James Milner New England Man

Milner has to go this summer, and potentially start.

I'd have him over Barry on current form.

Debbie, where do I sign?

Just write a letter to your local MP and they should forward it to Gordon Brown for immediate attention. I think his last act before being voted out should be to put John Terry in prison for crimes against humanity. At least he would then leave with a positive legacy.

Milner won't be a starter IMO, but he'll be a used substitute in every game.

Btw the Milner bandwagon started back in September so all you fuckos who only joined it now can go finger yourselves.

worth noting on a different(ish) topic that apparently Capello has instructed his scouts to monitor Zamora for every game that he plays in in the remaining season.

Outside chance of actually playing at the WC?

Maybe. Everybody's darling Carlton Cole hasn't exactly been shining of late that I've noticed, Heskey's back on the Villa bench and Crouch isn't scoring many either.

So Zamora is the most in form of the big striker options & it will be working in his favour that he's performing in Europe as well as the league. But the problem is there's no chance to test him in a competitive international before the tournament.

Also depends on injuries. Of the 4 mentioned, Heskey, Cole and Zamora all seem to have tendency of picking up lots of little injuries, so not sure who's most reliable on that front. Zamora will have played alot of games this season compared to previous years, whereas Cole/Crouch should be fresher.

But ultimately it will be whether Capello puts greater faith in recent form or past experience. I'd expect he's much more interested in the latter which would see Heskey+Crouch as the choices, but he may fancy the odd wildcard form picks like Zamora or Adam Johnson sneak into the squad.

Milner has been on my radar for least two years. His ability to keep on ticking while other ran out of energy caught my eye. he has grown into a good CM player a position he was not playing shows he a learner.

Hargreaves was never a starter for ages and should of been Milner is a stronger type of him who could easily learn and play defensively. Coaches just want this kind of player. they want all out Lampard and Gerrard players We need a strong settled CM to help England big time.

debaser wrote:Maybe. Everybody's darling Carlton Cole hasn't exactly been shining of late that I've noticed, Heskey's back on the Villa bench and Crouch isn't scoring many either.

CC bounced back quite well after his injury but since then I think he's been caught up in the wider malaise that is spreading out from that shit-tip that they call East London.

Crouch will go regardless because he's prolific for England and he does still scare the bejesus out of tiky-taky, don't like it up 'em midget foreign nations like Chile, Japan and Umpa-Lumpa.

So Zamora is the most in form of the big striker options & it will be working in his favour that he's performing in Europe as well as the league. But the problem is there's no chance to test him in a competitive international before the tournament.

Quite. I would like Capello to take him as part of our 30 man squad though and give him a start alongside Rooney in one of the friendlies just to see how it goes. If they show some semblance of understanding then stick with it for the 2nd friendly.

Also depends on injuries. Of the 4 mentioned, Heskey, Cole and Zamora all seem to have tendency of picking up lots of little injuries, so not sure who's most reliable on that front. Zamora will have played alot of games this season compared to previous years, whereas Cole/Crouch should be fresher.

Although of those three I'd say Zamora is the least injury prone, whilst Heskey is the most. Your point regarding fatigue is certainly valid and its something that will need monitoring. Fulham are in a safe mid-table position now so hopefully Hodgson will simply drop Zamora from the EPL games - or at least prioritise him for substitutions in the 2nd half if he does play.

But ultimately it will be whether Capello puts greater faith in recent form or past experience. I'd expect he's much more interested in the latter which would see Heskey+Crouch as the choices, but he may fancy the odd wildcard form picks like Zamora or Adam Johnson sneak into the squad.

He said at the start of his tenure that form counted more than reputation. However, if that were the case he'd have picked Hart in the recent friendly ahead of Green - so I suspect you may well be correct. One point Zamora may have in his favour though is that he's no spring chicken (29) and he's showed the ability to play well and change game against international quality defenders and in high pressure games - Wolfsburg, Shaktar and Juventus are all at the high end in terms of quality of the Europa teams and all three wouldn't have looked out of place in a 'last 16' CL draw.

Brian2468 wrote:Milner has been on my radar for least two years. His ability to keep on ticking while other ran out of energy caught my eye. he has grown into a good CM player a position he was not playing shows he a learner.

Hargreaves was never a starter for ages and should of been Milner is a stronger type of him who could easily learn and play defensively. Coaches just want this kind of player. they want all out Lampard and Gerrard players We need a strong settled CM to help England big time.

He's been on Tweedles gaydar for a lot longer.

The Bobby Zamora debate -

personally I don't care if he hasn't had competitive international experience - his position isn't like a newly promoted goalkeeper whose single error can cost a game,

playing in Europe against the likes of Juve and Wolfsburg is better experience then he'll ever get playing against Kazakstan or Ukraine in an England qualifier.

Sure, he could do with a little time to gel with his new England colleagues, however as long as he follows Capello's orders it should be simple enough what is expected of him.

I'd definitely take him. The unknown factor could work in England's favour, and he's playing far better than Cole or Heskey, or even Crouch for that matter

http://europeanboard.ephpbb.com/english-football-f3/lennon-v-milner-t44.htm?

One day you will call me a prophet.

Kimbo wrote:

http://europeanboard.ephpbb.com/english-football-f3/lennon-v-milner-t44.htm?

One day you will call me a prophet.

Kimmy, most people would take both Milner and Lennon, if Lennon were fit.

Also, you're the prophet who told us all Milner's career would never improve and that the 12mill Villa paid for him was a waste of money and good business by Newcastle.

Looking at it now, with Newcastle's slide into the championship and Milner's career taking a massive upward curve after leaving, it was terrible business and you got it epically wrong

I'd say you're on a par with Otto in terms of accurate predictions

Had a reread of that thread - bless Coops and his "Stuart Downing is better than both" posts.

And have we really all been on this board for almost 4 years? Scary shit I tell thee.

Robert F'gerald Earle MBE wrote:Had a reread of that thread - bless Coops and his "Stuart Downing is better than both" posts.

And have we really all been on this board for almost 4 years? Scary shit I tell thee.

I just did. Fair play, you were 3 yrs ahead of the curve here:

Robert F'gerald Earle MBE wrote:Milner on the otherhand, like he was at Leeds, is more of a link up man who could quite easily play in the centre of the park as he doesnt strike me, or indeed those who saw him at Leeds, as an out and out wideman.

Just to add my two pence. Gareth Barry is the single most important player in the England team. He is the link between attack and defence. He is the player Capello has built his team. If he is injured we only have Carrick as a replacement, i.e. we are fucked.

James Milner has never played the holding role, so like a typical english supporter we are going to stick him there in the middle of a world cup.
:suspect:


Its a good thing Capello is the Manager. :roll:

Robert F'gerald Earle MBE wrote:

Kimbo wrote:

http://europeanboard.ephpbb.com/english-football-f3/lennon-v-milner-t44.htm?

One day you will call me a prophet.

Kimmy, most people would take both Milner and Lennon, if Lennon were fit.

Also, you're the prophet who told us all Milner's career would never improve and that the 12mill Villa paid for him was a waste of money and good business by Newcastle.

Looking at it now, with Newcastle's slide into the championship and Milner's career taking a massive upward curve after leaving, it was terrible business and you got it epically wrong

I'd say you're on a par with Otto in terms of accurate predictions

I'm not sure i ever said it was a waste of money, i just said i was happy with the price because Milner wasn't doing it for us. In hindsight it looks like it was a good deal for all involved.

Khadrim wrote:Just to add my two pence. Gareth Barry is the single most important player in the England team. He is the link between attack and defence. He is the player Capello has built his team. If he is injured we only have Carrick as a replacement, i.e. we are fucked.

James Milner has never played the holding role, so like a typical english supporter we are going to stick him there in the middle of a world cup.



Its a good thing Capello is the Manager.

Milner will play a better CM role than Barry very soon if not right away, way faster and more in the tank. DM players are not half as good as a CM we do not need a DM. A DM sitting is a waste in todays game unless you have great players like Zidane and other quality. This is why England with Lampard and Gerrard were never that great.

Glad Capello is Manager He will pick Milner over Carrick your see......

But the DM role is also about positioning and knowing what to do when an attack is developing and as Milner hasn't played that role, he won't have the same experience as Barry.

I'd like to see Jagielka given a go there actually. Didn't he play the DM role at Utd? I certainly think he should be in the england squad. He's miles better than Upson as a centre back and he can also play as a DM.

I guess the question is how has Jagielka been since coming back from this long-term injury? I can't say I've seen much of Everton recently.

Funnliy enough I asked the guy opposite me at work who is an Everton season ticket holder after posting this and he says that he's been brilliant. I guess he would say that being an Everton fan, but he thinks that Jag's return has galvanised the squad as much, if not more than Arteta.

Tweesus wrote:Funnliy enough I asked the guy opposite me at work who is an Everton season ticket holder after posting this and he says that he's been brilliant. I guess he would say that being an Everton fan, but he thinks that Jag's return has galvanised the squad as much, if not more than Arteta.

Are you as incessant with your questions in real life as you are on here? Poor guy

I'm more of an answers man in the real world. Would you ask an everton fan for advice on ANYTHING other that Everton? Exactly.

Tweesus wrote:Funnliy enough I asked the guy opposite me at work who is an Everton season ticket holder after posting this and he says that he's been brilliant. I guess he would say that being an Everton fan, but he thinks that Jag's return has galvanised the squad as much, if not more than Arteta.

well alright then.

Let's take:

Ferdinand, King, Jagielka, Upson

We'll be forced to Milner at CB by the second group game

Upson has been shite this season though. He has zero pace and at intrnational level, that's vital. Can't really think of any pacy centre backs that we could take instead though.

Tweesus wrote:But the DM role is also about positioning and knowing what to do when an attack is developing and as Milner hasn't played that role, he won't have the same experience as Barry.

Milner playing CM would be enough. not in the way Lampard or Gerrard have done more Like Hargreaves and Barry you need lots of energy to play this position right Barry falls short Milner will learn fast as a coach there is a gamble when you see a player come along who is young and shows potential you can screw up a real good thing also by doing nothing about it at all.

The middle two right now are the most important part of sealing a good ran at the world cup if you view Capello as a manager to be on the pragmatic side he has to close up that space. If you do not have the skill you need players that at least physically beat the opposition. If Hargreaves was fit him and Milner would make for a tough CM center just like Nobby Stiles and Alan ball did in 1966. Tough fast moving players that can find a team mate. Thinking England should play any other way we are fooling ourselves. So the DM becomes a useless piece of real estate a solid balanced middle gives our wide players much more opportunity where you can use flare to attack........ $hit you will not need Heskey anymore either, because you know if we cannot hold the ball up you have two facking runners covering a quick counter something you cannot do with Barry.

F365's world cup ladder (published today)

As always, this is rather depressing to compile and infuriating to read. Is he really going to take Downing? Yes, probably. And Wes Brown? More than likely. This is our best guess at the 23...



1 - Wayne Rooney (1)
If anyone doubted the chasm left by one player on a team that otherwise veers towards the decidedly average, they need only look at the last two weeks for compelling evidence. Over-reliance on one player is a mighty uncomfortable cross to carry.



2 - Ashley Cole (2)
While even the decidedly-average Wayne Bridge is no longer an option, our dependence on one of the world's finest full-backs grows. Ms Tweedy may no longer love him, but we reluctantly (with a little bit of sick in mouth) still do.



3 - John Terry (4)
'Quietly gone about his business for Chelsea this season' is what we wrote the last time this ladder was published. That may no longer be the case but a glance at a list of potential replacements is enough to make even the most moralistic of England fans baulk at the idea of his absence.



4 - Rio Ferdinand (
He's back, he's fit and he doesn't look particularly fragile. We wake up sweating at the idea of a naturally-slow Terry and a becoming-slower-by-the-way Ferdinand in tandem, but then we remember Matthew Upson and then sleep the sleep of the innocent.



5 - Frank Lampard (4)
Decent and disciplined rather than spectacular for Chelsea this season, but only fools doubt that he's a quality footballer. Fabio would be right to be worried about his anonymity against Inter Milan, but Lampard failing to perform in a struggling side is hardly a new phenomenon to the rest of us. The thought of him and Gareth Barry as the defensive shield against Spain and Argentina is frankly frightening.



6 - Steven Gerrard (5)
Thankfully finally coming into some form - too late for Liverpool but possibly just at the right time for England. There will be some who question his right to a place in the England starting XI, but there's a reason why the rest of the world would p*** themselves laughing if we did restrict him to the bench.



7 - James Milner (6)
Hardworking? Tick. Versatile? Tick. Absolutely knackered by the time the World Cup comes around? Hopefully not.



8 - Glen Johnson (10)
Like Cole on the other flank (but rather less dislikeable), you really don't know what you've got 'til it's gone and you realise you're stuck with Wes Brown. He could leave group-stage opponents quaking with his cavalier style. Let's just hope they don't cotton on to the problems they could cause if they ran at him.



9 - Gareth Barry (9)
We're now at the acceptance stage of the grieving process that our (well, Owen Hargreaves') World Cup dream is over. So it's Barry and Lampard doing all that midfield dirty work and we're fine with that. Gulp.



10 - Aaron Lennon (11)
It's slightly worrying that he appears to be still crocked, but we're looking on the bright side that he might be rested for the World Cup. If he's fit, he will be in England's starting XI in South Africa as the designated speed merchant.



11 - Emile Heskey (7)
It's getting harder and harder to justify his inclusion in England's starting line-up, but the best argument is a successful qualifying campaign that used Heskey as the team's fulcrum. The only problem could be if the fulcrum breaks.



12 - Robert Green (20)
England's No. 1 keeper my default. David James is too old, Joe Hart is too young, Green is somewhere in the middle and appears to have no crockage problems. This could potentially be England's weakest link.



13 - Jermain Defoe (13)
He has electric pace, ridiculously quick feet and a shot far more powerful than his build would suggest. But that's not enough in an England team not designed to accommodate players who offer nothing but goals. A fine weapon to have on the bench, mind.



14 - David James (14)
We believe that Fabio sees him as England's best goalkeeper, but doubts his ability to play two games a week for a month. That will probably rob him of a starting spot, but it won't rob him of a place in the squad.



15 - Joe Hart (15)
The loan move to Birmingham has been the making of a man and a goalkeeper, and he has barely put a foot (or finger) wrong all season. But this World Cup has come too soon for this to be anything other than a dress rehearsal for Hart.



16 - Matthew Upson (18)
Ours is not to question why but to accept that he is England's third-choice centre-half. Oh for the days when Steve Bruce couldn't even get a call-up...



17 - Wes Brown (16)
A Fabio favourite, the Italian clearly sees Brown as a safe pair of feet across the back four if there's an injury/suspension crisis afoot. We assume he will join us in prayer that his services are never actually required.



18 - Stewart Downing (22)
Another Fabio favourite, Downing has been decent for Villa without really pulling up any trees. Thankfully for him, he will not be detailed to pull up any trees in SA, just spend about 18 minutes on the left wing.



19 - Michael Carrick (28)
With acceptance that Hargreaves will not make the plane to SA comes admission that Carrick will be there. This is frightening us more than the return of V.



20 - Peter Crouch (19)
Let's face it, he's not very good. But he will be in the squad, he will come off the bench, and the rest of the team will aim the ball at his head. It might work.



21 - Joleon Lescott (21)
Finally found some form for Manchester City and then got crocked. But being a left-footer, and thus natural back-up for Ashley Cole, means he'll probably make the squad if fit. If not, expect former teammate Phil Jagielka to get the nod.



22 - Joe Cole (24)
We - and apparently Capello - remain unconvinced he's the player he was pre-crockage, but he has a guile and creativity that is sadly not evident in those blessed with endeavour or speed.



23 - Bobby Zamora (49)
With Heskey a risky (yet probably undroppable) option, a fifth striker seems far more likely than a second dedicated left-back. And Zamora is that Holy Grail of a big man who also scores goals. Who'd have thunk they existed?



24 - Adam Johnson (NE)
Pete Gill gets very excited about Johnson and bandies around the words 'proper player', which he has - to our knowledge - never used in relation to Stewart Downing. There's no doubt he will now be on Fabio's radar, but we suspect it may be a tad too late. Shame.



25 - Theo Walcott (26)
Twenty minutes against Barcelona do not a season make, Theo. Only has a chance if Lennon fails to recover.



26 - Leighton Baines (43)
Played against Egypt ahead of Stephen Warnock, thanks to the latter's mauling at the feet of Luis Antonio Valencia days before. Did himself little harm but we just can't see Capello taking a second left-back if Ashley Cole is fully fit - not with Upson, Lescott, Barry and Milner as viable alternatives.



27 - Paul Robinson (29)
In fine form but is probably relying on an injury to claim a place.



28 - Phil Jagielka (44)
The obvious utility back-up if currently-crocked Brown or Lescott fail to make the plane.



29 - Ryan Shawcross (46)
A place in England's last squad was an indication that Fabio has noted and admired the Stoke centre-half. But realistically, he should be looking towards Euro 2012 and hoping he's not another David 'fashionable for ten seconds' Wheater.



30 - Shaun Wright-Phillips (30)
Pushed out of the City team by Adam Johnson, who has earned himself a far better chance of being in SA in the three short months since January. If his speed of thought matched his speed of feet, he could be a contender.




THE REST


31 - Stephen Warnock (36)

32 - Carlton Cole (34)

33 - Tom Huddlestone (23)

34 - Gary Cahill (31)

35 - Darren Bent (32)

36 - Ashley Young (35)

37 - Gary Neville (RE)

38 - Lee Cattermole (39)

39 - Michael Dawson (NE)

40 - Phil Neville (50)

I read that. Mostly about right but they seem to have the strange idea Walcott won't even be in the squad despite him starting the last game when he was in worse form than he is now.

I've a feeling Joe Cole is probably going to miss out.

Yeh, I think Capello will take a pacy right winger as back up for Lennon - either SWP, Johnson or Walcott. I think SWP is out of the race really.

I still can't believe that we're taking Brown to a WC They make the point that Jags could more than adequately provide the utility role. Why the hell is Brown still an option?

I'd also question why we're taking Downing. He's dcent enough, but I don't really see what he'll offer us off the bench that others couldn't better offer + surely there must be a better option than having to take Carrick?

Yeah, 20 mins may not make a season, but they most certainly book a World Cup spot. Capello won't care about Walcott's shortcomings...if he can pull off similar 20 minute cameos against the tired defenses of top int'l teams this summer, England have a great chance of winning the World Cup.

Ashley Young at 36???

Joe Cole at 22???

Hmm.

If Ledders and Woody were fit, we'd have Rio, Terry, King, Woody to cover centre back position, which would frankly be t'riffic.

Instead we may have to call upon Upson and Lescott. Both of whom have been 'orrible this season, and should be behind Michael Dawson anyway.

This list serves to highlight we have a decentish first XI, but then there is a serious lack of real depth to the squad.

Baked bean brown, Carrick, Downing and Heskey. Dear God

Lennon & Milner are guarantees. Walcott and SWP are most likely i reckon Cole as well. Downing maybe overkill. Johnson is ahead of SWP for club now but he's got no England experience he'll only get called up if an injury IMO.