The 'big 4' head to head this season

TeamTurtleDoves wrote:He's had 2 full years - and he's only hurt Arsenal, Spurs and there was the awful error by Dudek.

Done f' all vs. Chelsea - you know he like to play in Makalele's yard

He was one of the major reasons we beat Chelsea last year as he gave Makelele no room at all. Chelsea couldn't play the ball out of defence and were reduced to long balls. It was only after Gudjohnsen came on that they started to really dominate. So without being spectacular he did play a very important role.

As I see it against our main rivals -

Arsenal - very good.

Liverpool - inconsistent.

Chelsea - needs to improve.

Liverpool - Only scored in one game against us hasn't he? Diego Forlan was better.

Arsenal - Does alright. Not much room for improvement there.

Chelsea - Rubbish. Again, Diego Forlan was better.

Europe - Haha.


In conclusion - you should have kept Forlan.

Against Liverpool in some of the games over the last season or two, we played absolutely shit and non-existent midfields (Richardson--O'Shea--Giggs--Fletcher last year for instance ) the same can be said of Liverpool, so I'm not suprised a striker looked crap. Crouch only had one against us, Morienties, Cisse, Baros never scored many, Ruud never scored many in the last couple of years.

So I'm not to bothered about that.

Its the Chelsea games he needs to improve on.

Forlan would have been better. 'Specially when you get a defensive midfielder.

You'd have had proper back-up for Saha and could have played 4-2-3-1 instead of catering for that talentless tit

I'm starting to think he only plays well against attacking teams or poor defensive sides. Arsenal, Argentina, Holland, most of the rest of the league. Then struggles against Liverpool, Chelsea and most Champions league clubs.

Its your fault really.

He didn't play well against Holland. He just scored.

He can't even control the ball properly in Europe. I know that sounds like a sly dig but it's the truth. It's like watching a rugby player do interpritive dance when he tries to take on all the defences on his own in Europe.

This whole big game choker thing, is ratehr ridiculous there isnt one player (maybe Zidane, although Real didnt win anything for 3 years) who has consistently performed in the big games.

Rooneys game isnt just about scoring, he brings alot to the team, the same way C.Ronaldo does. Against Chelsea he hasnt scored against them, but hes scored against the other good sides. The only game that he completely choked was the Milan game at the San Siro, were C.Ronaldo also had the worst game of his life.

Snowbipso you always slag owen of yet he has scored against all the good teams and pretty much all the big games he played in (for liverpool & England), he was just hampered by his inferior team mates. So does that make Owen the ultimate big game player?

Caught him there.

I've never once had a go at Owen's finishing or goalscoring

My problems with him have always been that he's incredibly one dimensional which - through no fault of his own - tends to have a poor affect on those around him. And that he's always injured.

Now I just laugh at him for leaving us to "win trophies" only for him to end up on the physio table at Newcastle of all places a year later.

Oh, and Steven Gerrard is the ultimate Big Game player.

Except against Man United.

Funny... 'cos I was sure one of his cup final goals came against your lot.

Snowbispo wrote: the ultimate Big Game player

Surely Vladimir Smicer?

You said performances earlier when talking about Rooney vs Holland.

Snowbispo wrote:Funny... 'cos I was sure one of his cup final goals came against your lot.

Cup finals are big games, whoever they are against, rooney was motm v arsenal in the f.a cup final.
scored 2 v wigan in the carling cup final

ParktheHeraldAngelsSing wrote:You said performances earlier when talking about Rooney vs Holland.

My mistake. I forget that all he's done in all of those cup finals is score then disappear.

The Rooney bashers are ignoring the fact that a key part of playing in "big" games is not just the higher quality of your opponents, but the different psychological requirements with regards to pressure, expectations, etc. Young players will always find it hard to adapt to these extracurricular factors...Rooney has the talent, so once he has some more experience he'll improve.

Of course, Messi is the exception as Del Horno and various other Chelsea defenders will tell you

L r d wrote:

Snowbispo wrote:Funny... 'cos I was sure one of his cup final goals came against your lot.

Cup finals are big games, whoever they are against, rooney was motm v arsenal in the f.a cup final.

You're giving a striker the MotM award in a goalless draw?

scored 2 v wigan in the carling cup final

Fair enough. He's performed against the mighty wigan in a carling cup final.

The FA cup final against Arsenal though, I don't care what the score was, Rooney and Ronaldo were awesome.

I suppose you have to try and take some positives from that game...

Snowbispo wrote:

L r d wrote:

Snowbispo wrote:Funny... 'cos I was sure one of his cup final goals came against your lot.

Cup finals are big games, whoever they are against, rooney was motm v arsenal in the f.a cup final.

You're giving a striker the MotM award in a goalless draw?

scored 2 v wigan in the carling cup final

Fair enough. He's performed against the mighty wigan in a carling cup final.

Yep he was man of the match in both games.

ParktheHeraldAngelsSing wrote:The FA cup final against Arsenal though, I don't care what the score was, Rooney and Ronaldo were awesome.

you did have about 40 shots and 0 goals though so it's a bit of a tough argument you've got here.

rooney is not yet a big game player but he will be soon so obi and the rest of us should enjoy it while it lasts

He hit the post once, created some great chances and gave Cole an absolutely horrid time.

He was playing more as a right winger than a striker as well as were playing 4-3-3.


If anyone was to be blamed for that game its Ruud for missing two guilt edged chances.

Stevie G, in cup games is the ultimate big game player (although his penalty miss in the WC, almost dispells this view), in the league not really.

Rooney is still young he will get better, he is not as good as the press make him out to be or as bad as Puro/Otto make him out to be. At the moment Ronaldo is ahead of him, but he is a year older and in the future may surpass him.

As for the Cup final, I guess we were being repaid for the champions league final and Arse were being repaid for the 2001 fa cup final. Rooney & Ronaldo were truly awesome that day, I have never seen a more one sided game between two top sides. Arse had one shot on target, they were embarrassed to take the trophy home.

BUMP.

Updated after latest round. (1st post)

Pos Team P W D L Pts

1. Arsenal 6 3 2 1 11/18
2. Man Utd 5 2 1 2 7/15
3. Chelsea 5 1 3 1 6/15
4. Liverpool 6 2 0 4 6/18

Your problem has been too many negative results to $h!t like Fulham.

Liverpool's has been away form in general.

If you both can sort your problems out for next season, there's no reason why we can't have a good 4-way title race.