Rafa the new Houllier?

stop doing that smiley, really annoying

Ric Jol wrote:

Luis wrote:

COTR wrote:luis there is no need to keep going on here...

article is nonsense... spanky hasn't backed it up with anything remotely interesting.. just leave it at that

i'm not going on, it often looks like this though because it starts of with just Park then his buddys SGM etc come in and try and take things further.

it's quite funny really

Oh for fuck's sake, you retarded little twat - I came into this conversation trying to stop it turning into yet another Man U vs. Liverpool WUM thread, you agree with me, but then can't stop yourself trying to insult me, make out that I'm part of some Park-lives gang etc. etc.


Fuck it, I tried, I can't be bothered any more. The article's right - Benitez has bought very poorly, spent a load of money on second rate players (Crouch excepted) and it's no wonder that Liverpool repeatedly lack a spark in games where they are struggling...



Happy now?


Cunt.

Genuine LOL, thanx 2 Saints.

TeamSpirit wrote:Genuine LOL, thanx 2 Saints.

poor lu was asking for that

Am I the only one that sees very little to do with Houllier in the original article other than the headline?

Obispo wrote:Am I the only one that sees very little to do with Houllier in the original article other than the headline?

yeah great journalism that.. it's just a pointless article

There isnt much apart from Houllier nearly reaching the top a, but never doing it, so the article is asking/saying is the same thing going to happen to Rafa, as he doesnt have enough money to by special players, not lots of Premiership quality players ie quality over quantity. Which I think is true, although you may call me biased or a WUM.

The difference being that Houllier's only league title win came 12 years before we hired him whereas Rafa won 2 in 3 seasons in Spain and became the first Liverpool manager in history to win 2 major trophies in his first 2 seasons at Liverpool?

All this article goes on about is us not being able to compete in the transfer market.

I mean as in winning the plastic treble, coming second in the league and then everyone thinking that Liverpool would go on to win the league, then falling from grace.

Rafa won the CL, FA cup and then everyone expected him to take Liverpool to summit of the prem, but have fallen by the way side. Out of the Fa cup and may possibly be out of the league cup by end of today and your playing the best team in Europe in the CL, which suggests that they are going backwards. A bit like Ged Hs time as Liverpool manager.

The writer watched the game against Liverpool and saw what everyone else sees when Liverpool play the top sides; that they dont have enough special players, the players needed to win the league. The league is what all pool fans want and he has looked at the finances and the players at his disposal and come to the conclusion that most people do, that it will take a takeover for them to win the league.

Rafas a much better manager than Ged H, I dont think he can win the league with Pool and I dont beleive he will have a Fergie/Wenger transformation on your club either. He is doing a good job when you think of the players he has inherited, it depends what peoples xpectations our, if you expect to win the league (like he and many pool fans and the media did) you will be dissapointed, anything else and you will be happy with your team.

The whole article is a question not a statement, its a blog, you readinto to it what you want, it is written to provoke a reaction.

Obispo wrote:The difference being that Houllier's only league title win came 12 years before we hired him whereas Rafa won 2 in 3 seasons in Spain and became the first Liverpool manager in history to win 2 major trophies in his first 2 seasons at Liverpool?

All this article goes on about is us not being able to compete in the transfer market.

And in truth, as we've discussed before, this isn't really the case - Rafa's had plenty of money, he's just spent it broadly. As far as I know, the only player that he signed for more than 10 million was Alonso. He's had a lot in the 5-7 million pound bracket, which shows that money is available, he's just trying to build a strong squad rather than just a first XI.

Also, as we've discussed before, Rafa may well change that policy from here on in because he's now got 20-odd good to very good players, but perhaps needs the odd wonder signing to take Liverpool to a league title.

SGM wrote:

Obispo wrote:The difference being that Houllier's only league title win came 12 years before we hired him whereas Rafa won 2 in 3 seasons in Spain and became the first Liverpool manager in history to win 2 major trophies in his first 2 seasons at Liverpool?

All this article goes on about is us not being able to compete in the transfer market.

And in truth, as we've discussed before, this isn't really the case - Rafa's had plenty of money, he's just spent it broadly. As far as I know, the only player that he signed for more than 10 million was Alonso. He's had a lot in the 5-7 million pound bracket, which shows that money is available, he's just trying to build a strong squad rather than just a first XI.

Also, as we've discussed before, Rafa may well change that policy from here on in because he's now got 20-odd good to very good players, but perhaps needs the odd wonder signing to take Liverpool to a league title.

'Zactly.

I'll say it again:

It's pointless signing a Drogba if Mellor is his back up and it's pointless signing a Cristiano Ronaldo if Djimi Traore is doing the overlapping.


Rez,

Why can't Rafa win the league exactly? We no longer expect to this season, but why can't he in general?

If he's still here in 3 years time we'll have number 19.

COTR wrote:

TeamSpirit wrote:Genuine LOL, thanx 2 Saints.

poor lu was asking for that

asking for what? an adult going on about some shit? SGM should be banned anyway, he couldn't resist attention seeking and had to be a bad boy by posting porn

tut tut.

Only if he get lots of money and Chelsea implode.

Luis wrote:

COTR wrote:

TeamSpirit wrote:Genuine LOL, thanx 2 Saints.

poor lu was asking for that

asking for what? an adult going on about some shit? SGM should be banned anyway, he couldn't resist attention seeking and had to be a bad boy by posting porn

tut tut.

Why do you do this Luis.

You're fine acting the adult in most circumstances and then when some one challenges you or gets angry at you, you play the little lost boy who's getting picked on.

Parks lives wrote:

Luis wrote:

COTR wrote:

TeamSpirit wrote:Genuine LOL, thanx 2 Saints.

poor lu was asking for that

asking for what? an adult going on about some shit? SGM should be banned anyway, he couldn't resist attention seeking and had to be a bad boy by posting porn

tut tut.

Why do you do this Luis.

You're fine acting the adult in most circumstances and then when some one challenges you or gets angry at you, you play the little lost boy who's getting picked on.

yes that's exactly what I am doing.

Parks lives wrote:Only if he get lots of money and Chelsea implode.

Rubbish.

I know the collective United ego has increased tenfold since the start of the season but it's worth recalling that you, with your current squad, finished a solitary point ahead of us last season and now you're ahead in the league thanks to a single signing.

Now, just because we got taken apart by an Arsenal team playing Houllier-Football, when we were lacking our defensive midfielder, doesn't mean we've automatically become a poor team.

I know it's now the done thing to underestimate us given that a variety of factors led to us not being able to challenge this year but please, don't kid yourselves into thinking we're leagues behind United and Chelsea when we're not.

Teams are capable of poor seasons, hell, Rafa's Valencia finished 5th the year after they won the league and came back to win the league and UEFA cup the next year.

Luis wrote:

COTR wrote:

TeamSpirit wrote:Genuine LOL, thanx 2 Saints.

poor lu was asking for that

asking for what? an adult going on about some shit?

???????

SGM should be banned anyway, he couldn't resist attention seeking and had to be a bad boy by posting porn

tut tut.

Again, ????????????????

back for more SGM? couldn't resist

I do beleive if you dont get takeover, you wont win the league, thats just my opinion. I think United and Chelsea will be up there over the next few years and Arsenals young side are getting better (they are no longer a one man team) so it will be difficult for pool to come ahead of these three teams with less talented players. I know its a team sport, but over a season the cream always rises to the top.The standard of the Prem has beeb on the rise since 2002, it has taken record points to win the league.

If you get taken over and have lots of money to spend, then yeah you can win it because Rafa is very good manager as he has proved over the years.

Obispo wrote:

Parks lives wrote:Only if he get lots of money and Chelsea implode.

Rubbish.

I know the collective United ego has increased tenfold since the start of the season but it's worth recalling that you, with your current squad, finished a solitary point behind us last season and now you're ahead in the league thanks to a single signing.

You know better than it being one simple signing thats changed our season.

Obispo wrote:

Parks lives wrote:Only if he get lots of money and Chelsea implode.

Rubbish.

I know the collective United ego has increased tenfold since the start of the season but it's worth recalling that you, with your current squad, finished a solitary point behind us last season and now you're ahead in the league thanks to a single signing.

Exactly - Liverpool's squad is currently about as strong as Man U's, but their first XI is a little way behind, mainly due to Man U's attack being superior. With the right player or two either now or in the summer, and a few players hitting form a little quicker next season, Liverpool are more than capable of winning the league.

Teams are capable of poor seasons, hell, Rafa's Valencia finished 5th the year after they won the league and came back to win the league and UEFA cup the next year.

True - Bellamy, Gerrard, Alonso, Reina, Pennant all started the season poorly. Since the end of October your form and Man U's form is pretty much the same, or so I gather. I could be proven wrong with stats, but you know what I think of them...

Carrick has been a good signing but he is not the reason why Utd are top.

January signings Vidic and Evra have found their feet in a new League and are like new signings. Scholes is back as well.

Players like Ronaldo and Saha have also improved their games as well

Cesc wrote:Carrick has been a good signing but he is not the reason why Utd are top.

January signings Vidic and Evra have found their feet in a new League and are like new signings. Scholes is back as well.

Players like Ronaldo and Saha have also improved their games as well

Vidic and Evra have made massive improvements.
Scholes is back to his best.
Ronaldo is playing better than he has ever done.
Giggs and Neville have upped there game from last season.
Saha has liberated our attack.

To put it all down to one signing is bollocks. Obi has more intelligence than that as well.

The smugness has increased, as we were written of completely, but you could say the same about united we had a bad season last year, but we finished above you and this season were playing the way we should. We have the same players a s last season bar Carrick, who hasnt done that much to change our fortunes. Scholes and Giggs have always been special players they are jus playing back to there natural level. Ronaldo is older and is playing better, Vidic has settled in.

The article asks whether 3 pool players would get into the united, Arsenal or Chelsea side, that shows the level your team is at. Besides what have Liverpool shown in the league to suggest that 3/4th place isnt there natural position?

Cesc wrote:Carrick has been a good signing but he is not the reason why Utd are top.

January signings Vidic and Evra have found their feet in a new League and are like new signings. Scholes is back as well.

Players like Ronaldo and Saha have also improved their games as well

I've said that before mate but I'm just trying to prove a point. Sometimes it's just time that's needed to gel as a squad.

Didn't help that in the first game of the season we lost 2 members of what was the 2nd best defence in the league last season to injury. We had to blood in Aurelio and Agger sooner than Rafa probably would have liked.

The only way to get the new signings to blood into the team is to play them but that causes disruption until the understanding is formed. It's a balancing act.

I have no problem admitting that we were too confident of a title tilt this season, but we were riding the crest of a wave on the success of the last 2 seasons. Our players and signings - good players themselves if not world beaters - haven't stagnated and become bad players overnight. It's just a case of adapting.

Of course, it isn't much fun to just say "Liverpool need time", it's much easier and more controversial just to write us off as a force full-stop.

On the other hand, Rooney is playing worse than last season, I don't think that there's any doubt about that...

Obispo wrote:Of course, it isn't much fun to just say "Liverpool need time", it's much easier and more controversial just to write us off as a force full-stop.

Of course - Sensationalism of a crisis or unstability in the media sells.

SGM wrote:On the other hand, Rooney is playing worse than last season, I don't think that there's any doubt about that...

None at all.

To be honest it would be interesting to see if we would have more points if he played like he did last season.

Unless the team has changed so much that its to the detriment of Wazza.