yes, they had a more difficult schedule, but there really is no guarantee that they'll steamroll the smaller sides they're going to face in the coming weeks. By then, the gap to the top could be too big.

blutgraetsche wrote:Well, even if they don't look like 'established sides' yet, both Chelsea and Man City are winning (most of) their matches and are close to the top of the table, while Man United are lost somewhere in the nether regions. Yes, they had a more difficult schedule, but there really is no guarantee that they'll steamroll the smaller sides they're going to face in the coming weeks. By then, the gap to the top could be too big.

This was my point. There's no guarantee that even when they reach full form that they'll be able to dispatch these sorts of teams.

debaser wrote:Johnson's been cack for a few seasons now. Larsson is set pieces and little else. Really their squad is an unholy mixture of past-it/bog-standard PL players and unproven/new to the league. Poyet got a helluva job to make a team out of that lot.

if Fletcher starts scoring and a few of the newbies click they might be okay but otherwise they'll be staying in the bottom 3 all season..

I'd take their squad over Palace, Cardiff, Hull and even Stoke to be honest. As I said, their squad isn't great but you can still eek out a lot more than what's being shown currently.

Isco Benny wrote:Come on, you have to admit, that's rather impressive aim

And before jizz monkeys like you get on your high horse, the 2 guys involved were shopped to the police with the help of other Spurs fans and have since been arrested.

You massive Jewdeasaurus Rex! That's even worse! Betraying your own fans...only one group of people eh!

I thought a point was probably a fair result in the end in our match, though had Newcastle won I wouldn't have had any complaints. We were very poor until the last 15 minutes or so. First Half we offered nothing going forward and the red card/penalty was a complete blessing for us. I thought we'd go on to win by a few but our attitude didn't change in the second half, we looked like we had ten men at times.

Moses had an absolute stinker and in the system we are playing we can't afford for that player, the one who links midfield with attack, to be so poor with the ball. Our attack broke down countless times because he failed to find his man or got dispossessed. It emphasises how important Coutinho is to our team. I don't think Moses is comfortable playing in that position - he needs to be out wide, where Suarez plays, but because of injuries and players coming back in the formation is a bit iffy at the moment.

We're always one of those teams that look dead after an international break so I wasn't surprised but it feels like 2 points dropped because Newcastle had ten men for a half and we had enough quality on the field to be able to pick up the 3 points from that situation.

West Brom at home has become a must win for me now because then we have Arsenal and Everton away with Fulham at home sandwiched in between. Right now Arsenal would eat us alive the way they're playing.

I was arguing that Romford wasn't right to say that it was a sign of quality. The best teams are playing below par with United being at their worst resultswise for some time. Perhaps United won't recover and perhaps neither of City or Chelsea will be able to get settled before the gap is too big. Either way I'm not sure we have seen any quality increase in England compared to last season among lower sides. I still expect the league to narrow down in the matter of a couple of months. And I dare say that it won't be Arsenal/Tottenham/Liverpool battling for it.

Super Laudrup wrote:I was arguing that Romford wasn't right to say that it was a sign of quality. The best teams are playing below par with United being at their worst resultswise for some time. Perhaps United won't recover and perhaps neither of City or Chelsea will be able to get settled before the gap is too big. Either way I'm not sure we have seen any quality increase in England compared to last season among lower sides. I still expect the league to narrow down in the matter of a couple of months. And I dare say that it won't be Arsenal/Tottenham/Liverpool battling for it.

Not at all, quite the opposite. It's much less in quality. It says it all that average sides like Arsenal, Spurs and Liverpool can set the standard so far.

Romford Pele wrote:

debaser wrote:Johnson's been cack for a few seasons now. Larsson is set pieces and little else. Really their squad is an unholy mixture of past-it/bog-standard PL players and unproven/new to the league. Poyet got a helluva job to make a team out of that lot.

if Fletcher starts scoring and a few of the newbies click they might be okay but otherwise they'll be staying in the bottom 3 all season..

I'd take their squad over Palace, Cardiff, Hull and even Stoke to be honest. As I said, their squad isn't great but you can still eek out a lot more than what's being shown currently.

Nah...

People continually overrate the gap between the lower mid-table of the Prem and the top 6-8 sides in the Championship.

Hull bought Tom Huddlestone (in his last fully fit season he helped Spurs into the CL), he pisses all over any of Sunderland's players quality wise. If he stays injury free they'll stay up rather comfortably. Good hungry talented players like Robbie Brady & Aluko, at this point those guys are no worse than Larsson et. al.

Cardiff have also bought wisely with players like Caulker and Medel & Odemwingie.

Palace are the worst but at least they have togetherness. Sunderland don't even have that. Poyet could well get them out of trouble but they seem to lack the players who have the heart for it. 1 goal against Swansea and they collapsed and accepted their fate. QPR written all over them.

Super Laudrup wrote:I was arguing that Romford wasn't right to say that it was a sign of quality. The best teams are playing below par with United being at their worst resultswise for some time. Perhaps United won't recover and perhaps neither of City or Chelsea will be able to get settled before the gap is too big. Either way I'm not sure we have seen any quality increase in England compared to last season among lower sides. I still expect the league to narrow down in the matter of a couple of months. And I dare say that it won't be Arsenal/Tottenham/Liverpool battling for it.

Surely this depends on the way you look at it because everyone can twist it to suit their agenda? WBA deserved to win at OT, they were the better team whichever way you try to address it. Southampton similarly dominated at the weekend, more possession, more shots etc. When do we give them credit instead of saying that United were poor? Think you're looking at it from one side.

Fey wrote:

Super Laudrup wrote:I was arguing that Romford wasn't right to say that it was a sign of quality. The best teams are playing below par with United being at their worst resultswise for some time. Perhaps United won't recover and perhaps neither of City or Chelsea will be able to get settled before the gap is too big. Either way I'm not sure we have seen any quality increase in England compared to last season among lower sides. I still expect the league to narrow down in the matter of a couple of months. And I dare say that it won't be Arsenal/Tottenham/Liverpool battling for it.

Not at all, quite the opposite. It's much less in quality. It says it all that average sides like Arsenal, Spurs and Liverpool can set the standard so far.

Rose-tinted glasses.

Fey wrote:

Super Laudrup wrote:I was arguing that Romford wasn't right to say that it was a sign of quality. The best teams are playing below par with United being at their worst resultswise for some time. Perhaps United won't recover and perhaps neither of City or Chelsea will be able to get settled before the gap is too big. Either way I'm not sure we have seen any quality increase in England compared to last season among lower sides. I still expect the league to narrow down in the matter of a couple of months. And I dare say that it won't be Arsenal/Tottenham/Liverpool battling for it.

Not at all, quite the opposite. It's much less in quality. It says it all that average sides like Arsenal, Spurs and Liverpool can set the standard so far.

Arsenal aren't average though, they really have some genuine quality now. They actually had a good squad prior to the Özil transfer already, but Özil seems to be the missing piece of the puzzle for them, he has elevated the club.

Spurs haven't clicked yet, but I'd argue that their squad is as good as United's these days, a United without Fergie's hairdryer that is, which roughly equals 30-50% of performance increase, making truly average players like Fletcher or O'Shea look like world beaters...

Well Arsenal had a very easy programme thus far. Besides it's only oktober, in the past Arsenal used to be decent till March and then fuck it up, so let's wait and see first. So far so good, but if Ramsey can become so good, so fast, then the opposite might as happen as well. 

You are right that we have never had many worldbeaters, but OT was a fortress. And look at it now, even Maddie Mccann was safer at home then we are these days!

Fey wrote:Well Arsenal had a very easy programme thus far. Besides it's only oktober, in the past Arsenal used to be decent till March and then fuck it up, so let's wait and see first. So far so good, but if Ramsey can become so good, so fast, then the opposite might as happen as well. 

You are right that we have never had many worldbeaters, but OT was a fortress. And look at it now, even Maddie Mccann was safer at home then we are these days!

Exactly, let's wait and see. But to automatically dismiss someone as average when the season is barely a couple months old is wrong. I'm not saying that Arsenal will win anything. As you alluded to, we have hard fixtures coming up and it'll be then where we'll see what we're really made of. That said, there's obviously been an improvement at Arsenal. We've only lost one out of our last 23 and we've accumulated more points than anyone else in 2013. Yet again, not a guarantee that we'll win anything, but credit where credit is due.

As I said before, people will say whatever to suit their own agenda. Spurs and L'Pool have improved also. To say those teams are doing well because the others are shit is a lazy argument at best.

Clearly Arsenal, Tottenham, Liverpool have improved their squads and so have Chelsea and City. It might be that in the case of the latter they don't have the players that will come together as a better whole and then the scene is set for the former teams. But I certainly don't think the current top are of a higher level compared to previous years. It makes for interesting watching but I don't take it serious...yet.

Romford Pele wrote:

Fey wrote:Well Arsenal had a very easy programme thus far. Besides it's only oktober, in the past Arsenal used to be decent till March and then fuck it up, so let's wait and see first. So far so good, but if Ramsey can become so good, so fast, then the opposite might as happen as well. 

You are right that we have never had many worldbeaters, but OT was a fortress. And look at it now, even Maddie Mccann was safer at home then we are these days!

Exactly, let's wait and see. But to automatically dismiss someone as average when the season is barely a couple months old is wrong. I'm not saying that Arsenal will win anything. As you alluded to, we have hard fixtures coming up and it'll be then where we'll see what we're really made of. That said, there's obviously been an improvement at Arsenal. We've only lost one out of our last 23 and we've accumulated more points than anyone else in 2013. Yet again, not a guarantee that we'll win anything, but credit where credit is due.

As I said before, people will say whatever to suit their own agenda. Spurs and L'Pool have improved also. To say those teams are doing well because the others are shit is a lazy argument at best.

DON'T FEED THE TROLL!

Seriously though, Fey is purposefully full of shit, it's not worth engaging unless it's for hashtag top bantz. The side stinking the place out with their averageness so far this season is Man United. Without Rooney and RVP, and maybe Carrick and De Gea at a push, they'd be in the relegation zone with 2PF8G.

I don't know what you define as 'quality', whether it's teams getting better results or if it's performances, but it's clear that the league is now full of proper footballing sides, anyone who can't see the difference from 10 years ago is defunct mentally. Southampton and West Brom both been to OT and outplayed United this season. This Chelsea team have little in common with Mourinho's hoofers from 2005, even if they're not quite as good picking up results (yet). Remember when Liverpool played shit on a stick football? Now they're trying to pass teams to death. Everton have transformed under Martinez to a possession based team, some of their football this season has been beautiful. Hull with Huddlestone are nothing like the Bolton's and Blackburn's of previous seasons. All whilst the physical intensity has remained.

There is still some dross, WHam for example continue to play a 10-men behind the ball and hit it to the big man tactic, but even they have some real quality (Ravel Morrison's goal at WHL a fine example). Sunderland are a hot mess. Palace are a team of championship players playing like championship players. But it's less the norm.

The top sides in Germany and Spain have pulled away versus the top sides in England, but I defy anyone not to find this season in the EPL more exciting than it's been for years. The parity is just far more obvious, and the relatively low scoring games prove this. Blow outs are becoming more rare whilst 'shocks' are less anomalies and more the norm. Long may it continue

Palace and Sunderland are hopeless.  

Feck, just seen the Fulham goals

Goal of the season contender this one:

Crystal Palace 1-1 Fulham (Amazing Goal Pajtim... by all-goals

Agree the EPL as a whole has become more competitive. As for that goal by Pajtim Kasami unreal...

tasty volleys

MJ survives again.

Sexy goal! van Basten 88 like.

Romford Pele wrote:

debaser wrote:Johnson's been cack for a few seasons now. Larsson is set pieces and little else. Really their squad is an unholy mixture of past-it/bog-standard PL players and unproven/new to the league. Poyet got a helluva job to make a team out of that lot.

if Fletcher starts scoring and a few of the newbies click they might be okay but otherwise they'll be staying in the bottom 3 all season..

I'd take their squad over Palace, Cardiff, Hull and even Stoke to be honest. As I said, their squad isn't great but you can still eek out a lot more than what's being shown currently.

Stoke has one of the best keepers in the league plus they are still tough to breakdown. Btw, Stoke with addition of players like Giaccherini and Fletcher would be a very, very dangerous team.