La Liga 2011/12 Season Thread

Kroos wrote:whats going on with özil, there is no progress

mourinho and youth

He needs to stop hiding so much.

Table after 6 round:

1 Barcelona 14
2 Levante 14
3 R. Madrid 13
4 Málaga 13
5 Valencia 13
6 Sevilla 12
7 Betis 12
8 Atlético 8
9 R. Sociedad 7
10 Mallorca 7
11 Osasuna 7
12 Villarreal 6
13 Rayo 6
14 Zaragoza 6
15 Espanyol 6
16 Athletic 5
17 Getafe 4
18 Racing 4
19 Granada 4
20 Sporting 1

wtf Levante!?!?!?

PICHICHI

1. Lionel Messi (Barcelona) - 8
2. Cristiano Ronaldo (Real Madrid) - 7
3. Radamel Falcao (Atlético) - 5
4. Gonzalo Higuaín (Real Madrid) - 5
5. Roberto Soldado (Valencia) - 5
6. Cesc Fabregas (Barcelona) - 4
7. Imanol Agirretxe (Real Sociedad) - 4
8. Santi Cazorla (Málaga) - 4
9. Miku (Getafe) - 4

Levante champions!!!!!! , but seriously they are collecting enougj points in the early half of the season to secure their place in la liga at the end of the season.

A very competitive looking table, time for villarreal and athletic to get their self sorted

Jaimito el Crack wrote:PICHICHI

1. Lionel Messi (Barcelona) - 8
2. Cristiano Ronaldo (Real Madrid) - 7
3. Radamel Falcao (Atlético) - 5
4. Gonzalo Higuaín (Real Madrid) - 5
5. Roberto Soldado (Valencia) - 5
6. Cesc Fabregas (Barcelona) - 4
7. Imanol Agirretxe (Real Sociedad) - 4
8. Santi Cazorla (Málaga) - 4
9. Miku (Getafe) - 4

HIGUAIN, the man i love to hate, he is going to do to benezma what benezma did to him last season,and take his place in the team, due to injury.

put i hope Benz starts in the classico

ZAMORA

1. Gustavo Munúa (Levante) - 0,50
2. Javi Varas (Sevilla) - 0,50
3. Willy Caballero (Málaga) - 0,67
4. Víctor Valdés (Barcelona) - 0,67
5. Iker Casillas (Real Madrid) - 0,83
6. Vicente Guaita (Valencia) - 1,00

Cristiano wrote:I still prefer Benzema

As do I and especially when we have 2 direct players apart from Higuain(Ronaldo/Kaka/Di Maria). Benzema helps to balance that directness and you could clearly see how broken the team was in the first half(didn't catch the second half). Good result but from what I saw I don't think it was a sustainable formation or tactic but a good result for the match and that is all that matters.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRh5CofRKTY&feature=related

Just been watching some videos from the Spanish league, and videos that like came up. Reminds me how much better the premier league is.

Looks like Caparros is set to be unveiled as the new Mallorca manager.

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

Kroos wrote:whats going on with özil, there is no progress

mourinho and youth

He needs to stop hiding so much.

Ozil's father has the explanation:

Mira como juega el Barça. Allí 10 jugadores trabajan para Messi. En el Real Madrid, Mesut es también el número 10, pero los demás no trabajan para él
...
corre entre 12 y 14 kilómetros por partido, recoge el balón muy atrás y los distribuye delante. Esto requiere mucho gasto de energía

Translation: "Look at how Barça play - there, the other 10 players work for Messi. But in Madrid, even though Ozil is the #10, the others don't work for him. Ozil runs 12-14km per match, picks up the ball from deep, and distributes it forward. This requires a lot of energy"





Here comes another shit storm. Wrong on so many levels...Barça players work for Messi

And does he really run '12-14'km a game? Considering the high reached by most footballers nowadays in a match is 11-12km.

fcb wrote:

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

Kroos wrote:whats going on with özil, there is no progress

mourinho and youth

He needs to stop hiding so much.

Ozil's father has the explanation:

Mira como juega el Barça. Allí 10 jugadores trabajan para Messi. En el Real Madrid, Mesut es también el número 10, pero los demás no trabajan para él
...
corre entre 12 y 14 kilómetros por partido, recoge el balón muy atrás y los distribuye delante. Esto requiere mucho gasto de energía

Translation: "Look at how Barça play - there, the other 10 players work for Messi. But in Madrid, even though Ozil is the #10, the others don't work for him. Ozil runs 12-14km per match, picks up the ball from deep, and distributes it forward. This requires a lot of energy"





Here comes another shit storm. Wrong on so many levels...Barça players work for Messi

And does he really run '12-14'km a game? Considering the high reached by most footballers nowadays in a match is 11-12km.

BWAHAHAHAHA! Ozil doesnt distribute sh!t. He orchestrates the counter attack very well but he does f*ck all when we are in possession esp when the opposing defence is even a little bit organised. Maybe next summer we can flog him off to Arsenal where he can be THE superstar and we can buy a proper mediapunta like...oh...I don't know...David Silva

Atletico have come out and issued an apology for the disgraceful Antonio Puerta chants during their match against Sevilla.

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

fcb wrote:

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

Kroos wrote:whats going on with özil, there is no progress

mourinho and youth

He needs to stop hiding so much.

Ozil's father has the explanation:

Mira como juega el Barça. Allí 10 jugadores trabajan para Messi. En el Real Madrid, Mesut es también el número 10, pero los demás no trabajan para él
...
corre entre 12 y 14 kilómetros por partido, recoge el balón muy atrás y los distribuye delante. Esto requiere mucho gasto de energía

Translation: "Look at how Barça play - there, the other 10 players work for Messi. But in Madrid, even though Ozil is the #10, the others don't work for him. Ozil runs 12-14km per match, picks up the ball from deep, and distributes it forward. This requires a lot of energy"





Here comes another shit storm. Wrong on so many levels...Barça players work for Messi

And does he really run '12-14'km a game? Considering the high reached by most footballers nowadays in a match is 11-12km.

BWAHAHAHAHA! Ozil doesnt distribute sh!t. He orchestrates the counter attack very well but he does f*ck all when we are in possession esp when the opposing defence is even a little bit organised. Maybe next summer we can flog him off to Arsenal where he can be THE superstar and we can buy a proper mediapunta like...oh...I don't know...David Silva

Allez les rouges wrote:

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

fcb wrote:

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

Kroos wrote:whats going on with özil, there is no progress

mourinho and youth

He needs to stop hiding so much.

Ozil's father has the explanation:

Mira como juega el Barça. Allí 10 jugadores trabajan para Messi. En el Real Madrid, Mesut es también el número 10, pero los demás no trabajan para él
...
corre entre 12 y 14 kilómetros por partido, recoge el balón muy atrás y los distribuye delante. Esto requiere mucho gasto de energía

Translation: "Look at how Barça play - there, the other 10 players work for Messi. But in Madrid, even though Ozil is the #10, the others don't work for him. Ozil runs 12-14km per match, picks up the ball from deep, and distributes it forward. This requires a lot of energy"





Here comes another shit storm. Wrong on so many levels...Barça players work for Messi

And does he really run '12-14'km a game? Considering the high reached by most footballers nowadays in a match is 11-12km.

BWAHAHAHAHA! Ozil doesnt distribute sh!t. He orchestrates the counter attack very well but he does f*ck all when we are in possession esp when the opposing defence is even a little bit organised. Maybe next summer we can flog him off to Arsenal where he can be THE superstar and we can buy a proper mediapunta like...oh...I don't know...David Silva

Talk about a mixed message.

Um, on the one hand this would be a dream come true, on the other hand it is quite unrealistic right now, no?

watch some germany and bremen youtube videos

özil has no problems to split up well organized defensive lines, the problem are his teammates (especially ronaldo and dimaria, both not germany standard in terms of vision and brain) and mourinhos awful tactics, mourinhos style has not included any kind of possession game, only fast, direct, with combinations in the final third, that simply don`t works, you have to keep more the ball and wait for some proper situations

and who the fack is david silva, he delivered nothing against munich

Allez les rouges wrote:Um, on the one hand this would be a dream come true, on the other hand it is quite unrealistic right now, no?

Who knows we have a habit of buying a whole new team every few years (not that it works of course) so who knows. Apart from Ronaldo (sadly) and Casillas I suppose anyone could be sold.

Kroos wrote:watch some germany and bremen youtube videos

özil has no problems to split up well organized defensive lines, the problem are his teammates (especially ronaldo and dimaria, both not germany standard in terms of vision and brain) and mourinhos awful tactics, mourinhos style has not included any kind of possession game, only fast, direct, with combinations in the final third, that simply don`t works, you have to keep more the ball and wait for some proper situations

and who the fack is david silva, he delivered nothing against munich

Well he does have problems doing it in Madrid so maybe he should go somewhere else where he can flourish!

Nilmar out for two months

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

Allez les rouges wrote:Um, on the one hand this would be a dream come true, on the other hand it is quite unrealistic right now, no?

Who knows we have a habit of buying a whole new team every few years (not that it works of course) so who knows. Apart from Ronaldo (sadly) and Casillas I suppose anyone could be sold.

I meant why would he even consider coming to us for the foreseeable future.

Had to chuckle at "Ronaldo not Germany standard" though I know what Özil meant. And David Silva is really rather good, even if he's not Iniesta.

Allez les rouges wrote:

Jaimito el Crack wrote:

Allez les rouges wrote:Um, on the one hand this would be a dream come true, on the other hand it is quite unrealistic right now, no?

Who knows we have a habit of buying a whole new team every few years (not that it works of course) so who knows. Apart from Ronaldo (sadly) and Casillas I suppose anyone could be sold.

I meant why would he even consider coming to us for the foreseeable future.

Had to chuckle at "Ronaldo not Germany standard" though I know what Özil meant. And David Silva is really rather good, even if he's not Iniesta.

Well if his father is correct and his primary concern is that he go to a team that will be built around himself, then I don't see why he wouldn't go to Arsenal? We have enough ego maniacs at Real Madrid and I didn't think Ozil was one of them but if these are his true colours he really can just f*ck off as far as I'm concerned.

Özil's father has always talked a lot of crap. Don't confuse the over-ambitious / proud dad with the player.

Kroos is right about the posession thing though - Mesut never had a problem with creating for a possession team. But the current Real Madrid side is actually geared towards fast counterattacks, something Özil can do equally well. And unlike the nonsense his father said, Özil does not have to be the main focal point of the team to be effective. He isn't for Germany (Schweinsteiger usually has most ball contacts), he wasn't for Werder, especially in the first year when Diego was still around.

It's a ridiculous time we live in when a player, a still very young one even, can't have a weak match without everything being questioned. And you wonder why Real haven't won anything in Europe for such a long time with that kind of attitude.

Özil will be a success wherever he plays. So go ahead an sell him.

I agree that Ozil shouldn't be written off under current circumstances in a Mourinho team.

But equally, why is Kroos writing Silva off for one match against Bayern???

And what's this about Ronaldo not being Germany standard?? I can't stand the guy, but come on.

FFS INTERNATIONAL FOOTBALL IS NOT BETTER THAN CLUB FOOTBALL, REAL MADRID/BARCELONA/MAN UNITED/PANATHINAIKOS WOULD WIPE THE FLOOR WITH ALMOST ALL INTERNATIONAL TEAMS, INCLUDING GERMANY. GERMANS: BEHAVE!

Not that nonsense 'discussion' again...

How can you possibly prove that statement, as it would mean that the players would basically have to beat themselves? How can you prove that Barcelona would wipe the floor with Spain, if the spine of both teams is the same, for example? How would Bayern wipe the floor with Germany?

Thing is, Spain arguably have more depth than Barcelona and Real Madrid, and Germany definitely have more depth than Bayern and most other club sides. Clubs have the advantage of playing together week in and out, but that advantage becomes negligible if the spine of the national team consists of many players from the same club.

Of course it can never be scientifically proven (unless you re enact on FIFA 2012 and recognise the result as the end to the argument )

But we're not idiots either - watch the general quality of the CL and compare to the World Cup, Euro Championships, Copa America and it's pretty clear that the best club teams are considerably better than the best International teams.

It's hardly controversial - a club like City or Madrid for starters have the kind of money that allows them to plunge a pool of talent far broader and superior to a nation like Germany (given this is the example you're of course using).

And at the very pinnacle of both, Barcelona are better than Spain. Scientifically proven - no. Blatantly obvious to the observer, yes.

But anyway, back to the topic at hand - it's kind of ironic that a skillful playmaker like Mesut should go to La Liga, the league which has long been the exponent of the very best playmakers in the business, and struggle to such an extent that one could make a very sane argument for him going to England,a league not often the first port of call for such a player, and h'actually improve both his own career and that of a team that is in utter desperation for such a player (Arsenal).

I don't buy those excuses for Ozil. We have seen him during an entire season now and he has rarely proved that he has that vision. Guti has played in Real Madrid at times when we had a similar counter attacking style but an even weaker team and squad yet he has proven himself many times even producing the greatest of through balls when our players and style was much less dynamic.

Now Ozil might come good in this aspect as he develops at the club but at Real Madrid you need to produce right away but the reason Real Madrid fans are on Ozil's back is that he has a very central role and in hindsight it might have been a mistake to give somebody who isn't quite ready to lead the mantle of the team. I was worried when Guti was released and looking back it seems a bigger mistake since he could at least compliment Ozil at times when more creative forces was needed. Now we really have to give Ozil a chance because the only alternative is to find a veteran a la Guti because it doesn't make a lot of sense to buy an established Am now because it would make Ozil pointless unless he was moved positional to the right.

Guti

Mesut has suddenly "struggled"? And only a few short months ago he was the toast of the league according to Sid Lowe. The agendas on here are so fickle and bizarre it's unreal.

Can only second what Blut said, it's bizarre that people keep rehashing this tired nonsense. And Bayern would not beat Germany anyway. In fact, last time they played, at Oliver Kahn's testimonial I think, I seem to remember they lost

edit: hactually they drew – Klose grabbed a lucky equalizer

http://www.spiegel.de/sport/fussball/0,1518,575920,00.html

great to see Real fans agreeing with me

Özil and maybe also Khedira are good/great TALENTS

but TALENTS nonetheless

not more

not less

I secretly hope Löw goes for Götziller soon

it's MADNESS and will mean the END of the Bundescremer

Allez les rouges wrote:Mesut has suddenly "struggled"? And only a few short months ago he was the toast of the league according to Sid Lowe. The agendas on here are so fickle and bizarre it's unreal.

Can only second what Blut said, it's bizarre that people keep rehashing this tired nonsense. And Bayern would not beat Germany anyway. In fact, last time they played, at Oliver Kahn's testimonial I think, I seem to remember they lost

edit: hactually they drew – Klose grabbed a lucky equalizer

http://www.spiegel.de/sport/fussball/0,1518,575920,00.html

Noah used the word "struggle" not any of the Real Madrid fans. It's not so black and white Allez but much more nuanced. Ozil had a very good first season especially for his age and nobody so far has disputed that. The thing people are pointing to is his lack of creativity whenever we aren't in counter attack mode. Also his tendency to disappear when the going gets tough is worrying. But it really shouldn't be so surprising considering his age/experience at the club and at this level.

Ä wrote:great to see Real fans agreeing with me

Özil and maybe also Khedira are good/great TALENTS

but TALENTS nonetheless

not more

not less

I secretly hope Löw goes for Götziller soon

it's MADNESS and will mean the END of the Bundescremer

Ozil will probably improve in being a leader and taking responsibility as he grows confident but time is expensive and Real Madrid needs somebody that can compete at the highest level at Cl against the best. I would gladly give back 20% of the talent in exchange for 20% of winner mentality.

A little more Effenberg and a little less Deisler

With regards to Khedira I think he is more of a victim of Mourinho than Ozil actually. Khedira is great at making deep runs and arriving in the box. This is his big quality along with his tireless running but it is essentially unused by Mourinho since he always instructs him to sit deep. Initially we thought it was because Alonso would be left alone but when Coentrao has played Khedira's position he has been allowed to run all over leaving big gaps in midfield that Khedira wouldn't allow to the same extent.

It's definitely a sausage munching trait to dismiss what cannot be scientifically calculated as "tired nonsense".

Who here, other than Allez and Blut - die hard man shafters supporting, sorry to say, club sides of current reputable quality who almost certainly get their kicks predominantly from the wunderkinden - H'ACTUALLY disagrees that the top level of club football is of higher standard than international football? Is it so tired and so nonsensical to warrant the indignation of the Teutonic Laurel and Hardy?

Or is it actually true that Ronaldo is not of German National Team quality? Would Lowe honestly kick the greasy haired perma-tanned whinge monkey out of bed?

More questions - Allez, is Ozil not struggling currently to impose his creative game/expectation in a Madrid shirt? Or are Madrid fans barking up the wrong tree?

Is he truly ever going to really prosper in a Mourinho team where the labour of creativity falls very much at his feet?

Mesut- if you can hear me, come to England old pear!