HomeI've only had a cursory look over the Spox article, but I assume Blut is referring to how McCarra's articles are full of bland generalities, both about the two teams and tactics in general. The Spox article takes a more detailed and nuanced look at Man Utd, what they see as the key features of their approach to the game and why they approach the game in this manner, and the main weakness they have identified. It's certainly a more thoughtful article and one that attempts to identify the areas on the pitch where the game can be won and lost.
+30
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Fade out
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CL Semifinal - Schalke vs. Manchester Utd
Poll
predict the winner
- [ 8 ]
[47%]
- [ 9 ]
- [53%]
Total Votes: 17
Sheffield gunner- Number of posts : 16403
Age : 39
Supports : Arsenal
Registration date : 2006-08-07
- Post n°31
Re: CL Semifinal - Schalke vs. Manchester Utd
by Sheffield gunner Mon Apr 25, 2011 9:54 pm
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Registration date : 2006-08-09
That's pretty spot on gunner. 'Swashbuckling Schalke' made me chuckle a little, considering their image in Germany that is only now changing a bit under Rangnick (but still far from being seen as a primarily attacking side).
It's just the lack of substance in articles like these that really makes you think. How are the readers, e.g. Man United fans, supposed to be properly informed about teams like Schalke if those bland generalities and clichés is everything they get? You can't even blame them for repeating those clichés here and elsewhere.
And it's not like Spox is the holy grail of sport journalism, far from it.
It's just the lack of substance in articles like these that really makes you think. How are the readers, e.g. Man United fans, supposed to be properly informed about teams like Schalke if those bland generalities and clichés is everything they get? You can't even blame them for repeating those clichés here and elsewhere.
And it's not like Spox is the holy grail of sport journalism, far from it.
debaser- Number of posts : 22064
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There's a better piece here, though not all that much more in depth on tactics:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/apr/24/manchester-united-schalke-champions-league?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/apr/24/manchester-united-schalke-champions-league?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Well, that's Honigstein, a German journalist living in England.
I like Honigstein's articles a lot, but to be honest, they are more about entertainment than 'proper' analysis. He has a great sense of humour and a talent for finding funny analogies, a very good 'salesman' of the Bundesliga in England you could say. Better than nothing I guess.
I like Honigstein's articles a lot, but to be honest, they are more about entertainment than 'proper' analysis. He has a great sense of humour and a talent for finding funny analogies, a very good 'salesman' of the Bundesliga in England you could say. Better than nothing I guess.
Ä- Number of posts : 11028
Age : 94
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TheCrazy58 wrote:Bundesliga followers, what's the German take on Uchida? Always think of himn as reasonable going forward but a crap defender*.
NB: for the national team that is, I haven't seen anything of him playing for Schalke.
VERY good player
he is the FIRST Japanese EVER to play in the Semis of the CL as well
( I also hope Chinaman HAO gets a few CL minutes against ManU )
@ Crazy
say
where does your interest in Japanese football come from ?
------------
as for Debby's Hönigstein article about Schalke
dreadful stuff
virtually every line is a misrepresentation of the truth
the guy knows how to write well and entertainingly
but he is still a typical German football hack , with all the agendas that come with it
just like Horeni in the Faz , he is firmly in the flat-hierarchy-Löw camp
which also means he does not miss an opportunity to diss the likes of Sammer, Ballack, Magath...
by the standards Hönigstein applies to German football, he would have to RUBBISH everything EPL football stands for
but does NOT
an interesting comparison would have been that between Magath and SAF
or indeed between what Magath tried to do at Schalke and what SAF is doing at ManU
which is/was VERY similar
ah well
----------------
the Bundesliga 10th vs the EPL 1st
some on here could be in for a surprise and will have A LOT of explaining to do afterwards
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
As a Spurs supporter I see similiarities between our CL and Schalke's - although not their first CL campaign, both of us relatively unfashionable underdogs who overachieved, scored plenty of goals, and smashed Inter along the way.
So I hope they beat United as it represents a fantastic achievement and shake up of the natural order.
This is despite knowing that the inevitable tub thumping about: how wonderful German football is that the team in 10th in the Bundesliga made the final / how overrated the EPL is with it's one trick ponies and facking ranners / how the English media and fans once again so arrogantly undestimated the German minnows / how the planet's greatest footballers are found on youtube clips of young Germans barely finishing their first senior season in the Bundesliga / how we should all change our names to Heinz or Carsten if we want our opinions to be taken seriously as followers of football.
All of which will become even more unpalatable than it is already, if it's even possible
So I hope they beat United as it represents a fantastic achievement and shake up of the natural order.
This is despite knowing that the inevitable tub thumping about: how wonderful German football is that the team in 10th in the Bundesliga made the final / how overrated the EPL is with it's one trick ponies and facking ranners / how the English media and fans once again so arrogantly undestimated the German minnows / how the planet's greatest footballers are found on youtube clips of young Germans barely finishing their first senior season in the Bundesliga / how we should all change our names to Heinz or Carsten if we want our opinions to be taken seriously as followers of football.
All of which will become even more unpalatable than it is already, if it's even possible
Ä- Number of posts : 11028
Age : 94
Registration date : 2006-09-04
Noah und der Bale wrote:
So I hope they beat United as it represents a fantastic achievement and shake up of the natural order.
I thought we were BEYOND that, old pear
the NATURAL order says
"ANYTHING German > ANYTHING English"
since when are we back to SQUARE ONE ?
still
you are quite right about NAMES
Sarpei, the Ghana international, is called HANS
and accordingly, putting in some WORLD CLASS performances
and YOU,
my good BERND
became a WORLD class poster upon receipt of your German name
maybe, the ManU players should toddle off to find a German priest who can give them clowns PROPER names in time for kick-off
Siegfried Rooney
Albrecht Ferdinand
Kunibert Carrick
Fritz-Friedrich Nani
Ruprecht-Helmut Giggs
Otto O'Shea
Günther Park
Theodor-Gustav Vidic
THEN
and ONLY then
would ManU beating Schalke reflect the NATURAL order
wahre G
think about it
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Registration date : 2006-08-09
It's very likely that Schalke will miss Höwedes in the first leg. That's quite a big blow as it will inevitably destabilise their defence to a certain degree.
I'm curious if United will stick to their usual 'parking the bus away from home' game plan in Europe, or actually try to attack Schalke on their own turf. Expect the atmosphere to be awesome tonight, the Orcs are extremely fanatic.
I'm curious if United will stick to their usual 'parking the bus away from home' game plan in Europe, or actually try to attack Schalke on their own turf. Expect the atmosphere to be awesome tonight, the Orcs are extremely fanatic.
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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Did you see DAS EISEN has been knocked off his number 1 perch Otto? And guess who by? By JOVE and SAINT GEORGE - only a bloody Englishman
We all know the natural order will always be England > Germany.
After all, what language is it we're speaking old pear? And that, despite regular attempts last century by your countrymen to inflict upon the human race a series of gutteral phlegm coughing noises which apparently constitute a method of communication in certain backward areas of central Europe.
So whilst I'd love to be in front of the television tonight calling myself Gunter and barking
"Raul?! Der Abstauber!"
"Manuel: ARBEIT! ARBEIT!"
"Der Schiedsrichter braucht einen Blindenstock!"
"Benedikt! Ran an die Pille!"
"Manchester Manchester - Ihr könnt nach Hause fahrn!"
..... I'll be doing something more soothing to the ears of my lovely missus and running my fingernails down a blackboard instead
Ä- Number of posts : 11028
Age : 94
Registration date : 2006-09-04
"Der Schiedsrichter braucht einen Blindenstock !"
I see, bernd, England's impending and inevitable DEMISE tonight inspires you to hit the high C
whilst gurgling a gulp of our finest Ruhr-Liebfraumilch
your mental state reminds me of Deutschland in the 20s
the debauchery of Berlin post 1WW
where war cripples sold their bodies for a billion inflated Reichmarks
you might as well enjoy your LAST hours before tonight's impending DOOM with the abandon of Kate Winslet shedding her clothes for ARTISTIC reasons
GO WILD, my good bernd
forget your inhibitions
kiss Kroos on the lips and fondle puro's Peruvian locks
for TONIGHT
the world as YOU know it, where Englanders rule over inferior, gutturally speaking Continentals will come to a sudden end
TONIGHT
you will experience your very own mental TSUNAMI
your frontal lobes will measure 12 on the Gehirn-quakes
your world will start to shake and verschwimmen
blue will become rot
three stripes will merge into a swoosh
an ugly Englander will look like a handsome Spaniard
a Peruvian wizard will be mistaken for a slitty-eyed Korean
and DAS EISEN will gain 30 kilos and be back to number one
top the whole thing with a dash of CRANBERRY sauce and some chocolate sprinkles
FRAME it
and you have
"English dogs playing Skat in Gelsenkirchen
or
5:1on a damp night in the Pott"
signed
Bernd
Puro- Number of posts : 10679
Registration date : 2006-09-12
I LOVE the fact that Farfán's teammates (and Rangnick) are rallying behind him. In case you missed it, Farfán was the first who drew the line in the sand by saying "we'll KO the Mancs, we don't fear them at all". Then when Rangnick was asked about it, he said "I also believe that Manchester United are well overdue to concede goals", and then Metzelder also rallied behind La Foquita by saying basically the same thing "we are not afraid of the Mancs". 
Half the battle is won against the English team, when YOU DO NOT BELIEVE the hype written by their own media. Farfán doesn't believe their hype, Rangnick doesn't believe their hype, Raúl doesn't believe their hype (he's poised to score more goals on their ass), and Metzelder is raring to go too.
Gelsenkirchen is READY!!! Whatever happens, happens, but Schalke are ready! FUCK YEAH!
Half the battle is won against the English team, when YOU DO NOT BELIEVE the hype written by their own media. Farfán doesn't believe their hype, Rangnick doesn't believe their hype, Raúl doesn't believe their hype (he's poised to score more goals on their ass), and Metzelder is raring to go too.
Gelsenkirchen is READY!!! Whatever happens, happens, but Schalke are ready! FUCK YEAH!
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
Age : 44
Supports : Spurs, FOLLOWS (just for worms): Werder Bremen, Lazio, Ferencvaros, Valencia, El Classico, Angleterre, Magyarorszag
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
Ä wrote:
"Der Schiedsrichter braucht einen Blindenstock !"
I see, bernd, England's impending and inevitable DEMISE tonight inspires you to hit the high C
whilst gurgling a gulp of our finest Ruhr-Liebfraumilch
your mental state reminds me of Deutschland in the 20s
the debauchery of Berlin post 1WW
where war cripples sold their bodies for a billion inflated Reichmarks
you might as well enjoy your LAST hours before tonight's impending DOOM with the abandon of Kate Winslet shedding her clothes for ARTISTIC reasons
GO WILD, my good bernd
forget your inhibitions
kiss Kroos on the lips and fondle puro's Peruvian locks
for TONIGHT
the world as YOU know it, where Englanders rule over inferior, gutturally speaking Continentals will come to a sudden end
TONIGHT
you will experience your very own mental TSUNAMI
your frontal lobes will measure 12 on the Gehirn-quakes
your world will start to shake and verschwimmen
blue will become rot
three stripes will merge into a swoosh
an ugly Englander will look like a handsome Spaniard
a Peruvian wizard will be mistaken for a slitty-eyed Korean
and DAS EISEN will gain 30 kilos and be back to number one
top the whole thing with a dash of CRANBERRY sauce and some chocolate sprinkles
FRAME it
and you have
"English dogs playing Skat in Gelsenkirchen
or
5:1on a damp night in the Pott"
signed
Bernd
"kiss Kroos on the lips and fondle puro's Peruvian locks"
Otto, you are a legend, this I cannot deny
debaser- Number of posts : 22064
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
Noah, before you get too lovey with the Enemy, just look at the kind of bullying they are willing to inflict on the gentle & innocent English peoples:
Vinegar! Bulldogs! Penalties!
Schalke coach Ralf Rangnick might have been saying all the right things ahead of his side's Champions League semi-final with Manchester United tonight - but the Bundesliga outfit have been unable to resist poking fun at the Premier League champions-elect and England in general.
A satirical column in the match programme has taken a light-hearted sideswipe at English life, including the perceived obsession with celebrity, its culinary habits and yes, the inability to win penalty shoot-outs against German teams.
"The English are going nuts this week about the wedding - no, not Katie Price this time but Prince William," gushed the column.
"England is the motherland of football of course. But they have still not learned about penalties.
"In Wayne Rooney we have the eternal favourite son-in-law for English mothers and that evergreen youngster Edwin van der Sar, who takes goalkeeping tips from Jens Lehmann. And then there is Malcolm Glazer, who for Manchester United fans is the equivalent of Lord Voldemort."
Almost 2,500 United fans are expected at the first-leg encounter, each with a similar name, according to Schalke.
"The typical Manc man is called Paul. He has darts in his right pocket and in his left pocket has a picture of a bulldog. The girls are called Samantha.
"And can you believe they put vinegar on their chips?"
Vinegar! Bulldogs! Penalties!
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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@Baser,
safe to day Germany's "satire" is not one of it's most famous exports. For a reason
safe to day Germany's "satire" is not one of it's most famous exports. For a reason
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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It's not satire, but pretty accurate actually. Except the 'Samantha' part. 'Sharon' would be more like it...
Puro- Number of posts : 10679
Registration date : 2006-09-12
blutgraetsche wrote:It's not satire, but pretty accurate actually. Except the 'Samantha' part. 'Sharon' would be more like it...
I was laughing my ass off, that shite was so funny, and I thought the writer held up quite a bit, he could've just gone all out.Man! I'm loading my fantasy team with Schalke players, you know Farfán (CAPITAN), Raúl, Jurado, Höwedes, Metzelder, Neuer, Edu and the game won't let me. It says "too many players from Schalke 04" ...WHAT THE FUCK!
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
Van Der Sar has been one of main reasons United will probably win the title. Not for the first time. The nerve of the Germans to even compare him to Calamity Jens
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
Alberto wrote:blutgraetsche wrote:It's not satire, but pretty accurate actually. Except the 'Samantha' part. 'Sharon' would be more like it...
This also explains why Latinos don't do stand up.
You're spot on though, bless the Germans - they're far too polite too just unleash. This could have been much better if the writer had just gone for it. Far too tame. Luckily, the likes of Blut, Otto, and Allez do banter considerably better
Last edited by Noah und der Bale on Tue Apr 26, 2011 5:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
Super Progress- Number of posts : 15429
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Registration date : 2006-08-07
Ä wrote:
"Der Schiedsrichter braucht einen Blindenstock !"
I see, bernd, England's impending and inevitable DEMISE tonight inspires you to hit the high C
whilst gurgling a gulp of our finest Ruhr-Liebfraumilch
your mental state reminds me of Deutschland in the 20s
the debauchery of Berlin post 1WW
where war cripples sold their bodies for a billion inflated Reichmarks
you might as well enjoy your LAST hours before tonight's impending DOOM with the abandon of Kate Winslet shedding her clothes for ARTISTIC reasons
GO WILD, my good bernd
forget your inhibitions
kiss Kroos on the lips and fondle puro's Peruvian locks
for TONIGHT
the world as YOU know it, where Englanders rule over inferior, gutturally speaking Continentals will come to a sudden end
TONIGHT
you will experience your very own mental TSUNAMI
your frontal lobes will measure 12 on the Gehirn-quakes
your world will start to shake and verschwimmen
blue will become rot
three stripes will merge into a swoosh
an ugly Englander will look like a handsome Spaniard
a Peruvian wizard will be mistaken for a slitty-eyed Korean
and DAS EISEN will gain 30 kilos and be back to number one
top the whole thing with a dash of CRANBERRY sauce and some chocolate sprinkles
FRAME it
and you have
"English dogs playing Skat in Gelsenkirchen
or
5:1on a damp night in the Pott"
signed
Bernd
I think Ottomeister won this round.
debaser- Number of posts : 22064
Age : 39
Supports : Aston Villa and Shrewsbury Town
Registration date : 2006-08-08
blutgraetsche wrote:It's not satire, but pretty accurate actually. Except the 'Samantha' part. 'Sharon' would be more like it...
I do genuinely know a couple named Paul and Sharon
I think those names are pretty uncommon for people born in the last couple decades though, even in Manc-land..
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
debaser wrote:blutgraetsche wrote:It's not satire, but pretty accurate actually. Except the 'Samantha' part. 'Sharon' would be more like it...
I do genuinely know a couple named Paul and Sharon
I think those names are pretty uncommon for people born in the last couple decades though, even in Manc-land..
Baser, are you SERIOUSLY defending the names Paul and Samantha from a nation's ridicule, a nation which boasts the following top 10 boys names:
1. Andreas
2. Anton
3. Bruno
4. Dieter
5. Florian
6. Garrick
7. Gunther/Gunter
8. Hugo
9. Justus
10. Otto
It's like a roll call for a Village People audition! Rue the end for the Teuton male
http://nameberry.com/blog/nameberry-picks-20-best-german-names-beyond-hansel-hedwig
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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What's wrong with 'Bruno'? Killing a bear of that name cost us the 2006 WC! A mistake never to be repeated hopefully...
Hlebagone- Number of posts : 6086
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Anton Ferdinand rather ruins the idea of Anton being a "sophisticated name" though.
Isco Benny- Number of posts : 19647
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Registration date : 2006-08-08
Bruno is camper than a camping holiday to Camp David in a Camper Van.
Speaking of World Cup mascots- it was you lot that named the Octopus "Paul". Clearly you bloody love it. Just like you ll all be watching the royal wedding, in-between slapping each others naked buttocks with a well hung bratwurst, or whatever it is Germans do on a Freitag.
Speaking of World Cup mascots- it was you lot that named the Octopus "Paul". Clearly you bloody love it. Just like you ll all be watching the royal wedding, in-between slapping each others naked buttocks with a well hung bratwurst, or whatever it is Germans do on a Freitag.
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Registration date : 2006-08-09
blutgraetsche wrote:It's very likely that Schalke will miss Höwedes in the first leg. That's quite a big blow as it will inevitably destabilise their defence to a certain degree.
It's official, Höwedes is injured, Matip to replace him in the entral defence.
Starting lineups:
Schalke
Neuer, Uchida, Matip, Metzelder, Sarpei, Papadopoulos, Jurado, Farfan, Baumjohann, Raul, Edu
Manchester United
van der Sar, Fabio da Silva, Vidic, R. Ferdinand, Evra, Carrick, Giggs, Valencia, J.-S. Park, Rooney, Hernandez
Pretty attacking lineup by Schalke.
Dick Grayson- Number of posts : 5265
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Shkalka will DESTROY Man Utd and Roo-conte will do a big dissepearance act while the young Mexican boy tries in vain to win the game!
4-0 to Shalkla !!!!
Come Raul you Hijo de punto!!!
4-0 to Shalkla !!!!
Come Raul you Hijo de punto!!!
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Matip looks suspicious, as expected.
Good shot by Rooney.
Good shot by Rooney.
Sheffield gunner- Number of posts : 16403
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- Post n°58
Re: CL Semifinal - Schalke vs. Manchester Utd
by Sheffield gunner Tue Apr 26, 2011 7:50 pm
Another good effort for Man Utd. Schalke might want to try the novel concept of defending. It will probably help them tonight.
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Neuer = genuine, utter world class
He needs world class performances today and in the second leg for Schalke to stand a chance.
He needs world class performances today and in the second leg for Schalke to stand a chance.
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Not a bad effort by Farfan. Schalke are actually attacking and not being overly cautious. A lot of space in the midfield for both sides to exploit, a relatively open game for a CL semi-final.