Premier League Week 4 10-12 September

Man Utd V Man City 12:30
Arsenal V Southampton 15:00
Bournemouth V West Brom 15:00
Burnley V Hull 15:00
Middlesbrough V Crystal Palace 15:00
Stoke V Tottenham 15:00
West Ham V Watford 15:00
Liverpool V Leicester 17:30

Sunday  

Swansea V Chelsea 16:00

Monday  

Sunderland V Everton 20:00

Man Utd: De Gea, Valencia, Bailly, Blind, Shaw, Fellaini, Lingard, Mkhitaryan, Pogba, Rooney, Ibrahimovic
Subs: Romero, Smalling, Herrera, Mata, Schneiderlin, Martial, Rashford.

Man City: Bravo, Sagna, Otamendi, Stones, Kolarov, Fernandinho, De Bruyne, Silva, Sterling, Nolito, Iheanacho
Subs: Caballero, Fernando, Sane, Zabaleta, Clichy, Navas, A. Garcia

Surprisingly open and entertaining Manchester derby so far. City dominating, but late Bravo blunder gives United a fighting chance. Silva and De Bruyne are running the show, mixing excellent attacking abilities with a very good workrate.

Old dilemma - City couldn't play this way with someone like Hart as goalkeeper (Bravo passing was excellent in 1st half), but then I don't see Hart going for the crossed ball, so with him United wouldn't probably score.

Bravo looks like a fucking mess. Sels was having similar problems for us in his first couple of games though, so i'm not going to say the Hart thing is a mistake yet.

Looks like a pretty strong side.

West Ham 1-0 Watford Antonio 5th minute

Janmaat tried to shoot on his own goal but hit the post.

2-0 Antonio's 2nd goal, Payet's 2nd assist, from a beautiful rabona

2-2 Watford. Hammers choking.

2-3 Watford!

4-2 Watford and Dicky has gone quiet.

After Spurs demolished Stoke (which included two very nice finishes from Son) I switched to Boro vs Palace - lucky win for Pardew boys in the end, but can see Benteke having a decent goalscoring record for them. Keeping Zaha was probably vital for Palace.

Boro shirts are looking weird with this whiite stripe. And Adama Traore looks really, really pacy.

Great second goal from Liverpool

Oh dear Lucas

Liverpool are a real force going forward. Until they sort that defence out, specifically left back and keeper, they are going to lurch between the sublime and the ridiculous indefinitely.

Lallana on form is great to watch.

I've never really had that much against West Ham, but there is something enjoyable seeing a club run by a pair of porn barons and Karen Brady - who spent all of last year basically gloating over the outrageous deal they got for the Olympic Stadium - getting a form of karmic comeuppance. The stadium seating looks awful (miles away from the pitch) and the team are getting embarrassed by the likes of Slovenias finest and now Watford. Maybe it wasn't such a great deal after all. David Gold and Sullivan's son should also get off Twitter, they are becoming a laughing stock. Imagine publicly telling the world which players you are making bids for during the transfer window. Farcical. Watford - and Capoue in particular - look like they are going to upset a lot of over confident clubs this season.

Regarding Spurs game - Stoke are/were utter garbage. Can't read anymore into it than that. Barely had to get out of second gear. Happy for Son, he's had a rough first year at the club so hoping a few goals will give him the boost he needs to show his Bundesliga form.

Oh, and Mourinho is still a horrible c**t unable to accept defeat without blaming the ref. Silly bellend , hope it all goes tits up for him asap.

Good Liverpool this week then! Can enjoy that until shit Liverpool turn up again soon - though we have Chelsea away next so we'll probably do ok then lose to Hull or Watford, someone like that.

The defence wasn't actually that bad other than Lucas brainfart and classic Mignolet for most of it. Still I wish we played a centre back centre back and a left back left back but can't be too picky.

Mane is ridiculously good.

Luis wrote:Good Liverpool this week then! Can enjoy that until shit Liverpool turn up again soon - though we have Chelsea away next so we'll probably do ok then lose to Hull or Watford, someone like that.

The defence wasn't actually that bad other than Lucas brainfart and classic Mignolet for most of it. Still I wish we played a centre back centre back and a left back left back but can't be too picky.

Mane is ridiculously good.

You would prefer Moreno as LB over Milner?  

Was surprised to see Lucas picked over Klavan, it's not like he is quicker or can do more against Vardy, so kind of wondering what was Klopp thinking behind that.

Mane not only is good, but he also seems a perfect fit for Klopp heavy metal football, which is probably even more important.

Still difficult to see how Leicester will do this season - Kante leaving left a big hole... but impossible to tell how big, since his replacement Mendy is actually injured and he looked okay when healthy (Kante was never injured though).
When Amartey or King are playing in 4-4-2 things get tough. Also, not sure if there is anyone who knows why they need so many forwards...

The only thing more embarrassing than our defense is our fans.

stinger wrote:

Boro shirts are looking weird with this whiite stripe.

Worst home shirt in my life time. Very few people like it

stinger wrote:

Luis wrote:Good Liverpool this week then! Can enjoy that until shit Liverpool turn up again soon - though we have Chelsea away next so we'll probably do ok then lose to Hull or Watford, someone like that.

The defence wasn't actually that bad other than Lucas brainfart and classic Mignolet for most of it. Still I wish we played a centre back centre back and a left back left back but can't be too picky.

Mane is ridiculously good.

You would prefer Moreno as LB over Milner?  

Was surprised to see Lucas picked over Klavan, it's not like he is quicker or can do more against Vardy, so kind of wondering what was Klopp thinking behind that.

Mane not only is good, but he also seems a perfect fit for Klopp heavy metal football, which is probably even more important.

Klavan wasn't fit and only just made the bench. Sakho seems to have been exiled and Can was injured so Lucas was the only available option. I actually thought Lucas had a really solid game other than the terrible mistake but you can't rely on playing defensive midfielders at centre back all season. Matip has done very well so far so I hope him and Lovren strike up a good centre back pairing. We haven't had one since Hyypia and Carragher.

The start Mane has had is as good as Suarez and Torres when they first signed. Every time he has the ball something usually happens. I just wonder if he can maintain it all season - there's question marks over his consistency at Southampton.

It really is a case of getting Karius in goal now and finding ways to stop the mistakes at the back. There's just no need to pass the ball around at the back all the time, especially when it consists of one of the poorest keepers in the league and 2 defenders who aren't actual defenders. Klopp needs to mix it up a bit and learn how to solidify the backline in some games.

Graeme Souness wrote:"What Pep Guardiola is touching on is that it's basically a trade-off. He wants his goalkeepers to play out from the back and sometimes they will get caught and sometimes it will cost them a goal - but over the course of a season the benefits will far outweigh the downside. It's a bit like playing in a team that holds a high line to catch people offside. You will get caught occasionally, but over a season it's a trade-off.

"I accept all of that, but what I can't accept is the goal he gave away. It's nothing to do with what Guardiola is asking him to do with his feet and that risk. The goal he conceded was down to clumsy hands. It was a simple punt that he saw coming from 50 or 60 yards away that he fumbled under a minimum amount of pressure from John Stones."

Actually quite surprising to see Souness talking sense here.

Didn't take long for Hart to respond.



Oh well

Almost unthinkable that Mourinho could so easily blunder with his tactical line up for the game, if you consider that he knows Guardiola and has made the same mistake before. Personally, I would have gone with Pogba at Am and Rashford+Lingaard on the wings. Pogba was incredibly poor
but I can't fathom that Mourinho insists on using him in central midfield in a big game.

There were some great gaps that City didn't exploit in the first half not to mention all the counter opportunities in the second.And yet Man Utd still managed to get back into the game on individual effort and if not for the choke by the ref on Bravo they could have even snatched it if judged to both a penalty and a red.

Bravo

I second what Souness says but I gather that Guardiola has to do big time damage control so you can't really take his comments at face value. Unlike De Gea, Bravo doesn't have the height to add the necessary weight so this might be a more permanent problem for Guardiola. Would be interesting to see the old Stoke against this City team.

It's easy to say play Pogba as AM... but then if we talk about realistic situation - what to do with Rooney?

At HT United switched to 4-3-3 and Rooney was moved to right wing. Maybe that's the way it will be, as in big matches Pogba is clearly not suited for 4-2-3-1, especially when his partner was Fellaini (who was actually quite decent, but for example his poor passing range hurts United).

Pogba can't be one of the 2 in a 4 2 3 1. That means playing 4 3 3. Which means getting rid of Rooney, but does Mou have the balls to do it?

stinger wrote:It's easy to say play Pogba as AM... but then if we talk about realistic situation - what to do with Rooney?

At HT United switched to 4-3-3 and Rooney was moved to right wing. Maybe that's the way it will be, as in big matches Pogba is clearly not suited for 4-2-3-1, especially when his partner was Fellaini (who was actually quite decent, but for example his poor passing range hurts United).

I don't disagree on either count which is why I wrote personally. I assumed Mourinho would go for Rooney on the wing in a 4-3-3 because despite Rooney's lack of pace that sort of set up would at least minimize the flaws in the line up/tactics. Mkhitaryan over Rashford was also strange since he hasn't started him so far, he wasn't quite fit and the fact that Rashford is the perfect type of player for this game. Hard working and very pacy so he can break through pressing and he is an outlet on the counter. And why have Lingaard/Mkhitaryan on the left/right when the opposite would suit both much better. A shame because it would have a higher quality game if Mourinho had gotten the basics right.

When Mourinho got Mkhitaryan I predicted that if Mourinho gets a team working this season he will drop Rooney at some point. This is even true with Pogba there because there will be a lot of pressure on fitting him in and getting the best out of him. I'm not surprised that Rooney has gotten such a prominent position early on because it would be hard politically but he will probably let him play himself off the team as external pressure mounts up.

Not sure if I have written about it here before, but personally I think Mkhitaryan will be a poor buy.

Either way, for Mourinho football Rooney, Mkhitaryan, Mata and Pogba seems basically fit only one position in 4-2-3-1, plus you can play Pogba as CM in 4-3-3.

Martial, Lingard, Rashford seems to fit his wing requirements much better.

Btw, how would narrow diamond work for United (looking at it from Mourinho perspective, so strong physical team with some pace up front:

De Gea - Valencia, Smailing, Bailly, Shaw - Blind (or Carrick) - Pogba, Fellaini (Herrera or Schneiderlin) - Rooney (Mkhitaryan) - Ibrahimovic, Rashford (or Martial).

Pogba would have more freedom and would play higher up on the pitch, Rashford/Martial should do well playing along Ibrahimovic up front, Valencia and Shaw have enough legs to go up and down the flanks and there's a still place for Rooney in the team, so it's realistic.

Only issue I see it's that narrow diamond it's usually possession based system, but maybe someone like Mourinho can make it counter attacking as well.

Once he drops Rooney, which I expect him to do, he can play something more suitable. Mkhitaryan is more of a Mourinho purchase but there was no point in getting him after buying Pogba. With that said they could play a 4-4-1-1 with Pogba on the left and Mkhitaryan behind Zlatan. Not ideal since Martial has to be accommodated at some point but I suppose they could rely on him becoming the main striker even if he is not ready yet.

The diamond might well be better and he has played it before at Porto and his last year at Chelsea. Although he only did it at Chelsea because Abramovich forced Ballack and Shevcenko on the team.

Sunderland.

They should never have hired that numpty Moyes.