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Mexico Mexico ra ra ra. Hit the bar right now, pretty good match by the Mexicans. Should be a really tough challenge for our kids in the semis, in front of a very hostile (and huge!) crowd, something they're clearly not used to. Should be a valuable experience either way.
+23
Effenberg
Juligen
Chocolate Thunder
Aristoskank
Antarion
Hlebagone
Di Caniooooo!
Fey
stinger
fcb
Puro
A & K
Sheffield gunner
Allez les rouges
debaser
Xavier
Ricardo Jol
Stiftung Haeschentest
blutgraetsche
Glenarch of the Glen
Kroos
DD
Isco Benny
27 posters
U17's World Cup Mexico
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
Supports : Deutsche Fußballnationalmannschaft
Registration date : 2006-08-09
Mexico win the match 2-1 and will meet Germany in the semis. Deserved win against a physically stronger team, very good football by the Mexicans.
Should be a good match and tough challenge for our kids.
Semi final:
Uruguay vs. Brazil
Germany vs. Mexico
Should be a good match and tough challenge for our kids.
Semi final:
Uruguay vs. Brazil
Germany vs. Mexico
Kroos- Number of posts : 9049
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Noah und der Bale wrote:Well, Germany may well win this game on paper, but I'm claiming a moral victory to England:
A country with half the population and a much criticised youth policy were far from overawed by a German team displaying the much vaunted products of a well publicised 10year youth shake up, whose policy of uptake appears to be not only open to the residents of Europes second largest country, but also anyone who holidays there and fancies handing in their passport.
Oh, and the English blatantly all played with broken toes swell.
Well done lion cubs
thats a naive miscalculation, the experience of this u17 tournaments teach us that maybe 1-2 will become world class, the others normal league or 2nd league players (for example the best player from the 2007 world cup, i think it was an nigerian player is now in the 2nd german league) maybe i am wrong with the new wave of german talents, because they are better educated or not
some individual efforts show me that they very good with the ball, but not a typical german side, most goals (especially the openers, only built through individual efforts) and not every time we will have this combination of luck and skill
maybe they will never be good enough in decisions making, the most important thing in football
to overcome a götziller will be a hard task in the future, football brain at its best
theres also one important factor, will those kids get the chance to play bundesliga / epl football, me thinks the chances will be bigger for the german kids, when i look how young kids get treated in the epl
Last edited by Kroos on Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:08 am; edited 1 time in total
Kroos- Number of posts : 9049
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Jordan Glenderson wrote:I don't know if it's been publicly acknowledged, but it strikes me that the German youth setup takes their style and strategy from Manchester United.
i kinda agree, if i wouldnt have watched the 2nd half
but me thinks MANU has stolen the efficiency from former german teams^^
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Noah und der Bale wrote:In fairness to Walcott, he was also excellent at this level.
The surprise to me was that he went to Arsenal and seemed to become more reliant on his speed than footballing ability. The last club in England you would have expected that from. Walcott is still only 21, he has potential to develop his all-round game. Bit overly criticised on these boards if you ask me
he will never be world class, for this he lacks the fundamental elements of an footballer
hes like poldi for die Mannschaft, will be replaced as soon as a better OVERRALL FOOTBALLER joins the team
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Kroos wrote:since 1966 germany hasnt lost a single ko-stage game against england
ME THINKS I BET ON THIS
...
blutgraetsche wrote:Kroos, youth football is different and has its own rules. African teams dominate the youth WC for various reasons, for example, yet haven't won anything on the senior level.
Once the pubic hair has grown, you can of course bet on Germany to knock the islanders out though. That's a given.
Kroos, I have to apologise. Apparently, Germany has not lost a match against England in the knock-out stages since 1966 in all age groups, including the senior team and all youth teams...
Edit: They lost in 1982 (U21), but if you're pedantic, that was a match over two legs, not a 'real' knock-out match.
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It's not like we play you 4 times a year in knock out games, so keep your knickers on 
A little like how you have a shitty record against the Italians and Brazilians I would wager - sounds more impressive than it looks.
A little like how you have a shitty record against the Italians and Brazilians I would wager - sounds more impressive than it looks.
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blutgraetsche wrote:Kroos wrote:since 1966 germany hasnt lost a single ko-stage game against england
ME THINKS I BET ON THIS
...blutgraetsche wrote:Kroos, youth football is different and has its own rules. African teams dominate the youth WC for various reasons, for example, yet haven't won anything on the senior level.
Once the pubic hair has grown, you can of course bet on Germany to knock the islanders out though. That's a given.
Kroos, I have to apologise. Apparently, Germany has not lost a match against England in the knock-out stages since 1966 in all age groups, including the senior team and all youth teams...
Edit: They lost in 1982 (U21), but if you're pedantic, that was a match over two legs, not a 'real' knock-out match.
shame my betting days are numbered
would have been a save win
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If we had played you in 1998, 2000, 2002, or 2004 knock out games, I can guarantee that record would be shattered. That was around the time we were generally kicking your German arses for sport 
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Noah und der Bale wrote:If we had played you in 1998 no, 2000 you did in the group^^, 2002,no or 2004 yes knock out games, I can guarantee that record would be shattered. That was around the time we were generally kicking your German arses for sport
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Italians I give you, on the senior level that is (we've actually become their nemesis on the youth level in recent times), but Brazil still only played a single competitive match against us. Don't know about the youth teams, but Brazil have been traditionally strong on the youth level, too, while Germany neglected them for most of their existence.
I wasn't really impressed btw., just surprised. Didn't know that the three meeows beared such an old grudge against us on all levels. The excorcism of '66 is probably a very demanding and time consuming task...
I wasn't really impressed btw., just surprised. Didn't know that the three meeows beared such an old grudge against us on all levels. The excorcism of '66 is probably a very demanding and time consuming task...
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Noah und der Bale wrote:If we had played you in 1998, 2000, 2002, or 2004 knock out games, I can guarantee that record would be shattered. That was around the time we were generally kicking your German arses for sport
You mean the time when Germany won the last match in the good old Wembley (just to win the first match in the new one after it was finished after God knows how long...)? Heimspiel in Wembley!
Yes, the dark ages of German football, yet still enough for England!
mongrel hawk- Number of posts : 4757
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blutgraetsche wrote:Italians I give you, on the senior level that is (we've actually become their nemesis on the youth level in recent times), but Brazil still only played a single competitive match against us. Don't know about the youth teams, but Brazil have been traditionally strong on the youth level, too, while Germany neglected them for most of their existence.
I wasn't really impressed btw., just surprised. Didn't know that the three meeows beared such an old grudge against us on all levels. The excorcism of '66 is probably a very demanding and time consuming task...
you're forgetting the confed cup:
Brazil 4 - 0 Germany in 1999.
Brazil 3 - 2 Germany in 2005, in your own ground.
that is, 3 wins in 3 competitive matches. 9 goals scored against 2.
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Confed Cup? Get out of here!
But yes, Brazil's record against us is excellent if you count the friendlies (which includes the Confetti Cup). That 1999 team in particular was a joke, Ribbeck as coach and a second string team even by the very poor standards of those days. They got slaughtered by the USA for Christ's sake! Germany have lost twice to the US in their entire history, and both of those losses happended during that period.
But yes, Brazil's record against us is excellent if you count the friendlies (which includes the Confetti Cup). That 1999 team in particular was a joke, Ribbeck as coach and a second string team even by the very poor standards of those days. They got slaughtered by the USA for Christ's sake! Germany have lost twice to the US in their entire history, and both of those losses happended during that period.
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blutgraetsche wrote:Noah und der Bale wrote:If we had played you in 1998, 2000, 2002, or 2004 knock out games, I can guarantee that record would be shattered. That was around the time we were generally kicking your German arses for sport
You mean the time when Germany won the last match in the good old Wembley (just to win the first match in the new one after it was finished after God knows how long...)? Heimspiel in Wembley!
Yes, the dark ages of German football, yet still enough for England!
Nah, was thinking more about the victory at Euro 2000 followed up not so long later with THAT game in Munich, y'know, the BIGGEST defeat of any German team on home soil in History, the first home loss in World Cup qualifiers, the first hat trick of any foreign striker against Germany in the Fatherland, + a million other shattered records....
I only wish we had played you again in 2002 and especially 2004. Oh well, we only got one real shot at that poor German team sadly, and it was in a group stage and a qualifier.
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And then what? What would have changed? You know, for all the hype and 'satisfaction' that ultimately meaningless (as Germany still qualified and advanced a lot further in the actual tournament than England) 5-1 thrashing in München brought you, for all the money made of DVDs of the match and t-shirts and other memorabilia sold, the actual impact of the match has been totally negligible. I'd even say that it was counterproductive in the long run, as it was the birth place of the so called 'golden generation' and the hype surrounding them for years, and we all know how that turned out.
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blutgraetsche wrote:And then what? What would have changed? You know, for all the hype and 'satisfaction' that ultimately meaningless (as Germany still qualified and advanced a lot further in the actual tournament than England) 5-1 thrashing in München brought you, for all the money made of DVDs of the match and t-shirts and other memorabilia sold, the actual impact of the match has been totally negligible. I'd even say that it was counterproductive in the long run, as it was the birth place of the so called 'golden generation' and the hype surrounding them for years, and we all know how that turned out.
Yep, true. But the occassional blissful result does invoke a certain wave of heavenly joy that should never be sniffed at. The fact that is it crowbarred inbetween disappointments only makes it more lovely.
That 5-1 did indeed probably have a detrimental effect long term. Doesn't mean it wasn't bloody good fun at the time. And no more negligible than Germany's 2002 run to the final (having played no team inside the top 10 until the final) which was followed by a humiliating first round exit at 2004 as the cracks were papered over.
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Germany's run in 2002 was helped a lot by the relatively easy draw indeed. However, it needs to be said that it happened right after a Leverkusen side had reached the CL final, knocking out strong opposition on their way and fielding many of the key players of that national team. So it wasn't a total surprise to see that team do well.
The period between 1998-2004, refered to as the dark ages of German football, was a time when we were clearly lacking talent in many areas, the time when the reforms were initiated of which we reap the fruits today. But those teams still qualifying for the major competitions and doing well in 2002 only speaks for them, if anything. Not having that much to build on and making the best of it is a rare quality.
The period between 1998-2004, refered to as the dark ages of German football, was a time when we were clearly lacking talent in many areas, the time when the reforms were initiated of which we reap the fruits today. But those teams still qualifying for the major competitions and doing well in 2002 only speaks for them, if anything. Not having that much to build on and making the best of it is a rare quality.
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That's why you're the Man United of International football. Even with average teams you both still manage to succeed, mostly thanks of course to easy draws and refereeing decisions..... **wind up wind up wind up**
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If we had a tactician (and manipulator...) like SAF at the helm for two decades, we'd have 6 WC by now. At least!
I think that in the coming years, things will change as far as the traditional bogey teams of us are concerned, because our style has changed and will change even more. I expect Germany to beat every one of those bogey or semi-bogey teams in competitive matches. But I also expect new bogey teams to emerge, as every team has them.
A rather forgotten fact is that England actually used to be our bogey team prior to 1970.
I think that in the coming years, things will change as far as the traditional bogey teams of us are concerned, because our style has changed and will change even more. I expect Germany to beat every one of those bogey or semi-bogey teams in competitive matches. But I also expect new bogey teams to emerge, as every team has them.
A rather forgotten fact is that England actually used to be our bogey team prior to 1970.
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from welt online
apparently, only VERY FEW kids at this level make it later on
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Wer schafft den Übergang zu den Großen?
Vor 30 Jahren hatten wir schon mal Super-Bubis, die unter Trainer Dietrich Weise zunächst im eigenen Land Europameister und dann in Australien Weltmeister wurden. Doch von der damaligen U 20, von denen die Besten schon Bundesligaspiele bestritten hatten, hat nie einer ein WM- oder EM-Spiel bestritten.
Dortmunds aktueller Sportdirektor Michael Zorc hat es mit sieben Länderspielen noch am weitesten gebracht, Roland Wohlfarth (2 A-Spiele) sammelte immerhin fünf Meisterschaften mit den Bayern. Ansonsten platzten viele Träume der Helden von 1981. Der Sprung von der Jugend in den Seniorenbereich ist noch immer die anstrengendste Übung in der Karriere von Fußballern, da genügt schon ein Blick auf die jeweiligen deutschen A-Jugend-Meister. Nur jeder Zehnte wird Bundesligaspieler. Aber genug gemahnt, jetzt werdet erst mal schön Weltmeister
apparently, only VERY FEW kids at this level make it later on
-----------
Wer schafft den Übergang zu den Großen?
Vor 30 Jahren hatten wir schon mal Super-Bubis, die unter Trainer Dietrich Weise zunächst im eigenen Land Europameister und dann in Australien Weltmeister wurden. Doch von der damaligen U 20, von denen die Besten schon Bundesligaspiele bestritten hatten, hat nie einer ein WM- oder EM-Spiel bestritten.
Dortmunds aktueller Sportdirektor Michael Zorc hat es mit sieben Länderspielen noch am weitesten gebracht, Roland Wohlfarth (2 A-Spiele) sammelte immerhin fünf Meisterschaften mit den Bayern. Ansonsten platzten viele Träume der Helden von 1981. Der Sprung von der Jugend in den Seniorenbereich ist noch immer die anstrengendste Übung in der Karriere von Fußballern, da genügt schon ein Blick auf die jeweiligen deutschen A-Jugend-Meister. Nur jeder Zehnte wird Bundesligaspieler. Aber genug gemahnt, jetzt werdet erst mal schön Weltmeister
Fey- Number of posts : 35349
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blutgraetsche wrote:If we had a tactician (and manipulator...) like SAF at the helm for two decades, we'd have 6 WC by now. At least!
I think that in the coming years, things will change as far as the traditional bogey teams of us are concerned, because our style has changed and will change even more. I expect Germany to beat every one of those bogey or semi-bogey teams in competitive matches. But I also expect new bogey teams to emerge, as every team has them.
A rather forgotten fact is that England actually used to be our bogey team prior to 1970.
Very much doubt that. On the other hand Germany has many bogey teams (Brazil, Holland, Spain, Italy, Bulgaria, ex-Yugoslavian states, Czech rep) So in time im pretty sure you will win from one.
blutgraetsche- Number of posts : 23328
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Completely different times, different structures, different level of professionalism. Apples and oranges, as can be expected from WELT.
That said, it's still true that not many of these youngters will make it as professional footballers or even become international / world class players. From this crop, Yesil, Can, Weiser look very promising and have everything to become excellent senior players, in addition to the defenders like Yalcin and Günter. The fullbacks looked good also, a position that has become a traditional weak spot in the senior team. That alone should increase their chances in the long run, too.
But time will tell. If these kids really manage to win the WC, their profile will increase considerably, helping their careers quite a bit. They'd be the first German team of this age group to pull that off.
That said, it's still true that not many of these youngters will make it as professional footballers or even become international / world class players. From this crop, Yesil, Can, Weiser look very promising and have everything to become excellent senior players, in addition to the defenders like Yalcin and Günter. The fullbacks looked good also, a position that has become a traditional weak spot in the senior team. That alone should increase their chances in the long run, too.
But time will tell. If these kids really manage to win the WC, their profile will increase considerably, helping their careers quite a bit. They'd be the first German team of this age group to pull that off.
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Fey wrote:
Very much doubt that. On the other hand Germany has many bogey teams (Brazil, Holland, Spain, Italy, Bulgaria, ex-Yugoslavian states, Czech rep) So in time im pretty sure you will win from one.
There's only one true bogey team in that list and you know it. The cheek.
You'll see Fey, you'll see and drink a lot of Magenbitter with your Bitterballen.
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Blut, the hype, where is it all based on?
It's just believe with you rather then facts! You need to be more Scully and less Mulder. The fact that you lot are more succesful on youth-level these days all has to with the foreign background of those players, there are more mature physically at an earlier age, same with Holland. Not that the nationalakademie has a vorsprung durch technik, all of a sudden.
But that's too rational! And I really dont understand why you and your companions all look so forward to the future, if there is one country that has a bleak future it's Germany! In 35 years England will be the biggest country in the EU with France, Germany is going from 1st to 5th according to EU-stats. And considering you don't dominate football now, imagine then!!
It's just believe with you rather then facts! You need to be more Scully and less Mulder. The fact that you lot are more succesful on youth-level these days all has to with the foreign background of those players, there are more mature physically at an earlier age, same with Holland. Not that the nationalakademie has a vorsprung durch technik, all of a sudden.
But that's too rational! And I really dont understand why you and your companions all look so forward to the future, if there is one country that has a bleak future it's Germany! In 35 years England will be the biggest country in the EU with France, Germany is going from 1st to 5th according to EU-stats. And considering you don't dominate football now, imagine then!!
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Easy tiger, what hype?. Players of a Turkish background are not more 'mature physically at an early age' than your average Aryan. That's nonsense. That argument would have some merit if most of our migrant players were from an African background, but even then it would be rather questionable (as age is actually declared correctly over here).
And it's not the physically more imposing players that are standing out, those will very likely have rather insignificant careers indeed once their physical advantage is gone, but the skillful and intelligent ones, players who have the raw tools to make it later on, things that can't be teached to them anymore at this age.
And it's not just the future, the present gives us tons of reasons to be optimistic about the German NT. And why shouldn't we be?
Demographic forecasts of such a long timespan are humbug anyway, as nobody knows what changes the future brings. Birth rates across Europe are way too low, hardly a Germany only phenomenon, but European societies, unlike Japan, for example, will react in time, even if it means that Europe will become a lot more like the US today. Their economies will force them to, the real force behind everything.
And it's not the physically more imposing players that are standing out, those will very likely have rather insignificant careers indeed once their physical advantage is gone, but the skillful and intelligent ones, players who have the raw tools to make it later on, things that can't be teached to them anymore at this age.
And it's not just the future, the present gives us tons of reasons to be optimistic about the German NT. And why shouldn't we be?
Demographic forecasts of such a long timespan are humbug anyway, as nobody knows what changes the future brings. Birth rates across Europe are way too low, hardly a Germany only phenomenon, but European societies, unlike Japan, for example, will react in time, even if it means that Europe will become a lot more like the US today. Their economies will force them to, the real force behind everything.
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Nice piece on top scorer Souleymane Coulibaly (Ivory Coast, German article):
http://www.spox.com/de/sport/fussball/international/1106/Artikel/souleymane-coulibaly-elfenbeinkueste-didier-drogba.html
Looks like a really nice and down to earth kid. Hope he'll make it, he looked absolutely brilliant in this tournament.
http://www.spox.com/de/sport/fussball/international/1106/Artikel/souleymane-coulibaly-elfenbeinkueste-didier-drogba.html
Looks like a really nice and down to earth kid. Hope he'll make it, he looked absolutely brilliant in this tournament.
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http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/deutsche-u-im-wm-halbfinale-der-junge-mit-der-traumquote-1.1116514
let the hype begin
let the hype begin
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Leverkusen had extended Yesil's contract prior to the WC, a smart move. The kid has everything to become a class striker, hope Robin Dutt can nurture his talent and integrate him in the first team in the coming years. Dutt's record with young players is pretty good, so there is reason to be optimistic. The WC has clearly helped to raise the kid's profile. If the team really manages to win the title, all of them will benefit from it.
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ARD are going to show the semis live (Germany vs. Mexico, tomorrow night at 1 o'clock local time). What a bunch of gloryhunting c**ts! Eurosport showed all matches so far, and now that Germany is doing well, the c**ts decide to jump on the bandwagon. You really have to wonder why we have to pay for the fuckers.
Since I don't have Eurosport unfortunately (and watched streams so far), it's good news for me personally. Would still boycott them if I had the choice though. Eurosport commentators usually are a lot better, too.
Since I don't have Eurosport unfortunately (and watched streams so far), it's good news for me personally. Would still boycott them if I had the choice though. Eurosport commentators usually are a lot better, too.
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