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    La Liga Jornada 28

    Jaime
    Jaime


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    Post by Jaime Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:46 pm

    Well, I think Torrente said it best -- nobody deserves to win the league this year. Everyone has been poor. And it's disappointing to see how far la liga has fallen off. I'm starting to hope that we do buy a couple of really big names this summer and I hope the same for Barsa and even Atletico if they manage to qualify for Champions. The league needs to regain it's prestige. Ale
    Jaime
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    Post by Jaime Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:52 pm

    After 28 rounds of play:

    1 R. Madrid 62
    2 Barcelona 55
    3 Villarreal 53
    4 Atlético 47

    5 Sevilla 45
    6 Espanyol 45

    7 Racing 44
    8 Getafe 39
    9 Almería 38
    10 Valencia 36
    11 Mallorca 34
    12 Osasuna 34
    13 Deportivo 34
    14 Athletic* 33
    15 Betis* 32
    16 Zaragoza 32
    17 Valladolid 32
    18 Recreativo 32
    19 Murcia 23
    20 Levante 19


    Still lots of intrigue. The fourth CL spot is still up for grabs and the way things are going -- a team like Almeria who are ninth is equally likely to be fighting for a European place OR battling to avoid the drop in a couple of more weeks.
    Jaime
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    Post by Jaime Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:54 pm

    2007/08 PICHICHI

    Luis Fabiano (Sevilla) 22
    Diego Milito (Zaragoza) 15
    Güiza (Mallorca) 15
    Raúl (R.Madrid) 13
    Forlán (Atlético) 13

    2007/08 ZAMORA
    Victor Valdés (Barcelona) 0,89
    Casillas (R.Madrid) 0,89
    Sorrentino (Recreativo) 1,64
    Ricardo (Osasuna) 1,07
    Notario (Murcia) 1,58
    Super Progress
    Super Progress


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    Post by Super Progress Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:39 am

    Jaime wrote:Well, I think Torrente said it best -- nobody deserves to win the league this year. Everyone has been poor. And it's disappointing to see how far la liga has fallen off. I'm starting to hope that we do buy a couple of really big names this summer and I hope the same for Barsa and even Atletico if they manage to qualify for Champions. The league needs to regain it's prestige. Ale
    It def needs some star power allthough the next generation(messi,aguero,robinho,bojan) could provide something extra. And think one of, if not both, Cesc and Ronaldo will prob play in la liga.more then star names though i think is the need of good management. Us more so then barca. a return of Valdano+Perez would be it for me and Laudrup for Barca. I think if Valencia can just get some calmness around the club they could go big things and be a real threat. then one of Villarreal/Sevilla/Atletico can choose if they want to fight with the big 3.
    EMP
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    Post by EMP Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:32 am

    TheCrazy58 wrote:
    EMP wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:
    Batman wrote:So do you think Villa won't be a Valencia player next season?

    I don't think he'll be a United player either Ale I'd hate to think it but Madrid is probably the likeliest destination - if only because they'll be the only one prepared to throw that much money around.

    €100m buyout, plus we would have to be completely certifiably insane to sell him to a rival in La Liga. Not even Soler's ghost is that thick! Rather let him rot on bench for duration ofcontract than sell him to Madrid.

    Yes but if Madrid did cough up €100m can you actually stop Villa going? The only other club who have that sort of money is Chelsea and I'm not sure if even they'd do it seeing they'll probably have to rebuild most of the team next summer.

    re. Forlan (who's just scored a second goal btw) - from what I've read about him,he's not only a good player but pretty genuine too. Does his best to adapt to new clubs and give 100%. That has to be a good thing.
    If they stump up his buy out clause we can still refuse to sell, but it is unlikely that would happen, so I guesss we can't stop him, but we have no reason to settle for less than his buyout. Hopefully that keeps the vultures at bay. We need an on form Villa and Koeman out. We will listen to offers for Koeman though. By the way I was kidding regarding the retraction and apology.
    EMP
    EMP


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    Post by EMP Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:38 am

    This season is pretty much dead for us; just got to write it off except for Copa del Rey, which I hope we lose if winning it means Koeman stays. The clueless bastard has to go. Had he waited until summer I may well have thought differently, but he is an hijo de puta and a useless one at that. Soler has gone and he must follow. Just have to hang in there and look to get some kind of European football next season.
    Super Progress
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    Post by Super Progress Mon Mar 17, 2008 3:34 pm

    ¡Viva España!

    I've watched a lot of football today, from the cosy confines of a west London home, armed with satellite TV and a whole host of possibilities at the flick of a zapper's easy switch. I watched Fulham v Everton, Man City v Tottenham and finally Almeria v Barcelona, but when Atletico Madriid v Levante came on I felt obliged to re-join the world, partly because I suspected there was to be little contest but also because mine hosts had very generously served up roast lamb for my delectation, whilst making indirect barbed comments about the amount of football that I'd been indulging myself in. Hey - it's the holidays!

    Despite all the talk about the new power of the Premier League, despite the fact that four of its major sides straddle the Champions League, and despite the fact that Spain's top flight continues to stutter, the Almeria v Barcelona game struck me as by far the best of the three - call me biased. Barcelona continue to look a defective outfit, unable to sort out a basic approach to a game that their quality should have resolved by half-time, but stymied by the sheer power and desire of their relatively modest opponents. Almeria refused to lie down, refused to be overawed, and were in truth the better side.

    If you'd just been beamed down from the planet Zarg, you'd have assumed that Almeria were the side attempting to reduce the deficit between first and second place in the league. Both their goals admittedly came from corners, during which Barcelona seemed utterly incapable of doing even the most basic things right (such as marking), but this wasn't Fulham v Everton - a game which the home side won by sheer effort and will, despite looking the technically inferior side. Almeria never looked inferior in any sense, which means that either La Liga continues to be potent, or its leading lights continue to be impotent. I'm not sure which.

    But the weekend's results confirmed the more egalitarian nature of the Spanish league this season, as though everyone has got the measure of everyone else. Villarreal have moved to within two points of Barcelona, and are now threatening their second place spot - despite having had their own ups and downs this season. Valencia, losing at home again - this time to improving Sevilla, are in 10th spot but only four points above Recreativo, who occupy the third relegation position.

    Real Madrid continued their poor form, losing 1-0 in the Riazon to improving Deportivo - a result which means that they have now failed to win there for seventeen years. Depor, despite their recent decline, have been one of the sides most responsible for this feeling of greater democracy in La Liga, and again, watching the two sides it was difficult to pick out the leader from the struggler. Perhaps Real Madrid feel no pressure any more, now that they know that Barcelona just can't sustain the challenge this season. From now until the end of the season they can win enough games to take the title - 'una mierda' (a crock of $h!t) as the ex-Madrid player Michel remarked earlier this week, when commenting on the hangover of the merengues' exit from Europe. 'We won so many titles in the 80's and 90's' spat Michel, 'that people began to think it was easy to do that, and that the real test lay in Europe. They forgot just how difficult it was to win a league.'

    It's a fair point, but there is a certain amount of paranoia floating around Spanish circles at the moment, partly induced by their poor showing in the Champions this season but also by FIFA's recent statements regarding the fact that the English league is now the 'best' in the world. Fernando Torres, happy as a sandboy at Liverpool now, said something similar a while back - but then he would. He certainly looks a better player than he did at Atletico Madrid, but there are times when he just looks as though he can't believe his luck. English defences play with such a high back line (in general) that a player of his power and technical prowess simply cuts though the spaces like a hot knife through butter. Spanish defences knew all about Torres, and the sort of movements he liked to make. By the time he was into his second season at Atletico, they'd got the measure of him. In England it's unlikely to happen due to the nature of the game there, and he will continue to score goals by the bucketful. To be fair, he's doing the same in Europe too (in Milan only last week) but his confidence is so high now that he's a danger to everyone.

    Spain will be hoping that he continues this vein of form in the summer, but more canny defences may still make him look more ordinary. But I don't wish to knock him. You still have to put it into the net, and he's certainly doing that far more consistently than he ever did in Spain.

    The financial balance of power has shifted, such that a side like Manchester City can be in on the bidding for Luis Fabiano, Sevilla's Brazilian forward who is topping La Liga's charts. Real Madrid were talking to his agent this week, but Man City and Tottenham are unlikely to lie down without a fight. Money talks. The excellent Xabi Alonso, ridiculously pilloried last week for opting to stay at home for the birth of his first child (as opposed to playing against Inter) has been fancied by a whole host of Spanish clubs since he broke onto the scene at Real Sociedad, but if he really has fallen out irrevocably with Benitez over the baby issue, then it seems more likely that he will stay in England. Real Madrid and Barcelona could offer him good money, but so could Wigan.

    In Spain, Almeria (a Wigan equivalent) couldn't dream of securing his services. In La Liga, the football might be showing an egalitarian streak, but this is not so much the case when it comes to bank accounts. It's a shame these days when players of the stature of Sevilla's Dani Alves maintain that to 'move on up' they have to go to England. Alves would no doubt triumph, but it's uncertain as to whether he's talking about football or salaries.

    But ultimately, comparisons are kind of odious. Both leagues have different virtues, and FIFA do nobody any favours by suggesting that one is superior to another. In the end it depends what turns you on, and after the interesting but error-strewn game between Man City and Tottenham, the Spanish game came over as a different kind of theatre - one where errors played their part in the goals, but where the ball stayed on the ground far longer and where the careless loss of possession was far less prominent as a deciding factor in the game's outcome.

    Then again, the Premier League can certainly pride itself on the fact that incidents such as the one that marred the game between Betis and Athletic Bilbao rarely happen there nowadays. In Spain, they seem to happen with disturbing frequency, although rarely is a game called off due to one. In the 71st minute a bottle flew from the stands and hit Athletic's keeper Armando on the head, causing the game to be called off. Athletic were winning 1-2 at the time and may well be awarded the match. It would be the correct decision.

    Flying south for a break this week, which may mean no column next weekend, unless, that is, I manage to take in an interesting game in the Zanzibar top flight. Watch this space.

    Phil Ball

    http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns/story?id=517431&root=europe&cc=5739&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab1pos1
    Calidad
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    Post by Calidad Mon Mar 17, 2008 3:52 pm

    Very good read.
    avatar
    Oleguerisntthatbad


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    Post by Oleguerisntthatbad Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:14 pm

    Batman wrote:what was wrong today, the line-up or tactics?

    Lineup was ok.. but how hard can it be when most of the squad is out injured?? He fails utterly when it comes to tactics. We can't use a setpiece for anything and it is always a threat to us. He fails to motivate the players, I mean they are half asleep most of the time and there is no plan B.
    TheCrazy58
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    Post by TheCrazy58 Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:31 pm

    EMP wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:
    EMP wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:
    Batman wrote:So do you think Villa won't be a Valencia player next season?

    I don't think he'll be a United player either Ale I'd hate to think it but Madrid is probably the likeliest destination - if only because they'll be the only one prepared to throw that much money around.

    €100m buyout, plus we would have to be completely certifiably insane to sell him to a rival in La Liga. Not even Soler's ghost is that thick! Rather let him rot on bench for duration ofcontract than sell him to Madrid.

    Yes but if Madrid did cough up €100m can you actually stop Villa going? The only other club who have that sort of money is Chelsea and I'm not sure if even they'd do it seeing they'll probably have to rebuild most of the team next summer.

    re. Forlan (who's just scored a second goal btw) - from what I've read about him,he's not only a good player but pretty genuine too. Does his best to adapt to new clubs and give 100%. That has to be a good thing.
    If they stump up his buy out clause we can still refuse to sell, but it is unlikely that would happen, so I guesss we can't stop him, but we have no reason to settle for less than his buyout. Hopefully that keeps the vultures at bay. We need an on form Villa and Koeman out. We will listen to offers for Koeman though. By the way I was kidding regarding the retraction and apology.

    Yes I know Wink
    TheCrazy58
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    Post by TheCrazy58 Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:26 am

    Sid Lowe on the state of La Liga this season. Right, and entertaining as usual.


    http://football.guardian.co.uk/europeanfoo...2266137,00.html


    Does anyone want to win the worst La Liga in memory?


    Real Madrid have lost eight times in 2008, yet they remain seven points ahead of a plodding Barcelona side and the rest of the chasing pack

    It's Pass-the-Parcel on the Gaza Strip, Musical Chairs in Texas, Roulette in Russia. The game no one wants to win. Like the Chuckle Brothers lugging a piano down a set of stairs, they keep talking about La Liga changing hands - to me, to you; to me, to you - only for it to end up in exactly the same place, the whole sweating, cheek blowing, side-splitting episode an exercise in futility so supreme you'd be better off playing scrabble with Jermaine Pennant. Every time someone opens the door to La Liga, someone else slams it shut again; every time Real Madrid try to offer Barça the title, their Catalan chums dash for exit like a diner in a Piccadilly sushi bar. As for the rest, they're hardly bothering to play at all. Rolling Eyes


    Hay Liga as they say in Spain - there is a league. Trouble is, even if there is a league (and it looks suspiciously like there isn't) it's rubbish. A slow bicycle race. Less a sprint for the line, more Douglas Bader answering the door to the postie after a particularly heavy night on the sauce. Not so much seeking a worthy winner as the best of a bad bunch. No wonder everyone spent the whole week banging on about Julian De Guzman's promise to abstain from sex for a year if he scored against Madrid. It beats talking about the football. As Javier Clemente put it: "Madrid and Barça don't play a pepper."

    On December 23, Madrid opened a seven-point lead, winning 1-0 at the Camp Nou , and prompting President Tourettes to declare: "Madrid are frightening". On Saturday night they lost 1-0 to Deportivo La Coruña, thanks to an own goal from Pepe. Which might not seem that bad - after all, Madrid have gone almost seventeen years without winning at Riazor - but for one thing: it was bad. Truly, deeply, desperately bad. A game so awful it left you whimpering for your 90 minutes back and the poor sods who actually paid-per-view demanding an €11.99 refund on the grounds that they hadn't viewed anything. A game in which Madrid didn't manage a single shot on target. A game so utterly pathetic AS's Mad Madridista Tomás Roncero declared it the "worst in Madrid's history" and Calderón was proven right: frightening? Madrid were terrifying.

    Worse still, it was a game that continued a desperate run. Since their clásico victory, the absences of Ruud Van Nistelrooy, Robinho, Sergio Ramos and Wesley Sneijder have exposed Madrid's weaknesses. So too, although no one wants to admit as much, has the dip in (return to?) form of Raúl and Guti. And, however much marvellously miserable manager Bernd Schuster tries to claim that defeats are "not defeats", Madrid have been beaten eight times in 2008 - half their matches. They've lost four of their last seven in the league and only beat Recreativo and Espanyol with help from the referee.

    They've spent €100m on players, none of whom are regulars; their president is busy threatening newspapers with excommunication if they mention Nicolas Cage, while insisting that he clocked Paolo Calabresi right from the start (which will be why he took him into a the dressing room afterwards) , and Schuster is at war with the world. In short, they're in crisis. Out of the Cup. Out of the Champions League. And out of the league.

    Oh. Right. Yeah.

    Three months later and Madrid's lead is still seven points; the same seven points it was after the derbi. Because if Madrid are bad, Barça aren't much better. Unfit, poorly organised, plodding, with Henry missing Tea - all ex-pats out here do, Thierry - and Ronaldinho missing training, Messi injured again, Edmilson fit again, lacking a killer instinct or a Plan B, they are a mess. One especially adept at snatching failure from the jaws of success, as the last four games have shown.

    Against Zaragoza a terrible decision saw them escape with a win they tried to surrender. Against Atlético, they were so superior it was embarrassing but lost to el Kun. Against Villarreal they were on top but were defeated. And last night, handed yet another opportunity, they twice led against Almería and twice conceded from set-plays. Which is fair enough: why work on set-plays when Almería, a supremely well-drilled side, have only scored a third of their goals that way?

    Barça have collected a solitary point out of the last nine - a run so bad that while they remain stuck puffing on the stairs, Villarreal are just two points behind. The same Villarreal who yesterday collected their first home victory in four.

    And that's kind of the point. Because while Madrid and Barça have been poor, the saddest thing is that their challengers have been unable to take advantage or provide a half-decent title race. Atlético have a fantastic forward line but no defence, Villarreal panic near the summit, and Racing and Espanyol are over-achieving. Considering the problems that Sevilla have had - Antonio Puerta's death, the Dani Alves soap opera, Juande Ramos ditching them, injury to Javi Navarro and Manolo Jimenez's bizarre attempt to deny Luis Fabiano goals - it's a wonder they're this close. And, as for Valencia, the club that should have pushed for the title, they're a joke, ruined by a fat bloke with a rubbish 'tache: Juan Soler.

    Last week Soler finally left the Valencia presidency on the grounds of illness. He was right too: he's made Valencia sick. Very sick. This is the man who sacked Quique Sanchez Flores and replaced him with Ronald Koeman with the team four points off the top and saw them brilliantly extend that gap to 26, just six off the relegation zone; the man who has created a hive of in-fighting and bitterness, ending up in court against his captain; the same man who in his three years since taking over a club that had just won two league titles and the Uefa Cup, has had seven coaches, seven technical directors, three medical chiefs, €187m worth of players and no trophies whatsoever. Sometimes you get exactly what you deserve. And sometimes, as Madrid look set to prove, you get rather more.

    Results: Recreativo 4-2 Murcia, Deportivo 1-0 Real Madrid, Betis 1-2 Athletic (suspended in the 69th minute after Athletic goalkeeper Armando got hit by a bottle thrown from the stands. I repeat, a this was no isolated incident, but this time Betis fans - the ones that didn't have punch-ups with the police - should be applauded for grabbing the idiot who threw the bottle and handing him over to the stewards), Valencia 1-2 Sevilla, Villarreal 2-0 Zaragoza, Getafe 2-1 Racing (With some quality lunacy from Toño and a great goalkeeping display from Marcano, who's a centre-back), Espanyol 2-1 Mallorca (Dear God, no. The chiki-chiki, no, Valladolid 0-0 Osasuna, Almería 2-2 Barcelona, Atlético 3-0 Levante.
    Super Progress
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    Post by Super Progress Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:09 pm

    1-0 Valencia are ahead with a screamer from Baraja
    doesnt change much for barcelona though becase they still have to get a goal but Valencia can relax more now.

    Valencia:
    13 Timo Hildebrand (G)
    5 Carlos Marchena (D)
    24 Emiliano Moretti (D)
    23 Miguel (D)
    4 Raul Albiol (D)
    17 Joaquín (M)
    8 Rubén Baraja (M)
    21 David Silva (M)
    3 Hedwiges Maduro (M)
    7 David Villa (F)
    16 Juan Manuel Garcia Mata (F)

    Barcelona:
    1 Víctor Valdés (G)
    22 Eric Abidal (D)
    11 Gianluca Zambrotta (D)
    5 Carles Puyol (D)
    3 Gabriel Milito (D)
    6 Xavi (M)
    8 Andres Iniesta (M)
    24 Gneri Toure Yaya (M)
    7 Eidur Gudjohnsen (F)
    9 Samuel Eto'o (F)
    27 Krkic Perez Bojan (F)

    cant be bothered to make a seperate copa thread.

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