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    Barcelona v Chelsea (The European Classic) (Oct 18 & 31)

    TheCrazy58
    TheCrazy58


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    Post by TheCrazy58 Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:39 pm

    Owen Thomas wrote:
    S4P wrote:Ratings:

    Hilario - 7: Didn't have too much to do, but did well in everything he did.

    Boulahrouz - 8: Did a superb job on Dinho tonight. Didn't let him get by once.
    Carvalho - 7: Sound performance, some good blocks and great tackles.
    Terry - 7: Dominant in the air as usual, and did a sound job.
    Cole - 7: Perhaps the weakest one of the back 4, but only recovered yesterday. Sound game.

    Makelele - 8: Protected the back 4 superbly.
    Essien - 9: Absolutely stunning performance from Essien imo. Wasted a glorious chance though.
    Lampard - 8: Helped out the defence very well, and was good going forward.
    Ballack - 7: Perhaps the weakest of the back 4, but he hasn't played for Chelsea in a few weeks. Did a good job though.

    Shevchenko - 6: Not a great game from Sheva, but did OK. Could quite easily have had 2 goals tonight though.
    Drogba - 9: MOTM. Not just for his goal, but his overall teamwork was superb. Despite only being passed fit yesterday, and suffering a couple of kicks and elbows in the 1st half, he carried on and was immense 2nd half.

    WTF?

    I counted about 6 easy kicks he fluffed into the crowd. Awful keeper made to look good by Barcas impotent attacks.

    Yeah he panicked when there was a Barca player chasing the ball (including Messi lol! ) and hoofed it into the stand. It would be interesting to see how he copes with Portsmouth during the weekend. I daresay they'd give him a more torrid time than we managed tonight.
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:42 pm

    hilario was more a cult hero than a good player tonight... he did what he had to do quite well which luckily for him was sweet FA... he flapped ridiculously at one cross and clearly cannot kick a ball... a defender even took a goal kick in the second half.... but who cares...

    P.S.. would love to see essien add a bit of composure to his game in the final third... he shits himself anytime he gets near the 18 yard box
    Owen Thomas
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    Post by Owen Thomas Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:44 pm

    COTR wrote:hilario was more a cult hero than a good player tonight... he did what he had to do quite well which luckily for him was sweet FA... he flapped ridiculously at one cross and clearly cannot kick a ball... a defender even took a goal kick in the second half.... but who cares...

    P.S.. would love to see essien add a bit of composure to his game in the final third... he shits himself anytime he gets near the 18 yard box

    ok
    The Pröfessör
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    Post by The Pröfessör Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:46 pm

    COTR wrote:hilario was more a cult hero than a good player tonight... he did what he had to do quite well which luckily for him was sweet FA... he flapped ridiculously at one cross and clearly cannot kick a ball... a defender even took a goal kick in the second half.... but who cares...

    P.S.. would love to see essien add a bit of composure to his game in the final third... he shits himself anytime he gets near the 18 yard box

    ok

    more the reason why i believe he is more of a DM
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:50 pm

    Agooner wrote:
    COTR wrote:hilario was more a cult hero than a good player tonight... he did what he had to do quite well which luckily for him was sweet FA... he flapped ridiculously at one cross and clearly cannot kick a ball... a defender even took a goal kick in the second half.... but who cares...

    P.S.. would love to see essien add a bit of composure to his game in the final third... he shits himself anytime he gets near the 18 yard box

    ok

    more the reason why i believe he is more of a DM
    yep...doesn't help that he plays the game and runs about with his head down.. he really could be awesome if he added a cutting edge to all that pace and energy. hard to drop maka after that masterclass he gave tonight though... would love to see chelsea be a bit braver and drop one of the famous four. they really could be such a brilliant team rather than a brilliantly efficient team.
    The Pröfessör
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    Post by The Pröfessör Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:54 pm

    COTR wrote:
    Agooner wrote:
    COTR wrote:hilario was more a cult hero than a good player tonight... he did what he had to do quite well which luckily for him was sweet FA... he flapped ridiculously at one cross and clearly cannot kick a ball... a defender even took a goal kick in the second half.... but who cares...

    P.S.. would love to see essien add a bit of composure to his game in the final third... he shits himself anytime he gets near the 18 yard box

    ok

    more the reason why i believe he is more of a DM
    yep...doesn't help that he plays the game and runs about with his head down.. he really could be awesome if he added a cutting edge to all that pace and energy. hard to drop maka after that masterclass he gave tonight though... would love to see chelsea be a bit braver and drop one of the famous four. they really could be such a brilliant team rather than a brilliantly efficient team.

    who do u think they should drop?

    They are the only team i know apart from Lille that play 3 DMs
    COTR
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    Post by COTR Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:58 pm

    well id obviously drop lampard. he disrupts the rythmn in their midfield with his hoofs (maybe this is what jose orders but i doubt it)... ballack although unproven for chelsea is clearly the cleverer player and will come of age without lampard.. lampard basically has all the jobs ballack needs to show his worth. but can any of us honestly see jose dropping one of the 4.... he may just be trying to batter his way to the CL title... how joe cole and robben are going to fit into this i do not know
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    Post by Brian2468 Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:46 am

    When Chelsea stop creating goal scoring chances in the champions league why would Mourinho change anything in the middle. Mekelele, Essien, Lampard and Ballack smother the midfield and play attacking football at the same time. It's up to other teams now to become more creative to beat them...........pirat
    debaser
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    Post by debaser Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:00 am

    Oleguerisntthatbad wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:A fair summary of the match I think, from the Guardian site.

    http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/10/18/chelsea_beat_barcelona_not_man.html

    "That said, Chelsea won, proving that good old-fashioned British grit, determination and endeavour will always win out against sophisticated continental fancy-dannery"

    Makes me sick ... Potuguese manager, and a grand total of 3 English players on the pitch.. bah..
    think there might possibly have been a slight tongue-in-cheek element to that quote, if looked at in context
    fcb
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    Post by fcb Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:28 am

    All right, here's my opinion:


    It's a bad result, but at Barca the performance is always more important, and unfortunately today the performance was terrible, esp. in the 2nd half. And for this IMO the blame lies with Rijkaard:

    1. Firstly, our overall style of play, even in the 1st half where we were quite decent and matched Chelsea, was not wide enough. The fullbacks should have taken a couple more risks attacking esp. since Chelsea were playing their narrow midfield. We really missed Belletti's penetration and overlapping today, because if we had him as a sub I'm sure he would have made a CL-final style impact.

    2. This goes without saying but the substitutions were all wrong. Maybe Rijkaard watched the England-Croatia game too intently last week because he's suddenly become Steve McLaren, trying a new formation (3-4-3) when we've almost never played it before. It just didn't work, and the 2nd change was even worse, not for bringing Giuly on, but making Ronaldinho play through the middle - Ronaldinho drops way too deep to be a striker. Messi would have been a better bet because he's at least played through the middle towards the end of some games with some success. I remember a couple of crosses from the left where he wasn't in the 6 yard box to finish, whereas later on at least Messi got close with his header. And we would have seen Saviola at the end but the injury to Puyol was an unfortunate forced change with the clasico in mind...but here again, why Oleguer and not Thuram? It didn't cost us, but it so easily could have.

    3. One thing that worries me, something I've noticed in quite a few games now...if we go behind or are playing poorly in a game, often the players are unable to adapt until the intervention of the coaching staff - either through a substitution or a halftime team talk. There are plenty of intelligent players out there, figuring out what's wrong and adapting your play is something they should have learned by now, esp. since the team knows each other quite well.

    4. Of course Chelsea were very very good. The fact that the margin of defeat doesn't represent their superiority is all the more frustrating, because otherwise 1-0 away to Chelsea isn't exactly a bad result. They played us at our own midfield pressure game and won because of the more physical nature of their players. Especially Essien who was really awesome and everywhere on the pitch. My man of the match. To be honest though, and not to take any credit away, I do feel that rather than Mourinho winning the tactical battle, it was a case of Rijkaard (quite spectacularly) losing it, vice versa to the 2nd leg at Camp Nou last year.

    5. Looking forward to the game against Real Madrid at the weekend, it's going to be tough to pick ourselves up. But hopefully the players can produce a backlash...Capello will no doubt have watched this game and will follow a similar tactic of stuffing his midfield, but Real Madrid are slower and less athletic than Chelsea, so as long as we play at a high pace and pass it well, that game is still winnable.

    As for qualification from the group, it should still be achieved as long as we beat Werder at home. But hopefully Werder can somehow hold Chelsea to a draw also, and we beat Chelsea by more than 1 goal at Camp Nou (gaining the head to head advantage) and top the group. No disrespect to these teams, but I'd much rather pick from the likes of Lille, Porto, Celtic, Sporting Lisbon, etc. rather than Lyon, Bayern Munich, Milan, Liverpool, Arsenal, and Man. Utd. Yikes Not to mention the *huge* benefit of playing the 2nd leg at home.

    All in all a shit day.
    Deluded F*ck™
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:06 am

    TheCrazy58 wrote:A fair summary of the match I think, from the Guardian site.

    http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/10/18/chelsea_beat_barcelona_not_man.html
    Top Article ok

    Here's my Ratings:

    Chelsea
    Hilario - 7
    Terry - 7
    Carvalho - 7
    Boulahrouz - 8.5
    A.Cole 6.5
    Makalele - 8
    Essien - 8.5
    Ballack - 7
    Lampard - 7
    Shevchenko - 6
    DROGBA a.k.a The 1-man gang- 9 king Bubbly

    Subs: Robben - 6, Kalou N/A.

    Barcelona
    Valdez - 7.5
    Zambrotta - 6
    Puyol - 7
    MARQUEZ - 8
    Gio - 6
    Edmilson - 5
    Xavi - 4
    Deco - 6
    Messi - 7
    Ronaldinho - 4
    Gudjohnsen - 5

    Subs: Iniesta - 6, Guily -6.


    Last edited by on Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:55 am; edited 2 times in total
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    Post by S4P Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:01 am

    @ Owen

    Yes, Hilario did fluff some kicks, but I was referring to the few times he was called to make a save/catch the ball. Should be a very easy task, but when you play so little 'big-time' football, it can get a bit nervous.
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    Post by Axeslammer Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:10 am

    Brian3-5-2 wrote:
    By the way, with all due respect, I think tonight proved why I don't think Dinho would be anywhere near as much of a success in the Prem

    @....S4P there is many so called greatest players over the years that would not be that great in the EPL...... <Ale>

    <cough> Shevchenko <cough>
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    Post by Axeslammer Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:17 am

    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:A fair summary of the match I think, from the Guardian site.

    http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/10/18/chelsea_beat_barcelona_not_man.html
    Top Article ok

    Here's my Ratings:

    Chelsea
    Hilario - 7
    Terry - 7
    Carvalho - 7
    A.Cole 6.5
    Makalele - 8
    Essien - 8.5
    Ballack - 7
    Lampard - 7
    Shevchenko - 6
    DROGBA a.k.a The 1-man gang- 9 king Bubbly

    Subs: Robben - 6, Kalou N/A.

    Barcelona
    Valdez - 7.5
    Zambrotta - 6
    Puyol - 7
    MARQUEZ - 8
    Gio - 6
    Edmilson - 5
    Xavi - 4
    Deco - 6
    Messi - 7
    Ronaldinho - 4
    Gudjohnsen - 5

    Subs: Iniesta - 6, Guily -6.

    Chelsea *finally* manage to keep 11 men on the pitch and what do you do ?!

    Rate only 10, forgetting the best defender on the pitch !

    I'll adjust it for you :

    The Cannibal - 8.5
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    Post by Axeslammer Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:28 am

    Finally some good footie again !

    Cheers to both teams, Barca had a couple extremely beautiful flowing attacks.....but Chelsea were simply *on fire* Ale

    I have to give it to Mourinho, while everybody was looking for the Cannevaro's and Zambrotta's this summer he very quietly went for a rookie in the HSV and Holland squad....some other managers must be kicking themselves now.

    Rijkaard on the other hand has made the same mistake van Basten has : underappreciating Van Bommel and having a too "leight" team.

    Of course Van Bommel isn't the best player in the world (or anywhere near that), but the man is so useful in midfield in tough matches, even though it's hard to say what it precisely is that he does....exactly the player Barca needed yesterday.
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    Post by Isco Benny Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:33 am

    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:A fair summary of the match I think, from the Guardian site.

    http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/10/18/chelsea_beat_barcelona_not_man.html
    Top Article ok

    Here's my Ratings:

    Chelsea
    Hilario - 7
    Terry - 7
    Carvalho - 7
    A.Cole 6.5
    Makalele - 8
    Essien - 8.5
    Ballack - 7
    Lampard - 7
    Shevchenko - 6
    DROGBA a.k.a The 1-man gang- 9 king Bubbly

    Subs: Robben - 6, Kalou N/A.

    Barcelona
    Valdez - 7.5
    Zambrotta - 6
    Puyol - 7
    MARQUEZ - 8
    Gio - 6
    Edmilson - 5
    Xavi - 4
    Deco - 6
    Messi - 7
    Ronaldinho - 4
    Gudjohnsen - 5

    Subs: Iniesta - 6, Guily -6.

    Sorry, but you just cant give Lampard and Ballack the same score. For probably the first and only time in his life, Flumps was much more impressive than the ONE, who had a very quiet game (one backheel apart). You also didnt rate Boula, who had Ronaldinho in his back pocket
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    Post by Tweesus Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:35 am

    I'm a big Boula fan and the man showed Dinho the door yesterday Ale

    Also thought Lamps did ok, esp after all the criticism hes got from everyone
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    Post by Isco Benny Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:40 am

    Tweedledum wrote:I'm a big Boula fan and the man showed Dinho the door yesterday Ale

    Also thought Lamps did ok, esp after all the criticism hes got from everyone

    Im no Lampard fan, but I thought he was excellent.. His passing was crisp, precise, he retained possession well, set up Sheva on a plate, tackled well, hustled, infact didnt put a foot wrong really over 90 minutes. It was the best performance Ive seen from him in a long long time and he does deserve credit for a big performance against a top side.

    And it pains me to say it because I'd like to see him underperform so that Carrick starts with Hargreaves for England, but I thought he looked class last night, alongside Essien (superb), Maka (never ever gives the ball away), Boula (awesome) and the Drogman (unstoppable at the moment).
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    Post by Isco Benny Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:44 am

    Also, the fact that Messi ended up swapping wings halfway through the first half I think was testament to a pretty good job done by Cashley.

    Against an inferior left back the little Argentine could have had a field day (like he did in the same fixture V Del Horno last season), such is his obvious talent and trickery.

    Cole kept him relatively quiet for most of the game (counting the 2 half chances Messi created for himself as the only real moments of threat), so I'd give him a 7
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    Post by Tweesus Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:52 am

    Yep, Terry was also imperious yesterday.

    It is a pity re Lampard but you never know, when he first started playing for England he was really good- maybe this is the confidence boost the guy needs Sad
    Deluded F*ck™
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:53 am

    Axeslammer ! wrote:
    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:
    TheCrazy58 wrote:A fair summary of the match I think, from the Guardian site.

    http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/10/18/chelsea_beat_barcelona_not_man.html
    Top Article ok

    Here's my Ratings:

    Chelsea
    Hilario - 7
    Terry - 7
    Carvalho - 7
    A.Cole 6.5
    Makalele - 8
    Essien - 8.5
    Ballack - 7
    Lampard - 7
    Shevchenko - 6
    DROGBA a.k.a The 1-man gang- 9 king Bubbly

    Subs: Robben - 6, Kalou N/A.

    Barcelona
    Valdez - 7.5
    Zambrotta - 6
    Puyol - 7
    MARQUEZ - 8
    Gio - 6
    Edmilson - 5
    Xavi - 4
    Deco - 6
    Messi - 7
    Ronaldinho - 4
    Gudjohnsen - 5

    Subs: Iniesta - 6, Guily -6.

    Chelsea *finally* manage to keep 11 men on the pitch and what do you do ?!

    Rate only 10, forgetting the best defender on the pitch !

    I'll adjust it for you :

    The Cannibal - 8.5
    Doh I agree entirely ok
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    Post by Tweesus Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:54 am

    Laugh

    How COULD you TS! Doh

    the man complately nullified both Dinho and then later Messi ok
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:58 am

    Tweedledum wrote:Laugh

    How COULD you TS! Doh

    the man complately nullified both Dinho and then later Messi ok
    I've adjusted it now Wink

    Maybe it was the shock of me congratulating John Terry for his attempt at total football earlier in the game; almost Lucio - esque. ok
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    Post by COTR Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:00 am

    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:
    Tweedledum wrote:Laugh

    How COULD you TS! Doh

    the man complately nullified both Dinho and then later Messi ok
    I've adjusted it now Wink

    Maybe it was the shock of me congratulating John Terry for his attempt at total football earlier in the game; almost Lucio - esque. ok
    that was actually a brilliant pass he hit as well.

    the complete defender??? Wink
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    Post by Tweesus Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:00 am

    Everyone was good last night really - bar Ballack and Sheva IMO - ironic?
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:04 am

    COTR wrote:
    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:

    Maybe it was the shock of me congratulating John Terry for his attempt at total football earlier in the game; almost Lucio - esque. ok
    that was actually a brilliant pass he hit as well.

    the complete defender??? Wink
    I swear he ended up over-hitting the cross - It was a good run though, I'll give you that.

    Still - he was never really tested - was he? Maka & Essien saw to that. Wink

    3rd best defender on the pitch with Puyol & Carvalho, I thought Boulahrouz & Marquez were better.
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:07 am

    As a side point - lets put a bit of perspective on this.

    Chelsea won't play much better than this.

    Barcelona won't play much worse than this.

    Yet the score was only 1-0... either Chelsea start taking those chances o0r Whistle
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    Post by COTR Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:07 am

    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:
    COTR wrote:
    TeamSpirit™️ wrote:

    Maybe it was the shock of me congratulating John Terry for his attempt at total football earlier in the game; almost Lucio - esque. ok
    that was actually a brilliant pass he hit as well.

    the complete defender??? Wink
    I swear he ended up over-hitting the cross - It was a good run though, I'll give you that.

    Still - he was never really tested - was he? Maka & Essien saw to that. Wink

    3rd best defender on the pitch with Puyol & Carvalho, I thought Boulahrouz & Marquez were better.
    well the middle of the barca defence was being sliced open with ease during the second half so i wouldn't be inclined to have marquez over him.. the fact you barely noticed gudjonson and messi second half when he moved in the middle shows just how good a job terry and carvalho did at keeping them quiet. boula grabs the headlines because most of barca's play tried to go through ronny but he kept coming up against that brick wall of a man. was a great defensive performance all round from the 6 back men.
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    Post by Deluded F*ck™ Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:12 am

    @ COTR

    Barca is always liable to getting cut open. Edmilson offered no cover whatsoever, and Xavi was invisible (bar a couple of shots 1st half) and Deco didn't seem to track back half as much as I've seen him do.

    There were a lot of great interceptions from Puyol & Marquez I thought, especially when Sheva was certain to score in the 1st half, and Marquez came & robbed him. Both are very good in a 1 v 1 situation, like Boulah & Carvalho and for the most part Ca$hley.
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    Post by Tweesus Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:22 am

    Can;t wait for next Tuesday now, should be a cracker Very Happy

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