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    Arsenal Vs Man United

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    Post by Machiavel Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:09 pm

    But United, in Arsenal's shadow, have been exhilarating in their own fashion.

    Ferguson's side has received fewer plaudits

    So so true. Every single pundit says 'Arsenal play the best football in the Premiership' I for one disagree (and this is no bias)
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    Post by Machiavel Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:15 pm

    Sir Alex Ferguson has declared the number of trophies will decide whether Arsenal's crop of youngsters are a match for those at Manchester United.

    "Time will tell over Fabregas because he is young," Ferguson said. "It is the same with my players. You have Ronaldo, Rooney, Nani, Anderson and Carlos Tevez who all have their future in front of them.

    "In two or three years' time I want to be saying, 'They are the best in the world'. At this moment in time they are showing those signs.

    "But it is very important to look back at what they have won. Can they win a European Championship? Are they playing in World Cup finals? These are the periods you have to add up. It is what Johan Cruyff, Pele and Maradona had to endure in terms of how highly they were rated. That is the challenge for all these young players and they must always be judged in that way."

    Although he found another player of potential at Barcelona in Spain Under-21 international Gerard Pique, Ferguson is honest enough to admit Fabregas had escaped his own radar.

    "Judgements are made over a period," he said. "There can be no knee-jerk reactions or quick decisions. When you are spending money on a teenager you have to be sure of certain things.

    "Do they have the temperament to handle that fee? Is there more development in the player because some do peak very early?"

    Ferguson has also warned Wenger that ’rough days’ lay ahead for his team and that their position at the summit meants nothing in November. Arsenal will open up a three point cushion at the top of the table if they defeat United, who are level on points, for the third time running in the Premier League.

    “I thought that Arsenal would make a strong challenge throughout the season and at this moment in time that has proved correct,” said Ferguson. “But it’s a long season and other clubs will have a say yet. “I know from my own experience that there are rough days ahead.

    "I said in pre-season that there was no way that Arsenal would want to be 20 points behind Manchester United again. I expected them to be stronger."
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    Post by Super Progress Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:28 am

    Rabbit wrote:
    supermadrid wrote:
    i dont want to slice up league in more then 2 groups because i dont think it is needed. there is the top 4 that is supposed world class teams then there is the rest where you should get points.


    This is a remarkably naive view of things. There's no point discussing this with someone who doesn't realise Everton are better than Fulham and Portsmouth are better than Derby.
    the reason i seperate the two groups as i do is that the top 4 is supposed to be world class. therefor one cant demand 3 points in these matches since they arent too far from each other. against the rest its fair to demand 3 points imo even though it could get hard against the likes of everton.
    and yes i do consider arsenal getting results against bad sides as a sign of their quality. in the end it doesnt matter how you get them or how badly you played. so unless you will argue that arsenal will in no way keep that up then i still see arsenal as title contenders.
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    Post by Tweesus Sat Nov 03, 2007 10:09 am

    Raifael wrote:
    But United, in Arsenal's shadow, have been exhilarating in their own fashion.

    Ferguson's side has received fewer plaudits

    So so true. Every single pundit says 'Arsenal play the best football in the Premiership' I for one disagree (and this is no bias)

    You didn't start brilliantly though. In terms of recent form, you've been better but taking the league as a whole, arsenal have
    Liverpool 0 - 1 Man U
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    Post by Liverpool 0 - 1 Man U Sat Nov 03, 2007 10:23 am

    Arsenal > Man U this season, there is no denying it. We've been better over the last four games though and show signs of getting back to our best again.
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    Post by lrdsucksgoats Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:39 am

    supermadrid wrote:
    Rabbit wrote:
    supermadrid wrote:
    i dont want to slice up league in more then 2 groups because i dont think it is needed. there is the top 4 that is supposed world class teams then there is the rest where you should get points.


    This is a remarkably naive view of things. There's no point discussing this with someone who doesn't realise Everton are better than Fulham and Portsmouth are better than Derby.
    the reason i seperate the two groups as i do is that the top 4 is supposed to be world class. therefor one cant demand 3 points in these matches since they arent too far from each other.

    Arsenal finished 20 points behind Man U last season. They and Liverpool were closer to finishing outside of the top 10 than they were to the best side in the league.

    Reputation means nothing. Terms like 'world class' mean nothing.

    against the rest its fair to demand 3 points imo even though it could get hard against the likes of everton.

    But Everton were part of the top four (and therefore, according to your definition, world class) only a couple of seasons back. Newcastle finished second a couple of times in the last decade. Liverpool and Chelsea have both finished outside of the top four in recent memory.

    Face it, your 'top four and then the rest' distinction is bullshit.

    and yes i do consider arsenal getting results against bad sides as a sign of their quality.

    Even if they got those results because of luck rather than 'quality'?

    Madness.

    in the end it doesnt matter how you get them or how badly you played. so unless you will argue that arsenal will in no way keep that up then i still see arsenal as title contenders.

    If they have to rely on luck to beat the worst sides in the league then this says nothing about their title credentials. Keep bandying about words like 'quality' and 'world class' all you like, it doesn't refute this simple point I've been making for weeks.
    lrdsucksgoats
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    Post by lrdsucksgoats Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:41 am

    Raifael wrote:
    But United, in Arsenal's shadow, have been exhilarating in their own fashion.

    Ferguson's side has received fewer plaudits

    So so true. Every single pundit says 'Arsenal play the best football in the Premiership' I for one disagree (and this is no bias)


    They are a fashionable London club with plenty of middle class fans. It's all about branding. The press do not report the truth.
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    Post by Parks lives Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:53 am

    Fergie's hilarious at times. Just been interviewed on MUTV and one of the questions was about how the fixture seemed alot less aggressive.

    Fergie basically said that was all down to Wenger finally sorting out his team's attitude. Laughing
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    Post by Parks lives Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:54 am

    Man United team -


    --------------- van der Sar

    Brown ---- Rio -- Vidic --- Evra

    --------- Anderson -- Owen

    Ronaldo --------------------- Giggs

    ---------- Rooney --- Tevez


    Subs: Kuzy, O'Shea, Carrick, Nani, Saha


    Liverpool team, same as against Liverpool.
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    Post by shazlx Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:06 pm

    Parks lives wrote:Man United team -


    --------------- van der Sar

    Brown ---- Rio -- Vidic --- Evra

    --------- Anderson -- Owen

    Ronaldo --------------------- Giggs

    ---------- Rooney --- Tevez


    Subs: Kuzy, O'Shea, Carrick, Nani, Saha


    Arsenal team, same as against Liverpool.
    Stop hating.
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    Post by Rosy Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:20 pm

    Raifael wrote:
    But United, in Arsenal's shadow, have been exhilarating in their own fashion.

    Ferguson's side has received fewer plaudits

    So so true. Every single pundit says 'Arsenal play the best football in the Premiership' I for one disagree (and this is no bias)

    They do, leaving Chelsea aside I'd rather watch them than anyone else.
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    Post by The Easter Bunny Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:20 pm

    Wow,is it true Arsenals team only cost 37 million?
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    Post by The Pröfessör Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:23 pm

    arsenal 3-0 manu

    cesc
    ade
    hleb
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    Post by Tom Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:23 pm

    Rosy wrote:
    Raifael wrote:
    But United, in Arsenal's shadow, have been exhilarating in their own fashion.

    Ferguson's side has received fewer plaudits

    So so true. Every single pundit says 'Arsenal play the best football in the Premiership' I for one disagree (and this is no bias)

    They do, leaving Chelsea aside I'd rather watch them than anyone else.
    ok
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    Post by Tweesus Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:33 pm

    crouching punty wrote:Wow,is it true Arsenals team only cost 37 million?

    The squad playing today probably did, although that's because Gallas effectively cost nothing whereas in realtiy he would have cost probably £15m
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    Post by Rez Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:35 pm

    Parks lives wrote:Man United team -


    --------------- van der Sar

    Brown ---- Rio -- Vidic --- Evra

    --------- Anderson -- Owen

    Ronaldo --------------------- Giggs

    ---------- Rooney --- Tevez


    Subs: Kuzy, O'Shea, Carrick, Nani, Saha


    Liverpool team, same as against Liverpool.

    The team we predicted, I am delighted that Evra is back and the subs bench is very strong if we need to chase the game or close out the game. I hope Giggs has a good game, as we need his experience in the final third.
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    Post by Tweesus Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:36 pm

    Why Brown over Piqué though? Brown is shite!
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    Post by Rez Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:39 pm

    Tweedle wrote:Why Brown over Piqué though? Brown is shite!

    Brown has more experience and speed, he also has played against Arsenal many times. I don't think it would be wise to risk Pique in such a big game.
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    Post by lrdsucksgoats Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:24 pm

    crouching punty wrote:Wow,is it true Arsenals team only cost 37 million?



    No.
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    Post by lrdsucksgoats Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:27 pm

    Tweedle wrote:Why Brown over Piqué though? Brown is shite!


    No, Senderos is shite. Brown is no worse than average.
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    Post by lrdsucksgoats Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:35 pm

    Rooney!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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    Post by Parks lives Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:35 pm

    'Smash and Grab' Erm

    For an away team, I think we've been really good.
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    Post by Rosy Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:35 pm

    Lucky bastards
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    Post by lrdsucksgoats Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:36 pm

    Rosy wrote:Lucky bastards


    I know, they should be 2 goals behind...
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    Post by Parks lives Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:36 pm

    Oh and Anderson has been excellent, that stupid rolling around aside.
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    Post by Tweesus Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:37 pm

    Man Utd have had the better of the chances so probably deserve the lead. We haven't been too bad though. Should be a good second half.

    Adebayor has been too isolated though and we haven't commited enough men forward so I'd like to see us change to 4-4-2 after half time
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    Post by Rosy Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:37 pm

    Parks lives wrote:Oh and Anderson has been excellent, that stupid rolling around aside.

    Cheating little $h!t, he should have been booked.
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    Post by Rosy Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:39 pm

    Tweedle wrote:Man Utd have had the better of the chances so probably deserve the lead. We haven't been too bad though. Should be a good second half.

    Adebayor has been too isolated though and we haven't commited enough men forward so I'd like to see us change to 4-4-2 after half time

    The penalty would have been the best chance of all Smile
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    Post by COTR Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:39 pm

    Whistle

    great match


    the only thing beneficial from it is I now have a new cheat to hate

    what a jammy goal
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    Post by Rosy Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:40 pm

    Rabbit wrote:Rooney!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Wasn't going anywhere until it hit Toure's hand.

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