kas wrote:Thing is, I was doing a mock World Cup predictor the other day, and had Italy reaching the QFs with Germany reaching the SFs!
No matter how bad these two teams may look in terms of personnel, somehow they always come up with performances in the World Cup.
You can already see Italy following the same template: struggle against Paraguay in the first game, but scrape through the group stage with narrow, unimpressive wins against Slovakia and NZ. Then penalty or 0-0 their way deep into the competition.
Pirlo wrote:I think i'll officially give up on the World Cup now, there's even talk he wants to nationalise some goalkeeper in England called Federci or something, never even heard of him!
bluenine wrote:kas wrote:Thing is, I was doing a mock World Cup predictor the other day, and had Italy reaching the QFs with Germany reaching the SFs!
No matter how bad these two teams may look in terms of personnel, somehow they always come up with performances in the World Cup.
You can already see Italy following the same template: struggle against Paraguay in the first game, but scrape through the group stage with narrow, unimpressive wins against Slovakia and NZ. Then penalty or 0-0 their way deep into the competition.
Sorry Kas, if you are trying to suggest that Italy 2006 was a poor team in terms of personnel, I do not agree. Italy 2006 was an awesome squad, most of us azzurri fans thought Azzurri were among the favourites to win it all. This is probably the first time as an Azzurri fan I do not think Italy can win the world cup. Infact this is the first time I am expecting a humiliating exit.
kas wrote:bluenine wrote:kas wrote:Thing is, I was doing a mock World Cup predictor the other day, and had Italy reaching the QFs with Germany reaching the SFs!
No matter how bad these two teams may look in terms of personnel, somehow they always come up with performances in the World Cup.
You can already see Italy following the same template: struggle against Paraguay in the first game, but scrape through the group stage with narrow, unimpressive wins against Slovakia and NZ. Then penalty or 0-0 their way deep into the competition.
Sorry Kas, if you are trying to suggest that Italy 2006 was a poor team in terms of personnel, I do not agree. Italy 2006 was an awesome squad, most of us azzurri fans thought Azzurri were among the favourites to win it all. This is probably the first time as an Azzurri fan I do not think Italy can win the world cup. Infact this is the first time I am expecting a humiliating exit.
Eh, no! I was merely saying that for teams like Italy and Germany, the whole is always greater than the sum of its parts.
blutgraetsche wrote:It's nonsense though. Often when it comes to Germany or Italy, the team building aspect is completely overrated (especially as far as international football is concerned), while the individualists are underrated. A title winning team always has both, and that includes 'flashier' countries like Brazil or Argentina.
kas wrote:Not really, it's also a compliment.
kas wrote:True, but how am I supposed to compliment these players? Italy fans in this thread are themselves calling them shit. The most I can say is that the players may lack talent compared to ones not called up, but are much more capable of a good work ethic and raising their game, which is key for tournaments. The sharpest contrast in these attributes is exactly for the likes of Cassano and Balotelli, who bluenine wants to call up but I never would, because they could potentially hurt the team spirit.
kas wrote:Or they're volatile characters who could get sent off in a match or decide they don't feel like it and just jog around not contributing to the team.
he has been pretty good.
BoBo Vieri 32 wrote:Yes, Balotelli needs to crack the Inter lineup first.
kas wrote:True, but how am I supposed to compliment these players? Italy fans in this thread are themselves calling them shit. The most I can say is that the players may lack talent compared to ones not called up, but are much more capable of a good work ethic and raising their game, which is key for tournaments. The sharpest contrast in these attributes is exactly for the likes of Cassano and Balotelli, who bluenine wants to call up but I never would, because they could potentially hurt the team spirit.
kas wrote:
Where's the connection between what I said and Sampdoria's team policies? A midtable (before this season) team will obviously be willing to take more risks with a talented but volatile striker who big clubs don't want. Now it could be argued that Italy are in a similar situation - being "midtable" in terms of player quality and forced to take a gamble on Cassano or Balotelli. But obviously Lippi doesn't agree, partly out of personal grudge and partly maybe for the reasons I pointed out.
bluenine wrote:kas wrote:
Where's the connection between what I said and Sampdoria's team policies? A midtable (before this season) team will obviously be willing to take more risks with a talented but volatile striker who big clubs don't want. Now it could be argued that Italy are in a similar situation - being "midtable" in terms of player quality and forced to take a gamble on Cassano or Balotelli. But obviously Lippi doesn't agree, partly out of personal grudge and partly maybe for the reasons I pointed out.
You did get what I was saying, just like pretending not to?
Italy cannot afford to leave their top 4 attacking talents, just coz of "team morale" issues. Coz you need a few of them to stand any chance of winning the WC. Great team morale in an average team will not win the World Cup. Like Blut said, there has to be a mix, and if Lippi cannot control his temperamental talents, then he is a poor coach.
Anyways, I still expect Totti to get a late call up... but it would ve been good to see 1-2 of Cassano/Balotelli/Miccoli in the squad - even if as back ups!
110% wrote:bluenine wrote:kas wrote:
Where's the connection between what I said and Sampdoria's team policies? A midtable (before this season) team will obviously be willing to take more risks with a talented but volatile striker who big clubs don't want. Now it could be argued that Italy are in a similar situation - being "midtable" in terms of player quality and forced to take a gamble on Cassano or Balotelli. But obviously Lippi doesn't agree, partly out of personal grudge and partly maybe for the reasons I pointed out.
You did get what I was saying, just like pretending not to?
Italy cannot afford to leave their top 4 attacking talents, just coz of "team morale" issues. Coz you need a few of them to stand any chance of winning the WC. Great team morale in an average team will not win the World Cup. Like Blut said, there has to be a mix, and if Lippi cannot control his temperamental talents, then he is a poor coach.
Anyways, I still expect Totti to get a late call up... but it would ve been good to see 1-2 of Cassano/Balotelli/Miccoli in the squad - even if as back ups!
In some way I agree with kas, in that short period of time of the world cup all the talent in the world won't help if the team morale is spoiled, ask the dutch. And Balotelli is hardly messi.
kas wrote:Sometimes if you have 23 mediocre players they can produce more than 22 mediocre ones and 1 awesome player who thinks he's the shit.
This is certainly true and while I detest the current squad and Lippi I wouldn't rule any surprises out. Italy has the experience to grind out victories and anything can happen in World Cups when Italy is involved. Italy were arguably worse off in 2008 and yet they were the only side Spain couldn't beat in a match. The only thing im certain of is that it will not be pretty.kas wrote:Sometimes if you have 23 mediocre players they can produce more than 22 mediocre ones and 1 awesome player who thinks he's the shit.
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